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Why should I have to make up for at $143M cut in California?
We have greater priorities than education, we have optional wars for hegemony to conduct and the wealthy need bigger tax cuts. And educating people tends to make them less conducive to fighting wars for hegemony and giving bigger tax cuts to the wealthy, so all is as it should be. No need to rock the boat!
:roll: still seeking to divert into this only and one point?
And doesn't carry over for the reasons I mentioned. The priority for an educational system is the students, not the employees.
for individuals absolutely; which is why you use large data sets to average filter out outliers in order to allow you to determine trends.
I didn't skip over it at all. In fact, I specifically stated in response to your question:
that:
Perhaps you can defend a system which is set up to protect bad and mediocre teachers as superior? What prioritization does that flow from?
The primary purpose of the current educational system is to dumbdown the requirements (and ultimately the student) to the lowest common denominator so that self-esteem can be maintained. It is not to make us competitive with the graduates in other countries for the good of the nation. The defenders of the status quo will prove that to you.
The primary purpose of the current educational system is to dumbdown the requirements (and ultimately the student) to the lowest common denominator so that self-esteem can be maintained. It is not to make us competitive with the graduates in other countries for the good of the nation. The defenders of the status quo will prove that to you.
I think this is more a government status quo. Not something teachers want.
What teachers want is abundantly clear in this thread, and it has nothing to do with excelling at their jobs in most cases, sans a few.
j-mac
What teachers want is abundantly clear in this thread, and it has nothing to do with excelling at their jobs in most cases, sans a few.
j-mac
Well, that was helpful j. Not.
:coffeepap
I don't come in here to be helpful to your argument Joe. I come in here to offer the counter opinion in many cases to liberal destructive thought, and support of failed policies that if libs had their way we'd be done as the country I knew, loved, served, and grew up in, based on their own guilt of being born American. :coffeepap:
j-mac
By not helpful, I clearly mean there was no counter point. Nor is the silliness you present here.
That is what is known as a 'bitch slap' and to pretty much anyone else, the appropriate response would have been 'touche...well played sir!' However...you have to understand who you are talking to. And really...when you DO understand who you are trying to have a debate with you really cant be shocked at the responses. There are only so many prerecorded responses in that memory bank.You are just all over the map. First you claim 10 states have outlawed teacher's unions. Then when proven wrong due to the clear inability to comprehend your sources you post a link using decade old data and once again fail to comprehend what you are reading.
First, let's stay up to date with our data and not pick and choose years where we don't have all of the information. Secondly, do you know the percentile those states are in terms of taking the SAT exams?
South Carolina: 13
North Carolina: 16
Georgia: 5
Texas: 20
Virginia: 12
These states take the SATs at a much higher rate than other states. People who take the SATs tend towards the top of the educational system. States like Wisconsin who up until this year had one of the strongest public unions in the nation only have a participation rate of 5% with the SATs. They are 44th in the nation. Missouri also scores at the top percentile in exam scores, where our fearless Layla_Z teaches and has no union and is underpaid. You can't look at that number though because only 5% of the students actually take the exams.
These numbers mean absolutely nothing without looking at the participation rates, demographics and socio-economic conditions. In fact, The College Board (where your stats comes from) tells you so. Otherwise a state like Maine (95% participation) would be rated at the bottom in terms of education when it is not the case at all. You really have a lot of learning to do. You haven't made a single intelligent argument yet. Everything you've posted thus far has been a failure to comprehend what you have read or a bait and switch.. just like this argument.
Boo Radley: Thirty-something percent of public school teachers are in a union!!!11!!
> No Boo, your figure includes public as well as private employees from all different professions, not just teachers.
Boo Radley: Well, 10 states outlaw teacher's unions!!111!!
> No Boo, no state outlaws teacher's unions. They have a right to form a union. Some states haven't made collectively bargaining a requirement though.
Boo Radley: States that don't have collective bargaining have the lowest test scores and therefore the lowest quality education!!!!11!!
> No Boo, they take the exams at a much higher rate thus the numbers are skewed from the inclusion of students in much lower percentiles.
This entire thread has been nothing short of an exercise in futility with you. Basic reading comprehension and fundamental understanding of logic and recognizing fallacies is completely lost on you.
For your edification, here are the actual numbers for you to look at.
http://professionals.collegeboard.com/profdownload/SAT_Trends_Report_9_12_2011.pdf
I'm really posting this for other people, I know you don't have the intelligence to comprehend the information.
Back to sleep with you lib! Ha, ha!
j-mac
That is what is known as a 'bitch slap' and to pretty much anyone else, the appropriate response would have been 'touche...well played sir!' However...you have to understand who you are talking to. And really...when you DO understand who you are trying to have a debate with you really cant be shocked at the responses. There are only so many prerecorded responses in that memory bank.
Meaning you still have nothing to offer.
Whats that Sheriff Woody? Bo was kidnapped by the evil potato head???Yes, I do try to keep you and him on point. Going off topic is really all he has. That's so unfair of me.
Results on the standardized test? On writing samples? math samples? reading inventories? What? So far, the bureaucrats seem focused only on standardized test results, the poorest way of measuring student progress we have.
And then, there are the factors outside of the control of the school. Are all the best teachers in schools that have the most involved parents?
Actually, teaching a child of educated parents to read is very easy. Often, they can read before the school even starts formal instruction. Children of inner city single moms, children of migrant farm workers, children of illegal aliens, children with learning disabilities all pose more of a problem.
An excellent teacher is one that can take children I've described and teach them to read by the end of second grade or so. That's too late for them to perform on the standardized test, even if they wanted to perform on the standardized test.
The primary purpose of the current educational system is to dumbdown the requirements (and ultimately the student) to the lowest common denominator so that self-esteem can be maintained. It is not to make us competitive with the graduates in other countries for the good of the nation. The defenders of the status quo will prove that to you.
:shrug: I'm graded on my leadership regardless of whether or not the people I am leading have Home Issues that distract them.
No, but it isn't too late for that student to score significantly better than they did at the end of First Grade. Which is why rather than Student Performance (direct) you can measure teachers effectiveness with aggregate Student Improvement averaged. So, for example, if the students of Ronald McDonald Middle School typically advance 0.3 of a school year from one year to another, and are split evenly between two teachers in 7th Grade; and Teacher Smith's 7th Grade students consistently average over three years an advancement of 0.1 while Teacher Jones' 7th Grade students consistently average over three years an advancement of 0.5; then Teacher Jones is performing above the average, while Teacher Smith is performing below the average.
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