Texas Republicans Take Aim At Climate Change -- In Textbooks

[Lord of Planar]

Maybe you can find a clean paper instead of the one your blogger buddy may have put viruses in.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Read it.

Nope.

Find a clean version of the paper, or the paper title so I can find it.

I will not download one my virus checker says may have been infected.

You most certainly are not using a secure site....

 

[Lord of Planar]

When I use the title name, I only get the one site that says it's a security risk. When I use the DOI number associated with it I found, I get this:



Maybe the paper was retracted, or never was a paper and is a farce.

Fine a clean copy please.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Then don’t read it. Continue to make remarks with no merit. It’s up to you. You have now been given the opportunity. Download it on an iPad with Safari. That’s how I did it with no warning and no problems.

My remarks do have merit. The summary you gave uses the same claim I shot down before regarding rural stations. If there is more long term records it speaks of, find a copy of the paper that is not a security risk.

 

[watsup]

My remarks do have merit. The summary you gave uses the same claim I shot down before regarding rural stations. If there is more long term records it speaks of, find a copy of the paper that is not a security risk.

Again, download it on an iPad with Safari. Until you do, you have “shot down” nothing. Simply ignoring research does not make it go away.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Again, download it on an iPad with Safari. Until you do, you have “shot down” nothing. Simply ignoring research does not make it go away.

Sorry. I do not have toys like that.

I'm sorry that you think it is legitimate when the only site the text seems to be available on, causes a security alert.

 

[longview]

My remarks do have merit. The summary you gave uses the same claim I shot down before regarding rural stations. If there is more long term records it speaks of, find a copy of the paper that is not a security risk.

Part of the problem of using the night glow as a metric is that it may not work.
Assessment of Urban Versus Rural In Situ Surface Temperatures in the Contiguous United States: No Difference Found
We know the urban heat island effect is real, yet the studies using night-lights data found no difference. To me this says they are not using the correct metric.

 

[Threegoofs]

Dose it talk about how they correct the rural station readings?

Weird how you know it doesn’t address this, yet don’t seem to have read it.

Oh, wait. Not weird. Just the usual denial.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Weird how you know it doesn’t address this, yet don’t seem to have read it.

Oh, wait. Not weird. Just the usual denial.

LOL...

All the studies I have seen regarding the UHIE that mention rural stations, just say the trends are similar.

Stop trying to bullshit your way through this.

You have nothing.

 

[watsup]

LOL...

All the studies I have seen regarding the UHIE that mention rural stations, just say the trends are similar.

Stop trying to bullshit your way through this.

You have nothing.

What trends are similar? What studies? Can you list one?

 

[Lord of Planar]

What trends are similar? What studies? Can you list one?

Just stop. You have nothing. Past linked papers that I am not wasting my time looking up for the likes of you.

 

[watsup]

Just stop. You have nothing. Past linked papers that I am not wasting my time looking up for the likes of you.

Exactly the excuses that I was expecting. So predictable!

 

[Lord of Planar]

Exactly the excuses that I was expecting. So predictable!

Not an excuse. Reality. You are nothing but a waste of people's time. If you have something relevant, I will most certainly entertain it. but you don't even understand science enough to discuss any of it.

 

[Threegoofs]

LOL...

All the studies I have seen regarding the UHIE that mention rural stations, just say the trends are similar.

Stop trying to bullshit your way through this.

You have nothing.

I can actually read the paper.

LOL

This would be total humiliation for you, but you are too far on the left side of DK to understand why.

 

[Glitch]

Part of the problem of using the night glow as a metric is that it may not work.
Assessment of Urban Versus Rural In Situ Surface Temperatures in the Contiguous United States: No Difference Found
We know the urban heat island effect is real, yet the studies using night-lights data found no difference. To me this says they are not using the correct metric.

Or it could be that the instruments are not positioned to record the phenomena. The instrument packaged used by NOAA in Anchorage, for example, is located between two run-ways at the Ted Stevens International Airport, which sits on a peninsula with Cook Inlet on three of the four sides. It is not anywhere near downtown or the city center, and does not record actual city temperatures or precipitation. There can be as much of 10" difference in snowfall and as much as 10°F difference in temperature between downtown, hillside, and the airport.

So it is questionable whether they are able to determine if an urban heat island exists in Anchorage. I do not live in a town or city, but I do live about 20 miles due north of Anchorage as the crow flies. During both my Winter and Summer temperatures are ~5°F warmer than Anchorage, and I get between 6" to 10" less snow than Anchorage normally gets and slightly less precipitation during the Summer.

That could be the result of a heat island, or it could simply mean Anchorage is closer to the Chugach Mountain range than I am and the mountain range is effecting Anchorage's weather. It is impossible to say with only one NOAA instrument package that is located at the very western edge of Anchorage, away from the mountains.

It is pretty obvious that NOAA is not interested in determining whether urban heat islands exist, or they would be doing more to track the phenomena.

 

[Lord of Planar]

I can actually read the paper.

LOL

This would be total humiliation for you, but you are too far on the left side of DK to understand why.

D-K is clearly your department.

Explain to me then, how do they adjust the observed readings and make the record in an accurate manner?

You only think you understand it...

 

[Lord of Planar]

Part of the problem of using the night glow as a metric is that it may not work.
Assessment of Urban Versus Rural In Situ Surface Temperatures in the Contiguous United States: No Difference Found
We know the urban heat island effect is real, yet the studies using night-lights data found no difference. To me this says they are not using the correct metric.

I'll bet they have no desire to find the actual difference. I will contend the researchers would no longer be eligible for activist grants if they found an accurate means of correcting for the UHIE.

Everything I have read leads me to believe they adjust the global temperatures to what their models claim they should be.

