Shutting Down Freeways (the 101)?

[Phys251]

Hates AM radio but endorses the actions that will have everyone listening to AM radio on the freeway stuck in traffic for five hours.

That's called giving Democrats enough rope to hang themselves with.

NPR is so much better.

 

[TangoNoCash]

Blocking freeways disrupts millions of people and should not be tolerated...


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It's cute you think there's rules to protesting. It's all illegal.

 

[Bodi]

Someone creative could probably come up with lots of ways.

Is there an acceptable way to disrupt the lives of millions of people in protest?

Probably...

I thought it was understood and taken for granted that by its very nature, Civil DISobedience often involves breaking the law.

I thought it was understood that Civil DISobedience is peaceful in nature.

the refusal to comply with certain laws considered unjust, as a peaceful form of political protest.

Civil DISobedience - Bing

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But, glad to have you bring it up for any listeners in the back who were unaware of what civil disobedience involves

okay

 

[aociswundumho]

Why should they be granted citizenship? On what grounds?

If they have no criminal record, and they already have a job, then what other reason do you need?

 

[Bodi]

It's cute you think there's rules to protesting. It's all illegal.

No it isn't. People/groups get permits all the time. They legally protest peacefully on public property and they do not disrupt people at all.

The fact that you don't understand that is ****ing hilarious.





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[Simon W. Moon]

Probably...

again, it's not about the numbers of people, it's just that you have some special case about freeways

I thought it was understood that Civil DISobedience is peaceful in nature.

civil disobedience is civil and disobedient.

What of it?

 

[multivita-man]

If they have no criminal record, and they already have a job, then what other reason do you need?

I'm pro-immigration, but even I am not advocating that it be that easy to become a citizen. To become a legal immigrant? Okay, maybe so, but citizenship through naturalization is a big deal. I think that's what pisses me off about the MAGA-tards. I know how hard citizenship is to obtain. I married an immigrant and we went through the process. It's expensive. It's not easy. I am definitely not for open borders, but what I am for is actually problem solving, and none of the pieces of shit who bang their drums about the dangers of illegal immigration do a God-damn thing about that problem. They just want the problem to exist because it gives them an issue to run on.

 

[Bodi]

Well they're not law-abiding citizens, according to your test.

They are not Citizens at all, much less law-abiding.

Why should they be granted citizenship? On what grounds?

Because it is the most simple solution. They are already here, living lives, paying taxes, with most likely Citizen children born here.

Maybe there's an intermediate step, which is to improve the immigration system to accommodate this apparent gap in the labor market, or continue looking the other way like we have for years because we know that their labor is more important than our legal purity.

Maybe.

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[Bodi]

again, it's not about the numbers of people, it's just that you have some special case about freeways

I literally said it was about the numbers of people... but ok.

civil disobedience is civil and disobedient.

Blocking freeways is illegal and is not civil.

What of it?

No idea. You are the one that keeps trying to make something out of my wish to not let people block freeways.






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[Bodi]

If they have no criminal record, and they already have a job, then what other reason do you need?

Even if not a citizen, at least make them legal immigrants.

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[multivita-man]

Because it is the most simple solution. They are already here, living lives, paying taxes, with most likely Citizen children born here.

Simplest isn't best. You don't just hand out citizenship.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

I literally said it was about the numbers of people... but ok.

I realize that.
That's why I am pointing out that you have also said differently in this conversation.

You're fine with disrupting millions of peoples lives as long as it doesn't involve the freeway.

Blocking freeways is illegal and is not civil.

it is illegal

it is civil

No idea. You are the one that keeps trying to make something out of my wish to not let people block freeways.

the question in question is not about freeways, but about your comment that civil disobedience is supposed to be peaceful

If I have to start RE-connecting each of my comments with your relevant comments that I already quoted, this will become too tedious too quickly to continue

 

[aociswundumho]

Simplest isn't best. You don't just hand out citizenship.

That's exactly what birthright citizenship does, so I presume you are against it?

 

[TangoNoCash]

No it isn't. People/groups get permits all the time. They legally protest peacefully on public property and they do not disrupt people at all.

The fact that you don't understand that is ****ing hilarious.





