Stone Mountain –Confederate sculpture – Remove it-Yes-No?

[The Resister]

Don't waste your time, Paperview. Those folks are just trying to defend the indefensible while playing coy.

What would their response be if Obama was added to Stone Mountain, Rushmore or in front of their local courthouse? Care to guess?

That is an absolutely dishonest deflection. There are statues of the most liberal blacks ever known in our courthouses and capitols. You've had stamps commemorating black people. And I've already been into all the streets and roads that had white people's names taken down to make way for black people. The government even announced recently that they will be taking the faces of white people off the currency.

Show us the links where there have been mass protests bringing people from all over the U.S. to protest a single one. You'd be lucky if you could point to a single protest against any of that involving more than 50 white people.

You are dabbling in dishonesty and deflection.

 

[Parrish]

Classic dishonesty. Taney didn't write the laws. His job was to interpret the statutes. Virtually every state had legislation wherein one had to be white and Christian in order to hold public office, vote, and / or be a state citizen. The United States Code only allowed whites to be citizens. The Preamble to the Constitution only allowed for the posterity of the founding fathers to be citizens... not to mention all the other pages Taney quoted that you have never read.

Taney was not a legislator nor a political hack. He interpreted the law as it was on the books. Without overstepping his authority as the current courts do, Taney interpreted the law in accordance with the intent AND standing precedents. It's too bad most people won't read. NO, you have offered NO PROOF that Taney was a racist.

Poor, Rog. He was so misunderstood.

 

[Parrish]

That is an absolutely dishonest deflection. There are statues of the most liberal blacks ever known in our courthouses and capitols. You've had stamps commemorating black people. And I've already been into all the streets and roads that had white people's names taken down to make way for black people. The government even announced recently that they will be taking the faces of white people off the currency.

Show us the links where there have been mass protests bringing people from all over the U.S. to protest a single one. You'd be lucky if you could point to a single protest against any of that involving more than 50 white people.




You are dabbling in dishonesty and deflection.

I stand by my post. Lots of people protested against Blacks having anything named after the.No links needed.

 

[Fletch]

You see? The poster is all but admitting he is a troll with nothing valuable to contribute.

What is clear to all is the breadth of your historical knowledge could fit inside a mini-sized Dixie cup.

Right. Stop appealing to a crowd that doesn't exist and answer the question. Whats your point?

 

[slick]

'Eight of the first nine presidential races were won by a Virginian - which was the most populous state.' Let's see:

Virginia was not the most populous state in all the 1st 9 presidential elections. 'NY was #1 early on in Monroe's 1st term

"Also during Madison's victory NY was the #1 state in population. So in 3 of the 1st 9 elections Virginia was not the most popular
state. BTW Pennsylvania & Virginia in 2 of the races from 1812-1820 has the same electoral vote total as Virginia" so electing
the president they essentially were vying for #2 behind NY & had the same import.

 

[PIPEWRENCH]

Not to America they weren't...

You are only a traitor if you lose the war.

 

[Paperview]

'Eight of the first nine presidential races were won by a Virginian - which was the most populous state.' Let's see:

Virginia was not the most populous state in all the 1st 9 presidential elections. 'NY was #1 early on in Monroe's 1st term

Virginians won all those early elections, bub. And deny the census count included 3/5ths of slaves who had no representation at your peril.

 

[slick]

Virginians won all those early elections, bub. And deny the census count included 3/5ths of slaves who had no representation at your peril.

Dot your I's & cross your T's unless you yearn to be contradicted. NY had more electors in 3 of the 1st 9 elections &
Pennsylvania was just as important in electing the President than Virginia in those same elections. If the country
happened to follow the state of Virginia it was because the entire country preferred the candidate Virginia happened to
follow, not because it was the most populus state because in some of the elections it wasn't even close!

 

[Paperview]

Dot your I's & cross your T's unless you yearn to be contradicted. NY had more electors in 3 of the 1st 9 elections &
Pennsylvania was just as important in electing the President than Virginia in those same elections. If the country
happened to follow the state of Virginia it was because the entire country preferred the candidate Virginia happened to
follow, not because it was the most populus state because in some of the elections it wasn't even close!

It happened in great part because of the 3/5ths compromise, which you don't seem to understand.

 

[Paperview]

Of the antebellum South and the future CSA, I blame those citizens who voted in year after year elected officials who promised -- decade after decade, to maintain, protect and expand the practice of human bondage.

Ponder that, Confederate defenders.

 

[slick]

It happened in great part because of the 3/5ths compromise, which you don't seem to understand.

You're like a dying ant grasping onto a straw with this nonsense. Washington won the 1st 2 of 9 with every electoral vote.
unopposed his election had nothing to do with the 3/5 compromise.

Both Jefferson & Monroe went to the college I graduated from so I'm familiar with their presidencies.

Jefferson in 1804 won every prominent northern state NY, Penn & Mass each one had more electoral than his opponent
had in the entire country his election had nothing to do with the 3/5 compromise.

