Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"[W:1000, 1660]

[Lord of Planar]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

They will only invest in risky new technology when someone else has lowered the risk.

Fine.

You pay for it.

 

[longview]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

There is no higher cost.

A prius is about the same size as a yaris.
New Cars | 2013 & 2014 New Toyota Vehicles
$14.5K vs 19K, sure looks like more cost to me.

 

[Tim the plumber]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

I believe science. Always have, always will.

You believe what you wish was true. In the absence of any science. That's called faith.

Since we (mostly) have an extremely negative impression of your ability to do any science or know anything could you please show how that's wrong on the quiz thread.

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

The modern hybrid car, with some exception, are parallel systems, in that
the electric portion and heat engine share the transmission (have parallel inputs)
This type of design is an engineering dead end, in that it is needlessly complicated.
Trains and ships have been hybrids for over 50 years, but they are serial hybrids.
In a serial hybrid, the heat engine only powers a generator, there is no transmission.
Direct drive electric motors power the wheels.
The savings in a serial hybrid car will come for the heat engine running at an optimum speed,
to maximize Carnot efficiencies, combined with the energy recovery from stops, being applied
to starts.
We have to be about to utilize the energy from the sun.
In order to do that, we have to be able to store that energy.
Nature stores excess energy as hydrocarbons, it might work for us also.
What other choices do we have?

Parallel hybrids obtain 2X the mileage by maintaining an Atkinson cycle engine near peak efficiency by balancing the variability in the power demand electrically. Braking energy recovery, uphill and down, headwind and tail, accelleration and decelleration, all temporary conditions are managed with battery energy. Not to overlook the simplicity of not burning gas when stopped.

For sure a multi decade but temporary transportation solution to extend the life of, and mitigate the costs of, fossil fuel dregs.

No matter what the source of the primary power, handling variability that way is better than not.

So, to me, electrical drives and batteries are a given. Either as variable power or primary or both.

Also look up Active Corner Modules. The future for lower cost cars.

We all know about the problem of storing energy from intermittent sources like wind and solar. Why not store it in millions of car batteries, at least for the transportation sector? Charge less when fuelless, wasteless, energy is surplus.

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

Since we (mostly) have an extremely negative impression of your ability to do any science or know anything could you please show how that's wrong on the quiz thread.

How to accept science over faith?

By "we" do you mean you and the mouse in your pocket?

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

A prius is about the same size as a yaris.
New Cars | 2013 & 2014 New Toyota Vehicles
$14.5K vs 19K, sure looks like more cost to me.

Mine is a Prius V. Listed for $25K. More like an Avalon or Lexus.

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

Fine.

You pay for it.

You and I both do in taxes. There is no other way.

 

[Threegoofs]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

Since we (mostly) have an extremely negative impression of your ability to do any science or know anything could you please show how that's wrong on the quiz thread.

Given that, unlike you, he knew that quantum mechanics have no relation to climate prediction uncertainty, I think I'll stick with his grasp of science over yours.

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

I don't believe you on the basis of your input to date



I'm not the disciple of the non empirical hypothesis holding up discredited politicians as an affirmation of my belief system :roll:

I think that this means that you have more faith in politics than science. Just like the creationists who have more Faith in God than in science.

Fringe, but real people.

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

Really ? Guess which of these countries has the highest committment to renewable energy production ?

View attachment 67161749

Preparation is always an investment in today for tomorrow.

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

Given that, unlike you, he knew that quantum mechanics have no relation to climate prediction uncertainty, I think I'll stick with his grasp of science over yours.

I assume that he's a better plumber than I though. Most people overvalue their own specialty and undervalue others.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

You and I both do in taxes. There is no other way.

I don't share your point of view. Let the natural supply and demand set the course. I'd rather my $12K+ in federal income tax be spent better than that. In the end, things like this will increase our tax rates, and i think i pay too much already.

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

I don't share your point of view. Let the natural supply and demand set the course. I'd rather my $12K+ in federal income tax be spent better than that. In the end, things like this will increase our tax rates, and i think i pay too much already.