 

[watsup]

Not an excuse. Reality. You are nothing but a waste of people's time. If you have something relevant, I will most certainly entertain it. but you don't even understand science enough to discuss any of it.

See post #262.

 

[Lord of Planar]

See post #262.

You have nothing, so why are you pretending to?

 

[longview]

I'll bet they have no desire to find the actual difference. I will contend the researchers would no longer be eligible for activist grants if they found an accurate means of correcting for the UHIE.

Everything I have read leads me to believe they adjust the global temperatures to what their models claim they should be.

Because only warming that cannot be attributed to other causes can be attributed to added CO2, any portion of the observed warming that could be attributed to the UHI effect, would have to be subtracted from the warming attributed to CO2!

 

[Lord of Planar]

Because only warming that cannot be attributed to other causes can be attributed to added CO2, any portion of the observed warming that could be attributed to the UHI effect, would have to be subtracted from the warming attributed to CO2!

Yep.

The Urban Heat Island Effect is huge. The error range has to be huge as well, for any numbers they can realize. To narrow it down to usable tenths of a degree is impossible, and anyone thinking it is possible, is delusional.

 

[longview]

Yep.

The Urban Heat Island Effect is huge. The error range has to be huge as well, for any numbers they can realize. To narrow it down to usable tenths of a degree is impossible, and anyone thinking it is possible, is delusional.

About the only safe thing we could say is that the actual average global temperature would be somewhere between the recorded Land based temperature and the recorded sea surface temperature.

 

[watsup]

That doesn't address what I am saying.

What you are saying is that there has not been enough research to offset UHI in determining global warming. Perhaps some of these would help:

Jones PD., Groisman PYa, Coughlan M, Plummer N, Wang W-C, et al. Assessment of urbanization effects in time series of surface air temperature over land. Nature 1990, 347:169–172. DOI:10.1038/347169a0.

Peterson TC. Assessment of urban versus rural in situ surface temperatures in the contigu-
ous United States. J Clim 2003, 16:2941–2959. DOI:10.1175/1520-0442 (2003)016<2941:AOUVRI>2.0.CO;2.

Brandsma T, Ko ̈nnen, GP, Wessels HRA. Empirical estimation of the effect of urban heat advection on the temperature series of De Bilt (The Netherlands). Int J Climatol 2003, 23:829–845. DOI: 10.1002/joc.902.

Jones PD, Lister DH, Li Q. Urbanization effects in large-scale temperature records, with an empha- sis on China. J Geophys Res 2008, 11316122. DOI:10.1029/2008JD009916.

LiQ,ZhangH,LiuX,HuangJ.Urbanheatislandeffect on annual mean temperature during the last 50 years in China. Theor Appl Climatol 2004, 79:165–174. DOI:10.1007/s00704-004-0065-4.

RenG,ZhouY,ChuZ,ZhouJ,ZhangA,etal.Urban- ization effects on observed surface air temperature trends in North China. J Clim 2008, 21:1333–1348. DOI:10.1175/2007JCLI1348.1.

Karl TR, Diaz HF, Kukla G. Urbanization: its detec- tion and effect in the United States climate record. J Clim 1988, 1:1099–1123. DOI: 10.1175/1520-0442 (1988)001<1099:UIDAEI>2.0.CO;2.

I have more when you are through reading those.

 

[Lord of Planar]

What you are saying is that there has not been enough research to offset UHI in determining global warming. Perhaps some of these would help:

Jones PD., Groisman PYa, Coughlan M, Plummer N, Wang W-C, et al. Assessment of urbanization effects in time series of surface air temperature over land. Nature 1990, 347:169–172. DOI:10.1038/347169a0.

Peterson TC. Assessment of urban versus rural in situ surface temperatures in the contigu-
ous United States. J Clim 2003, 16:2941–2959. DOI:10.1175/1520-0442 (2003)016<2941:AOUVRI>2.0.CO;2.

Brandsma T, Ko ̈nnen, GP, Wessels HRA. Empirical estimation of the effect of urban heat advection on the temperature series of De Bilt (The Netherlands). Int J Climatol 2003, 23:829–845. DOI: 10.1002/joc.902.

Jones PD, Lister DH, Li Q. Urbanization effects in large-scale temperature records, with an empha- sis on China. J Geophys Res 2008, 11316122. DOI:10.1029/2008JD009916.

LiQ,ZhangH,LiuX,HuangJ.Urbanheatislandeffect on annual mean temperature during the last 50 years in China. Theor Appl Climatol 2004, 79:165–174. DOI:10.1007/s00704-004-0065-4.

RenG,ZhouY,ChuZ,ZhouJ,ZhangA,etal.Urban- ization effects on observed surface air temperature trends in North China. J Clim 2008, 21:1333–1348. DOI:10.1175/2007JCLI1348.1.

Karl TR, Diaz HF, Kukla G. Urbanization: its detec- tion and effect in the United States climate record. J Clim 1988, 1:1099–1123. DOI: 10.1175/1520-0442 (1988)001<1099:UIDAEI>2.0.CO;2.

I have more when you are through reading those.

Give me a quote that matters, else you are wasting both out times.

I will be exceptionally surprised if you find something that is actually relevant.

Can you even imagine would take to adjust the land use changes out of the observed reading? Don't you see how impossible of a task it is?

 

[watsup]

Give me a quote that matters, else you are wasting both out times.

I will be exceptionally surprised if you find something that is actually relevant.

Can you even imagine would take to adjust the land use changes out of the observed reading? Don't you see how impossible of a task it is?

Not saying that I didn’t expect excuses and the same old talking points from you instead of looking at the papers and articles. It is what we always expect from you.