Right to disconnect?

[Helix]

I assume you just said you weren't at home?
They can't expect you to stay at home in case they phone while you aren't being paid.

They told me that I was expected to be available when they called. Basically, I was "on call." I said for minimum wage, **** that. Luckily, it was a summer job, and I was headed back to college in the fall. I worked there two summers, and then got a more interesting summer job after that.

 

[Lovebug]

This was never an issue before cell phones. If you were away from home, too bad for the company, as no method of contacting the employee outside their home was available. And, the world kept spinning and business kept being conducted and companies profited.

We wore pagers when on call.

 

[Decypher]

And you will probably notice that those EU countries are not the economic giant the US is.

China is also an economic giant because they also exploit their workers. Work life balance is more important here in the EU. Right to disconnect is in my employment contract but my employer wouldn’t dream of contacting me outside of work hours anyway. It’s a work culture thing.

 

[Serenity]

Many EU countries have a right to disconnect law which makes it illegal for companies to contact employees outside working hours and I'm wondering if you think that law should be enacted in the US?

I think this law would help with people being overstressed and harassed by work and would be a fantastic idea but what do you think and why do you disagree if you do?

Right to disconnect - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

We have a Right to disconnect law here too.

 

[MAGAnificent]

China is also an economic giant because they also exploit their workers. Work life balance is more important here in the EU. Right to disconnect is in my employment contract but my employer wouldn’t dream of contacting me outside of work hours anyway. It’s a work culture thing.

China is an economic giant due solely to trade with the west, especially the US. If that trade evaporated, China's economy would crash and burn faster then Joe Biden can eat an ice cream cone, and te dicatorship would soon crash as well. That is also largely why they have not yet invaded Tawain. They may be exploiting their workers, however that has nothing to do with the size of their economy.

 

[Decypher]

China is an economic giant due solely to trade with the west, especially the US. If that trade evaporated, China's economy would crash and burn faster then Joe Biden can eat an ice cream cone, and te dicatorship would soon crash as well. That is also largely why they have not yet invaded Tawain. They may be exploiting their workers, however that has nothing to do with the size of their economy.

Of course it has. Because they don’t have the expense of treating their workers properly, they can produce their products cheaper. The cheap and plentiful products which the west buys from them in such abundance is why they’re an economic giant, as you acknowledge. The US treats its workers badly by European standards which is why their corporations enjoy more profits.

 

[Peter]

Of course it has. Because they don’t have the expense of treating their workers properly, they can produce their products cheaper. The cheap and plentiful products which the west buys from them in such abundance is why they’re an economic giant, as you acknowledge. The US treats its workers badly by European standards which is why their corporations enjoy more profits.

It almost seems like some Americans think corporate profits are more important than the mental and physical health of workers.

 

[Decypher]

It almost seems like some Americans think corporate profits are more important than the mental and physical health of workers.

The Randian fallacy that government is evil but corporations are virtuous is something I’ll never understand.

 

[MAGAnificent]

The US treats its workers badly by European standards which is why their corporations enjoy more profits.

How so?

 

[MAGAnificent]

You don't need to win a majority of states to win. You can theoretically win the popular vote in just 12 states and have enough EC votes to win the election

Then what is your gripe? It's still based on electoral votes alloted based on state populations.

 

[Peter]

How so?

Zero maternity leave.
No minimum holiday or sick leave mandates.
You can be fired without cause.
US minimum wage is laughable.

That's just for starters.

 

[MAGAnificent]

Zero maternity leave.

Mot large companies in the US offer maternity leave. And most that don't still allow the demale emplyee to return. However it should remain up to the employer.

No minimum holiday or sick leave mandates.

Every employer I have ever worked for offered holidays and sick leave.

You can be fired without cause.

Employers should maintain the right to emply who they choose and terminate the employment of anyone they choose to not retain. The US is not a dictatorship.

US minimum wage is laughable.