This is a democracy. Vote for representation that supports what you want.

 

[longview]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

Parallel hybrids obtain 2X the mileage by maintaining an Atkinson cycle engine near peak efficiency by balancing the variability in the power demand electrically. Braking energy recovery, uphill and down, headwind and tail, accelleration and decelleration, all temporary conditions are managed with battery energy. Not to overlook the simplicity of not burning gas when stopped.

For sure a multi decade but temporary transportation solution to extend the life of, and mitigate the costs of, fossil fuel dregs.

No matter what the source of the primary power, handling variability that way is better than not.

So, to me, electrical drives and batteries are a given. Either as variable power or primary or both.

Also look up Active Corner Modules. The future for lower cost cars.

We all know about the problem of storing energy from intermittent sources like wind and solar. Why not store it in millions of car batteries, at least for the transportation sector? Charge less when fuelless, wasteless, energy is surplus.

Batteries are chemical storage, and are a long way from being as energy dense ad hydrocarbons.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

This is a democracy. Vote for representation that supports what you want.

I do. Still, the idiots prevail and now we have Obamacare. Climate change legislation will be another political disaster.

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

I do. Still, the idiots prevail and now we have Obamacare. Climate change legislation will be another political disaster.

Who told you that you're not the idiot?

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

Batteries are chemical storage, and are a long way from being as energy dense ad hydrocarbons.

You can only extract energy from hydrocarbons once. Batteries are rechargeable.

 

[longview]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

You can only extract energy from hydrocarbons once. Batteries are rechargeable.

What? there is so much wrong with that thinking, I can't even start.
That and I almost spit my drink at the computer laughing.

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

What? there is so much wrong with that thinking, I can't even start.
That and I almost spit my drink at the computer laughing.

You've never heard of rechargeable batteries?

If you don't believe the first part connect your car's exhaust pipe to the air filter and drive for free.

 

[Tim the plumber]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

How to accept science over faith?

By "we" do you mean you and the mouse in your pocket?

We the other people who post and read here.

You are the one with the faith. I question and examine. I read the papers. I add up. I answer questions. Go and have a crack at the quiz. Show me you are actually a scientist.

 

[Tim the plumber]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

Given that, unlike you, he knew that quantum mechanics have no relation to climate prediction uncertainty, I think I'll stick with his grasp of science over yours.

Neither of you had a clue as to the limitations of modeling of weather/climate due to the effects of chaos within the system. I challenge the 2 of you to explain your selves on the quiz thread.

 

[Threegoofs]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

Neither of you had a clue as to the limitations of modeling of weather/climate due to the effects of chaos within the system. I challenge the 2 of you to explain your selves on the quiz thread.

YOU are the one that said the chaos in climate system had to do with Heisenberg's uncertaintly principle! If thats not retarded scientific thought, I dont know what is.

 

[Tim the plumber]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

YOU are the one that said the chaos in climate system had to do with Heisenberg's uncertaintly principle! If thats not retarded scientific thought, I dont know what is.

At some level it is. In order to perfectly model the climate you would have to know the position and velocity of every single atom of the atmosphere. At such a scale you would have hit the uncertainty principal.

The difficulty of modeling the climate will never be solved by throwing more computing power at it. Chaos.

 

[longview]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

You've never heard of rechargeable batteries?

If you don't believe the first part connect your car's exhaust pipe to the air filter and drive for free.

No, we were discussing man made hydrocarbons as an energy storage device.
Pound for pound hydrocarbons store about ten times the energy as the best batteries,
and we can make all we want.
In addition the shelve life of man made hydrocarbons could be measured with a geologic scale.

 

[Ouch!]

Re: Science: Effect of man on climate is "highly uncertain"

We the other people who post and read here.

You are the one with the faith. I question and examine. I read the papers. I add up. I answer questions. Go and have a crack at the quiz. Show me you are actually a scientist.

Why do you think that I owe you anything? Why do you think that you know science?