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Russia says it's going to arm a secretive submarine with 6 nuclear 'doomsday' devices

WCH

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Russia will deploy what's been described as the deadliest nuclear weapon ever aboard mysterious submarines by 2020, state media has announced, citing a Russian defense-industry source.

The Russian "Poseidon" nuclear-powered torpedo - reputed to carry a 100 megaton to 200 megaton nuclear warhead and meant to erupt underwater for maximum effect - will reportedly deploy aboard the Project 09852 sub Belgorod, which is a converted nuclear-powered cruise-missile sub expected to go on combat duty in 2020.


snip...

Russia says it's going to arm a secretive submarine with 6 nuclear 'doomsday' devices

Interesting approach...nuclear tsunami.
 
Russia is changing the equation. Russia under Putin is transforming MAD which everyone knows as Mutually Assured Destruction to the new offset strategy of MAS -- Mutually Assured Spending.

Putin is reviving weapons platforms both Russia as the USSR and USA examined and tested in the 1950s and 1960s and that each side dismissed as unnecessary, provocative, expensive and apocalyptic. That is, while multiple warheads on a ballistic missile will destroy a city, these torpedoes will destroy a continent. Each side can make 'em. So thanks to Putin and Russia we've come around full circle again.

How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Love The Bomb

And The 100 Megaton Torpedo Too




The 100 megaton nuclear torpedo and related submarine systems are massively expensive. Putin however is committed to sparing no expense. Which is the major military reason Putin needs the lifting of economic sanctions by the US and EU. Given this reality the sanctions aren't ever likely to be eased or removed however. So much for Trump, Michael Flynn et al.




Pentagon has the system in its Nuclear Posture Review where one can read up on it. Pentagon classifies the system as a Russian strategic nuclear weapon program:“Russia is also developing at least two new intercontinental range systems, a hypersonic glide vehicle, and a new intercontinental, nuclear-armed, nuclear-powered, undersea autonomous torpedo.”


When we get into the seaweed of the Russki system however we find inherent limitations. For instance the specialized sub needs to get close in to the USA coastal areas. Launching it otherwise takes several days to reach US coastal shores. Its deployment is not viable off the Atlantic coast because as a deep diving weapon the sub and torpedoes can't overcome transit from Russia via GIUK gap into the Atlantic due to the depths and geographical choke points involved. So and as Pentagon points out we won't need a 6th Battle of the Atlantic in naval and military terms.

The Pacific coast is more hospitable to it yet the system is both slow and noisy. This is the equivalent to US ASW of the bases loaded double that clears the bases. A walkoff smash in the bottom of the tenth. Can't miss it down there. US will need to develop torpedoes that reach that depth so that's what the US will do. Guaranteed.

Russia has the same problem with its armed forces as Iran has. That is, the conventional forces of each are so full of holes, aged equipment and its personnel so underpaid and poorly trained, each of 'em must go nuclear and in big ways. In Russia the future is now while in Iran the future is asap.
 

Seems like an epic waste of time, tidal waves to destroy civilian populations really is a waste when the nukes themselves do so just fine without re inventing the wheel. Fyi the tidal wave thing has been proposed by both the us and the soviet union, in some cases to inflict high civilian casualties, other times to use the wave to wipe out naval fleets with minimal effort. In the end none of those proposals came through in any serious degree, and even if they chose to do the same effect they could do it on a smaller and more tactical scale with conventional bombers or even icbm's rather than using a wave to destroy land targets the nukes already would have.
 

And meanwhile back at the National_Command_Authority, nuclear missiles are headed to the men’s room in the Kremlin
 
More likely a carrier killer. An underwater shock wave would like break her keel.
 
Somehow I get the disheartening feeling that somebody is going to try doing a remake of that Kubrick film, and:

1) It's going to star Tom Cruise
2) It's going to star Will Smith
3) It's going to star both Tom Cruise AND Will Smith
4) It's going to suck, and suck hard, because it will also probably be directed by Roland Emmerich.
5) It's also going to suck hard because it will be a hack rewrite where it becomes an exercise in jingoism, but alas, I repeat myself because I already said it will probably be directed by Roland Emmerich.
 