But then the US minimum wage is not designed for the purpose of making a living. It's meant for teenagers and young adults just breaking into the job market, wives simply taking unskilled jobs to supplent their spouse's income, or seniors wanting a little mad money over and above retirement earnings. And everytime it is arbitrarily raised, it results in net job losses in unskilled positions.

 

[Peter]

Mot large companies in the US offer maternity leave. And most that don't still allow the demale emplyee to return. However it should remain up to the employer.

That's not the same as it being enshrined in law and the company can simply refuse to offer it if they feel like it and you're screwed.

Every employer I have ever worked for offered holidays and sick leave.

Again thats at the will of the employer and tens of millions of Americans dont have either.

Employers should maintain the right to emply who they choose and terminate the employment of anyone they choose to not retain. The US is not a dictatorship.

Being able to fire someone whose worked perfectly for a decade with zero reason is pathetic and why we have employment laws.

But then the US minimum wage is not designed for the purpose of making a living. It's meant for teenagers and young adults just breaking into the job market, wives simply taking unskilled jobs to supplent their spouse's income, or seniors wanting a little mad money over and above retirement earnings. And everytime it is arbitrarily raised, it results in net job losses in unskilled positions.

The minimum wage has not kept pace with inflation to even a slight degree and is a complete joke.

The US employment laws are laughable and designed to be as piss poor as they can be while being as pro profit as possible and people like you defend them and think Americans somehow deserve worse working conditions than those in Europe because you value corporate profits above all.

 

[Decypher]

Mot large companies in the US offer maternity leave. And most that don't still allow the demale emplyee to return. However it should remain up to the employer.

Every employer I have ever worked for offered holidays and sick leave.

Employers should maintain the right to emply who they choose and terminate the employment of anyone they choose to not retain. The US is not a dictatorship.

But then the US minimum wage is not designed for the purpose of making a living. It's meant for teenagers and young adults just breaking into the job market, wives simply taking unskilled jobs to supplent their spouse's income, or seniors wanting a little mad money over and above retirement earnings. And everytime it is arbitrarily raised, it results in net job losses in unskilled positions.

The merits of these measures wasn’t the discussion, just that they exist. European countries protect workers in way that the US doesn’t. That after all is the thread topic.

 

[AZRWinger]

This was never an issue before cell phones. If you were away from home, too bad for the company, as no method of contacting the employee outside their home was available. And, the world kept spinning and business kept being conducted and companies profited.

You never heard of a pager? It predates the cell phone by quite a bit. Ignoring a page put you on the express ticket to being fired.

Before remote connectivity, emergencies disrupting mission critical processes often required returning to the office. Yet the world kept spinning.

 

[AZRWinger]

Anyone who signs a contract that says you have to be available 24/7 is stupid and greedy.

Really? I'll bet you'd be first in line complaining if you didn't get paid on time because the person responsible for payroll processing was "disconnected" when the system crashed.

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

Really? I'll bet you'd be first in line complaining if you didn't get paid on time because the person responsible for payroll processing was "disconnected" when the system crashed.

I was self-employed most of my life. Because of my disabilities, I could never keep a job. Or it was some lame job. So I learned to provide for myself (and family) in a much better way.

 

[AZRWinger]

I was self-employed most of my life. Because of my disabilities, I could never keep a job. Or it was some lame job. So I learned to provide for myself (and family) in a much better way.

So if your customer told you they had to wait for their system to be fixed to pay you because the person responsible was off shift, you'd have been happy. Right.

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

So if your customer told you they had to wait for their system to be fixed to pay you because the person responsible was off shift, you'd have been happy. Right.

I waited. Many people have bank issues like the rest of us. My carvings sold for hundreds, cash in hand less hassle.

 

[Peter]

So if your customer told you they had to wait for their system to be fixed to pay you because the person responsible was off shift, you'd have been happy. Right.

They somehow manage this situation in countries with a right to disconect.