Monroe in 1820 ran the table won every state & 80% of the vote over John Q. Adams
his election had nothing to do with the 3/5 compromise.

The only elections that were even close of the first nine were the 2 between Jefferson & Adams #1,
with NY being the kingmakers in both.

Your original error was stating Virginia was the most populous state in the first 9 elections that's not the case,
not even close.

 

[slick]

Of the antebellum South and the future CSA, I blame those citizens who voted in year after year elected officials who promised -- decade after decade, to maintain, protect and expand the practice of human bondage.

Ponder that, Confederate defenders.

Forget about blaming 'the antebellum South and the future CSA, I blame those citizens who voted in year after year elected officials who promised -- decade after decade, to maintain, protect and expand the practice of human bondage.'

Try this in all 8 elections won by those who engaged in the practice of human bondage consider blaming the 2 most prominent northern states
Pennsylvania who voted for those so-called wretched slaveholders in all 8 elections & NY who did so in 7 of the eight. Why aren't they on your ****list.

 

[The Resister]

I stand by my post. Lots of people protested against Blacks having anything named after the.No links needed.

That is because there has never been a major protest. It's never been that big a deal with the masses.

 

[blackjack50]

The bigger question is, why is this all of a sudden such a problem? Why wasn't it an issue during the eight years of the Obama admin? :roll:

Because it didn't exist? Because it didn't count? Because of reasons? Lol. There really is no excuse why this is NOW all of a sudden a big deal. It has been there a long time.

The crowd is not the sum of its parts.

I am a republican who did not vote for Trump (Or Hillary).

 

[Paperview]

You're like a dying ant grasping onto a straw with this nonsense. Washington won the 1st 2 of 9 with every electoral vote.
unopposed his election had nothing to do with the 3/5 compromise.

Both Jefferson & Monroe went to the college I graduated from so I'm familiar with their presidencies.

Jefferson in 1804 won every prominent northern state NY, Penn & Mass each one had more electoral than his opponent
had in the entire country his election had nothing to do with the 3/5 compromise.

Monroe in 1820 ran the table won every state & 80% of the vote over John Q. Adams
his election had nothing to do with the 3/5 compromise.

The only elections that were even close of the first nine were the 2 between Jefferson & Adams #1,
with NY being the kingmakers in both.

Your original error was stating Virginia was the most populous state in the first 9 elections that's not the case,
not even close.

Maybe you don't understand this, but elections are not just about electing presidents. A good deal of who I was referring to were the congresscritters (whose totals DO go towards the electoral vote) -- and local reps when I said "Of the antebellum South and the future CSA, I blame those citizens who voted in year after year elected officials who promised -- decade after decade, to maintain, protect and expand the practice of human bondage. Ponder that, Confederate defenders."

As far as being off by a few years, whoop, you got me. Virginia was the most populous state until the 7th --- (I had mistakenly added the slave population to the total in my quick review.)

1810 Census:

State

Slaves

Population

Pct. Slave

Free Non-White

Pct. FNW

New York

15,017

959,049

1.6

25,333

Virginia

392,518

974,622

40.3

30,570

1820 Census

State	Slaves	Population	Pct. Slave	Free Non-White	Pct. FNW
North
New York	10,088	1,372,812	0.7	29,278	2.1

Virginia

425,153

1,065,379

39.9

39,889

3.7

https://userpages.umbc.edu/~bouton/History407/SlaveStats.htm

 

[TurtleDude]

The bigger question is, why is this all of a sudden such a problem? Why wasn't it an issue during the eight years of the Obama admin? :roll:

because the SJWs are pretending that the confederacy=Trump and its a way for the poor dears to rage against Trump through attacking faux surrogates

 

[SocialD]

Stone Mountain –Confederate sculpture – Remove it-Yes-No?
Remove it - Yes -Why

Remove it- No -Why

Markers prominently posted explaining the history of this and the Civil War -Yes

Markers prominently posted explaining the history of this and the Civil War - No

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stone_Mountain






https://www.amren.com/news/2017/08/candidate-governor-calls-removal-stone-mountain-carving/

Are we next going to get rid of a mention of Jackson, Davis and Lee from history books? or maybe just remove the civil war entirely from the history books?

 

[Oreo]

Stone Mountain –Confederate sculpture – Remove it-Yes-No?
Remove it - Yes -Why

Remove it- No -Why

Markers prominently posted explaining the history of this and the Civil War -Yes

Markers prominently posted explaining the history of this and the Civil War - No

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stone_Mountain






https://www.amren.com/news/2017/08/candidate-governor-calls-removal-stone-mountain-carving/

Well as soon as your article stated it was the meeting place of the KKK--it's a no brainer. Look I like history as much as anyone else--but we have monuments that are there to enrage certain (not so friendly--in fact hateful people in this country.)