Bullseye said:
More likely a carrier killer. An underwater shock wave would like break her keel.
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They could kill carriers with just convential standoff bombs and missiles, on the nuclear arena even the smallest nukes detonated over the surface of the water would wipe them out, what they have here is just fear mongering, the same crap had been proposed before by the soviet union as well as the us and other nations, smarter heads prevailed and realized it was a waste.
 
A hundred megaton blast would be the gift that keeps on giving - shock waves might damage or sink the carrier's escorts as well.
 

I've got to admit, it's been a while since I've watched a Roland Emmerich film... I'm thinking the last one was The Day After Tomorrow - which wasn't great, but didn't stink either. I'm looking forward to see what he does with Midway later on this year.
 
Every week it seems Putin flings out yet another nuclear super-weapon.

It's a bit funny when their MIRV'd silo arsenal is perhaps enough to initiate nuclear winter.
 

I'm sorry, WCH... but the thought of a 100 MT Torpedo stretches the realm of credibility. Even if such a thing were possible to design, it'd be too big and bulky to be practical. If anything, I think the Belgorod is going to be a spy sub... pretty much a bargain version of the USS Jimmy Carter.
 
Bullseye said:
What?
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There comes a point at which Russian leaders go too far and are killed. The idea of such a weapon only makes Russia more vulnerable to destruction because an attack or even an attack that malfunctions will trigger a non recallable attack on Russia as well.

So mysterious deaths happen all the time in Russia, so Putin is not immune. I seriously doubt all his generals are sitting around the table cheering. After all, they are at risk too.
 

You're talking about Putin of course given it's his baby. And given the project more than strains credibility you'd need to acknowledge Putin's paucity of credibility. Putin's not five moves ahead of anyone either much less the USA. Putin is instead leaping back to the 1950s and 1960s. Putin is regressing and he's doing it with nuclear weapons and delivery systems.

I note also your implied attempt to justify Russian spying on the US. You imagine Putin's real motive is to stand equal to the United States in spycraft by creating the equal of the USS Jimmy Carter. Russia is not equal to the USA. US needs to spy on Russia and Putin while we over here reject Russia and Putin spying on the US. The reason is that we're the good guys and they over there are the bad guys. Yes, it's that fundamental and it's that plain and simple.
 

I'm not attempting to justify anything, Tangmo... just calling things as I see them, for whatever that's worth. When I look at this "Project 09852", I see a spy sub... not a doomsday one. If there's one thing the Russians are world-beaters at it, it's disinformation. They've been doing it since before Dzherzhinsky was in diapers.
 



I'm thinking half a dozen 50mt Tsar Bombas would do the trick.

What startled me was the dastardly plan of making radioactive tsunamis.

I suppose it's just the worst scenario they could dream up.
 

You'll have to keep your fingers crossed no matter what the use of this Project 09852. Because Russian submarines have killed more Russian sailors than all the present enemies of Russia combined. Russian Navy submariners have been an endangered species for a long time. And it's only because of their own subs. Meantime wherever you may be getting your, ahem, hunches, you may be getting disinformation. And passing it along of course whether knowingly or unknowingly. Or perhaps you might be simulating chess while being convinced you're several moves ahead of the rest of us. You'd be wrong there too of course.
 

To be honest, I am really only referring to "Independence Day".
 
WCH said:
I'm thinking half a dozen 50mt Tsar Bombas would do the trick.

What startled me was the dastardly plan of making radioactive tsunamis.

I suppose it's just the worst scenario they could dream up.
Click to expand...

Have you ever researched just how much the Tsar Bomba actually weighed? Sure, I know we're talking 1961 technology and that modern designs are a lot smaller.... but they're not so much smaller that it'd be practical to actually use one in a deployable weapon. Even to develop such weapons would require extensive testing... and the Soviets/Russians haven't had an underground test larger than 1 MT since the mid-70's.
 

You're breaking my heart, Tangmo *L*
 
Cordelier said:
I thought the original was pretty good for an action flic.... never bothered to watch the sequel, though. (I've heard I'm not missing much)
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I don't know if you have ever seen "Doctor Strangelove" but it's hardly what I would call a "jingoistic" film, whereas Independence Day, while certainly entertaining as action movies go, was not only one of the most jingoistic cinematic romps since the old John Wayne "Big Jim McLain" films, it reeks of nationalistic overtones which at times border on the absurd.
 
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