 

[Real blank]

I’ve contacted people outside their work hours and vice versa. I feel there must be some compromise here

 

[Groogrux]

Many EU countries have a right to disconnect law which makes it illegal for companies to contact employees outside working hours and I'm wondering if you think that law should be enacted in the US?

I think this law would help with people being overstressed and harassed by work and would be a fantastic idea but what do you think and why do you disagree if you do?

Right to disconnect - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I work in IT. My value would decrease greatly if I demanded no one contact me for assistance outside the hours of 8:30-5:00. We actually have someone on our team now that refuses to work one second over 40 hours regardless of the circumstances. She’s on her way out. We have the same job and I make $30,000 a year more than she does. And my quality of life hasn’t suffered by putting in some extra time when needed.

 

[Peter]

I work in IT. My value would decrease greatly if I demanded no one contact me for assistance outside the hours of 8:30-5:00. We actually have someone on our team now that refuses to work one second over 40 hours regardless of the circumstances. She’s on her way out. We have the same job and I make $30,000 a year more than she does. And my quality of life hasn’t suffered by putting in some extra time when needed.

The law doesn't stop you from doing extra if you want it simply says employers must not contact people outside work hours if they don't want to be contacted and they can't be fired or disciplined for that.
Your colleague for example would not be able to be fired for simply not wanting to be contacted outside working hours and she would also have a case for pay disparity.

Again, this law works perfectly in Europe and hasn't caused companies problems or to flee.

 

[AZRWinger]

The law doesn't stop you from doing extra if you want it simply says employers must not contact people outside work hours if they don't want to be contacted and they can't be fired or disciplined for that.

In many jobs being on call is part of the duties. IT is a common example but by no means the only one. The government puts its thumb on the scale with those who want to dictate an adversarial relationship between employer and employee with no contact by law.

When the pay calculation program crashes in the middle of the night on a Friday before a 3 day weekend it impacts all employees not just the one who doesn't want to be contacted. Yet in the romantic battle for so-called worker rights everyone could go without a paycheck.

Your colleague for example would not be able to be fired for simply not wanting to be contacted outside working hours and she would also have a case for pay disparity.

US labor regulations define exempt (salaried) and nonexempt (hourly) workers. It's not up to the employee to define the job classification including collecting a salary while treating their job as hourly.

Why shouldn't an employer pay more for someone who is willing to take care of business even if it's outside normal work hours? The employee who is willing to fix the payroll system in the late night so everyone gets paid on time is simply worth more to the company.

Again, this law works perfectly in Europe and hasn't caused companies problems or to flee.

Where is the evidence it works perfectly in Europe?

 

[Peter]

In many jobs being on call is part of the duties. IT is a common example but by no means the only one. The government puts its thumb on the scale with those who want to dictate an adversarial relationship between employer and employee with no contact by law.

When the pay calculation program crashes in the middle of the night on a Friday before a 3 day weekend it impacts all employees not just the one who doesn't want to be contacted. Yet in the romantic battle for so-called worker rights everyone could go without a paycheck.

US labor regulations define exempt (salaried) and nonexempt (hourly) workers. It's not up to the employee to define the job classification including collecting a salary while treating their job as hourly.

Why shouldn't an employer pay more for someone who is willing to take care of business even if it's outside normal work hours? The employee who is willing to fix the payroll system in the late night so everyone gets paid on time is simply worth more to the company.



Where is the evidence it works perfectly in Europe?

The evidence is the fact that these rules are in place in Europe and companies haven't crumbled under the crushing weight of not having staff on call at all times.
Somehow companies in Europe can manage fine working with them.
If a company has time critical components they can pay for people to be on call, they can't just have salaried staff being forced to work for free and then get angry when they refuse.
If you think there's something wrong with that statement then I'm glad I don't have a job in the US where working for free is somehow seen as virtuous.

People have lives outside of work and shouldn't be guilt tripped into missing family events or cancelling holidays simply because a manager decides he wants the person in for some extra work. This law protects people who value their lives outside of work.
If you don't then fair enough but many, many do.