Put yourselves in the shoes of black Americans in this country--who are often forced to walk past statues that are there to apparently "glorify" a very dark past in the South. Oppression and slavery. Many of these statues are situated in public parks and Government buildings, and most all of them were erected decades AFTER the civil war. Why?
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...lottesville-removal-race-civil-war/101870418/

The dead of the civil war are honored on battlefields like Gettysburg. So why are they here? North Carolina has erected 30 new monuments since 2000. So why are they situated where they are? Where black Americans are forced to walk around them in parks, and government buildings, that service their needs also, and that they pay taxes on.

1. To glorify a dark past of slavery in the South
2. To remind blacks of slavery & oppression
3. To intimidate black Americans in this country

Could you possibly imagine the reaction--if we as Americans, were forced to walk past statues of Adolf Hitler, and there were statues everywhere that glorified the SS in their Nazi uniforms?

I am not saying to destroy these statues, but they really do belong in a Civil War museum.

 

[Paperview]

Are we next going to get rid of a mention of Jackson, Davis and Lee from history books? or maybe just remove the civil war entirely from the history books?

Why would you say something as ridiculous as this?

 

[SocialD]

Why would you say something as ridiculous as this?

I see removing a mountain etching as to be pretty much just as ridiculous.

 

[Paperview]

I see removing a mountain etching as to be pretty much just as ridiculous.

Yeah -- because if there are no statues glorifying slaveowners who took up arms against this country, then all history of the single biggest event / war in American history is automatically removed.

:screwy

 

[Unitedwestand13]

I see removing a mountain etching as to be pretty much just as ridiculous.

Then let me offer up an alternative: instead of altering Stone Mountain in any way, why not place a statue nearby of someone that opposed the institution of slavary. Perhaps a statue of the radical abolitionist John brown?

 

[slick]

Maybe you don't understand this, but elections are not just about electing presidents. A good deal of who I was referring to were the congresscritters (whose totals DO go towards the electoral vote) -- and local reps when I said "Of the antebellum South and the future CSA, I blame those citizens who voted in year after year elected officials who promised -- decade after decade, to maintain, protect and expand the practice of human bondage. Ponder that, Confederate defenders."

As far as being off by a few years, whoop, you got me. Virginia was the most populous state until the 7th --- (I had mistakenly added the slave population to the total in my quick review.)

1810 Census:

State

Slaves

Population

Pct. Slave

Free Non-White

Pct. FNW

New York

15,017

959,049

1.6

25,333

Virginia

392,518

974,622

40.3

30,570

1820 Census

State	Slaves	Population	Pct. Slave	Free Non-White	Pct. FNW
North
New York	10,088	1,372,812	0.7	29,278	2.1

Virginia

425,153

1,065,379

39.9

39,889

3.7

https://userpages.umbc.edu/~bouton/History407/SlaveStats.htm

I criticized one statement: 'Virginia was the most populous state in the first 9 elections' and that's not even close to being accurate!
Then you indulge in some bombastic flourish about how the 3/5 agreement tainted those first 9 election which when I thoroughly explained wasn't
so, you go off on a tangent about local elections which was no part of your initial faulty post.

There is no need to digress into pretzel like contortions in an attempt to validate a debunked presentation of the facts. That's CNN's job!

 

[JANFU]

Well as soon as your article stated it was the meeting place of the KKK--it's a no brainer. Look I like history as much as anyone else--but we have monuments that are there to enrage certain (not so friendly--in fact hateful people in this country.)

Put yourselves in the shoes of black Americans in this country--who are often forced to walk past statues that are there to apparently "glorify" a very dark past in the South. Oppression and slavery. Many of these statues are situated in public parks and Government buildings, and most all of them were erected decades AFTER the civil war. Why?
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...lottesville-removal-race-civil-war/101870418/

The dead of the civil war are honored on battlefields like Gettysburg. So why are they here? North Carolina has erected 30 new monuments since 2000. So why are they situated where they are? Where black Americans are forced to walk around them in parks, and government buildings, that service their needs also, and that they pay taxes on.

1. To glorify a dark past of slavery in the South
2. To remind blacks of slavery & oppression
3. To intimidate black Americans in this country

Could you possibly imagine the reaction--if we as Americans, were forced to walk past statues of Adolf Hitler, and there were statues everywhere that glorified the SS in their Nazi uniforms?

I am not saying to destroy these statues, but they really do belong in a Civil War museum.

I am all in favor of these statues being removed to museums. As to Stone Mountain, it stays, with markers detailing events of the Civil War.
That and my opinion has always been the Civil War was over slavery. Which is an abomination before God

 

[Paperview]

Or show the robes and sheets parades next to 1915 deep Jim Crow era Stone Mountain etching with it's roots deeply entangled with the KKK (who for decades and decades held annual cross burnings there) .

Maybe a plaque to the KKK for all the "good" they did ennobling it. That's the ticket!

ETA: Hey look -- I just found out the Sacred Knights of the Ku Klux Klan applied to hold another cross burning there in October of this year.