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Stop attacks on democracy.

J

Joseph57

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I think the original post was lost ... repost:

A growing list of responsible REPUBLICANS are telling the president to stop making attacks on election integrity: Rep Adam Kinzinger, R-Ill, Texas GOP Rep Will Hurd, Rep Paul Michell, Maryland gov Larry Hogan, Sen. Jeff Flake, Denver Riggleman (R-Va.), Gov. Tom Ridge (R) ... Who else should be added to the list?
 
All of them.

But people who saw Trump for what he is have been saying that for five years.

And for most of that time, Republicans have stood by and watched Trump take power away from Congress with their tacit approval.
 
The question is whether the Trumpists and the normal conservatives will be able to get along in the future.
 
Dems haven't been messaging or doing much about anything while they get branded by the Reps to look as bad as possible. It's quite predictable they lost House seats and can't get a safe majority in the Senate and continue to lose state legs. They continue to get Swift-boated as did Kerry in the 2004 election, finding it beneath them to defend themselves against unjustified attacks. So, they lose. You're supposed to defend yourself against any and all attacks, most especially in politics, and put on an attacking offense yourself or, as is proved election after election, lose. It appears Biden will "win". But look how awful a president there had to be for the Dems to win the presidency. Dems are inherently weak.
 
TomFitz said:
All of them.

But people who saw Trump for what he is have been saying that for five years.

And for most of that time, Republicans have stood by and watched Trump take power away from Congress with their tacit approval.
Click to expand...
True, but we need to get past that and move forward as a country. That means not only forgiveness but cooperation and compromise ... and it means showing respect for actions worth praise.
 
tacomancer said:
The question is whether the Trumpists and the normal conservatives will be able to get along in the future.
Click to expand...
I think that once they stop letting Trump lead them by the nose they will realize they don't have that much in common. I think that is why there was no new Republican platform in 2020.
 
Joseph57 said:
I think that once they stop letting Trump lead them by the nose they will realize they don't have that much in common. I think that is why there was no new Republican platform in 2020.
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2020, do you mean 2024?
 
bluesmoke said:
Dems haven't been messaging or doing much about anything while they get branded by the Reps to look as bad as possible. It's quite predictable they lost House seats and can't get a safe majority in the Senate and continue to lose state legs. They continue to get Swift-boated as did Kerry in the 2004 election, finding it beneath them to defend themselves against unjustified attacks. So, they lose. You're supposed to defend yourself against any and all attacks, most especially in politics, and put on an attacking offense yourself or, as is proved election after election, lose. It appears Biden will "win". But look how awful a president there had to be for the Dems to win the presidency. Dems are inherently weak.
Click to expand...
I don't know about that ... I support Dems in part because i value personal integrity. That is why I can't support Trump. When people show maturity and an ability to work with difficult people I take note. That is why I liked Obama as a President, but I've supported Republican presidents too - like Bush (either - take your pick).
 
Joseph57 said:
True, but we need to get past that and move forward as a country. That means not only forgiveness but cooperation and compromise ... and it means showing respect for actions worth praise.
Click to expand...


And Reps will accept any Dem compromise that does not require the same from them. And that's they way it's been. The Dems begin at compromise, then give in from there. The Reps begin at gimme everything, and give very little from there. Bush2 did so wonderfully well as TX gov. Even the Dems praised him for his willingness to work with them. Yeah. As long as the Dems did what he wanted them to do.
 
Joseph57 said:
I don't know about that ... I support Dems in part because i value personal integrity. That is why I can't support Trump. When people show maturity and an ability to work with difficult people I take note. That is why I liked Obama as a President, but I've supported Republican presidents too - like Bush (either - take your pick).
Click to expand...
Right now I support Gov DeWine (not in all of his policies, obvious) because he had a very balanced approach to handling COVID. My only objection is that he didn't mandate masks quickly enough.

But, he acted like an adult.
 
Joseph57 said:
I don't know about that ... I support Dems in part because i value personal integrity. That is why I can't support Trump. When people show maturity and an ability to work with difficult people I take note. That is why I liked Obama as a President, but I've supported Republican presidents too - like Bush (either - take your pick).
Click to expand...


What is it specifically you don't know about or think not so that I said?
 
I think progress will be made only when Democrats AND Republicans support democracy and democratic values. I mean progress in the most basic way, not progressive as in policies. We, as a country, need the cooperation of patriotic Republicans who value things like honor, common sense, and the general welfare. We can agree on common goals like a strong economy, good jobs, a strong national infrastructure, a clean environment, fair treatment and safe streets (for everyone), even if we need to compromise on the methods to accomplish them.

The problem is the Republican party doesn't represent those values or those priorities. They need to explicitly and forcefully reject those elements that don't represent those values, including refusing to seat those who compromise them. They know who they are. But, they won't. Mitch McConnell is not a good American. He's not an honorable leader. He's not interested in cooperation or compromise, or American values. As long as the party is led by such men, and pursues such approaches our country will continue to stagnate and weaken. We all know where the problems lie, but some just refuse to acknowledge it.
 
NWRatCon said:
I think progress will be made only when Democrats AND Republicans support democracy and democratic values. I mean progress in the most basic way, not progressive as in policies. We, as a country, need the cooperation of patriotic Republicans who value things like honor, common sense, and the general welfare. We can agree on common goals like a strong economy, good jobs, a strong national infrastructure, a clean environment, fair treatment and safe streets (for everyone), even if we need to compromise on the methods to accomplish them.

The problem is the Republican party doesn't represent those values or those priorities. They need to explicitly and forcefully reject those elements that don't represent those values, including refusing to seat those who compromise them. They know who they are. But, they won't. Mitch McConnell is not a good American. He's not an honorable leader. He's not interested in cooperation or compromise, or American values. As long as the party is led by such men, and pursues such approaches our country will continue to stagnate and weaken. We all know where the problems lie, but some just refuse to acknowledge it.
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...but even a man like Mitch can make a good decision... it isn't as one-sided as all that ... the Dems have as many problems as the Republicans and, without Trump at the head, I'm hoping the Republicans will reform.
 
Joseph57 said:
...but even a man like Mitch can make a good decision... it isn't as one-sided as all that ... the Dems have as many problems as the Republicans and, without Trump at the head, I'm hoping the Republicans will reform.
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I wish they had an incentive to.
 
NWRatCon said:
I wish they had an incentive to.
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They do have an incentive to reform. They just lost an election. They need to find a platform other than "whatever Trump wants" if they want to win in 2024....
 
Joseph57 said:
They do have an incentive to reform. They just lost an election. They need to find a platform other than "whatever Trump wants" if they want to win in 2024....
Click to expand...
That rank capitulation to Trumpism would, I hope, be the nadir of the party, but I have my doubts.
 
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