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Do you think this is that sort of protest? Were you even inconvenienced by the closures?

 

[multivita-man]

That's exactly what birthright citizenship does, so I presume you are against it?

The Constitution protects it. Like it does for you and me. Anyone who was born here was handed citizenship, so in that case, I guess I am okay with a handout. But to someone who has grown up in a different country and culture, there's a screening process.

 

[aociswundumho]

But to someone who has grown up in a different country and culture, there's a screening process.

Again, why?

Consider the history of immigration in the US: dutch, germans, irish, french, scandinavians, chinese, italians, and many, many more. All of them coming from different countries with different cultures. The result? Created the richest and most free country in the world.

 

[Bodi]

Simplest isn't best. You don't just hand out citizenship.

That is fine. Legal status then... spend the money on keeping them here and productive instead of all this deportation stuff.


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[multivita-man]

Again, why?

Consider the history of immigration in the US: dutch, germans, irish, french, scandinavians, chinese, italians, and many, many more. All of them coming from different countries with different cultures. The result? Created the richest and most free country in the world.

Okay, I was hoping I wouldn't have to go there, and I'm going to take some incoming for this, but look at Europe and the mass migration of fundamentalist Muslims into what has become a mostly secular continent. I'm not saying this to bash Islam or people from Africa and the Middle East, but to deny cultural differences is dangerously naive.

 

[Bodi]

Do you think this is that sort of protest?

Yes.

Do you encourage freeway closures as a practice... or just in this case?

Were you even inconvenienced by the closures?

No. Living in New Zealand has its advantages at times.


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[Bodi]

I realize that.
That's why I am pointing out that you have also said differently in this conversation.

Incorrect.

You're fine with disrupting millions of peoples lives as long as it doesn't involve the freeway.

Pretty sure I never said that.

it is illegal

it is civil

Blocking people's freedom of movement is not peaceful.

the question in question is not about freeways, but about your comment that civil disobedience is supposed to be peaceful

I never said that it was supposed to be peaceful. I said that it isn't, in this case, peaceful.

If I have to start RE-connecting each of my comments with your relevant comments that I already quoted, this will become too tedious too quickly to continue

It already is. You are assuming things I never said over and over. That is why I have broken down the argument so that I can illustrate that... but it does not seem to be helping. *shrug*


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[TangoNoCash]

Yes.

Do you encourage freeway closures as a practice... or just in this case?



No. Living in New Zealand has its advantages at times.


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I encourage them to shut them down if there's people all over them. Honestly I have no problem with protest in any public space. Maybe put some thought into what's causing the protests instead? I can tell you as someone who suffered Los Angeles traffic for 20 years, just another day.

 

[Bodi]

I encourage them to shut them down if there's people all over them. Honestly I have no problem with protest in any public space. Maybe put some thought into what's causing the protests instead? I can tell you as someone who suffered Los Angeles traffic for 20 years, just another day.

Rarely are entire freeways shut down.

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[TangoNoCash]

Rarely are entire freeways shut down.

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Happened all the time in LA. One accident would shut down the entire freeway minus one lane. Then everyone on the other side has to stop to look. It took me 45 minutes to go about 12 miles on most days and could be up to an hour and a half on days like today when the freeway is effectively closed.

 

[Cosmo]

Interesting. You seem more concerned with civilians who are being inconvenienced by the protestors than the civilians literally targeted by the feds.

What does one thing have to do with the other? Illegals should be targeted and deported. Legal residents and citizens should be able to use the freeway.

Though I am not a fan of shutting down freeways, it is an act of civil disobedience, and the protestors have rights that you seem to ignore.

The right to peaceably assembly is just that. It's not also a right to break the law, including jaywalking/impeding traffic.

 

[Bodi]

Happened all the time in LA. One accident would shut down the entire freeway minus one lane. Then everyone on the other side has to stop to look. It took me 45 minutes to go about 12 miles on most days and could be up to an hour and a half on days like today when the freeway is effectively closed.

I drove the freeways for almost twenty years and never came across a closed freeway or one down to one lane. Not once.

the 5, the 405, the 105, the 605, the 10, the 710, the 110, the 210, the 57, the 55, the 91 and the 101.

I might be missing one or two, but not once.

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