Revealed: Israeli military’s own data indicates civilian death rate of 83% in Gaza war

[dmpi]

No one is claiming 83% of the population has been killed. Perhaps read the article?

83% of those killed are civilians. That is the claim.

You know. I think you're right. My bad. I learn something new everyday.

 

[reinaert]

This is to remind anyone who cares, there is civil war in progress in Sudan where more than 61,000 Sudanese have died in the conflict there.
I realize Muslim-on-Muslim deaths don't mean anything to those fixated on Palestinian deaths in Gaza. Those deaths are a result of Muslims fighting Jews which is a lot more triggering than Muslims killing Muslims.
It is sad how Americans can be fixated on a conflict involving one of our strongest allies in the Middle East and totally ignore another tragic conflict in Africa.
I guess Palestinian Muslims killed in a war are a lot more important than African Muslims caught in a civil war. Are some Muslims valued more highly to Americans than other Muslims?

Death toll from Sudan’s brutal civil war far exceeds previous estimates, study suggests​

“In Khartoum State, between April 2023 and June 2024, the researchers estimate over 61,000 people died of all causes, a 50% increase in the pre-war death rate. Over the same period, it is estimated that there were over 26,000 deaths due to violence in Khartoum State, significantly higher than the 20,178 intentional-injury deaths reported by ACLED for the entire country,” the report said.
ACLED, or Armed Conflict Location & Event Data, is a non-profit organization whose figures are widely used by international organizations, including the United Nations, and national governments.

Death toll from Sudan’s brutal civil war far exceeds previous estimates, study suggests

The number of people killed in Sudan’s civil war is far higher than previously thought, according to new research, as aid agencies warn that conflict has created the world’s worst hunger crisis with millions on the brink of famine

www.voanews.com

Clumsy sleight of hand attempt. So embarrassing for you.

 

[Tigerace117]

If you drive a car with the guys that rob a bank and they kill the guards, you are guilty as well. The people in Gaza elected Hamas to run their lives and they are responsible for that decision. Israel is taking extreme steps in order to ensure that they don't have terror groups trying to kill them day in and day out. The Palestinians in the middle east have been hard at it since 1948 and Israel finally got fed up. Now it's wipe out the terror group. Palestinians could end this today. Hamas surrender, free the remaining hostages, return the bodies of the dead hostages and come to a peace that doesn't include Hamas running the government.

Except Israel has conclusively proven “surrender” would be pointless, as they would simply continue mass murdering Palestinian civilians regardless.

 

[jaypatriot]

Clumsy sleight of hand attempt. So embarrassing for you.

Some people simply cannot understand it is hypocritical to fret over one tragic war and completely ignore another tragic war.
I guess it's because the Gaza war involves Jews trying to defend their country from am implacable enemy trying to destroy it.
Whereas, a Muslim country of 42 million people torn apart by civil war has very little impact on those fretting over a nation of 8 million Jews and Arabs engaged in a war.

 

[jaypatriot]

Systemic racism claims are simple to understand. African Americans are massively over represented in the nations worst socio economic data sets. That means that you either say that AA's are racially 'inferior' because of their race, or you say that society is/has been biased against them to the point that they are being disadvantaged by their race. Personally I think the main issue is that we only really got rid of the overt racism that affected so many AA families just a couple of generations ago. That means that the intergenerational wealth transfers that have benefited and enabled so many non AA's, have only really started in many AA families. That means less access to opportunities (education etc) are still issues for many AA families who are still working through the process of compiling the intergenerational wealth where white people in particular are 200 years ahead in that process. America has an extremely racist past, and we are as far removed from that past as we might think. Maybe in anther 100 years and 3 or 4 more generations we might have shaken off our racist past, but the stats say that we haven't achieved that yet.

The fighting in Gaza is not going to end with any sort of truce. Israel has clearly decided that they want to steal more (all) Palestinian land, and the war will only end with either the completion of Israels genocide, or the removal of the Palestinian people from their land. There is zero reason for Hamas to give up the remaining hostages, because Israel is going to either murder the Palestinians, or totally displace them to steal their land regardless of any deal Hamas offer to make.

You wrote: "Maybe in anther 100 years and 3 or 4 more generations we might have shaken off our racist past, but the stats say that we haven't achieved that yet."
What an excellent excuse for perpetuating racism in America. Let's wait another 100 years before race-baiters and excuse makers consider whether racism has decreased or not. There will always be racism and ethnic strife because humans are stupidly tribal and tribes want to think they are better than other tribes.

You are of the mindset Israel want to destroy all Palestinians. I am not.
If Israel actually wanted to destroy all Palestinians don't you they have the military means to do so? They are doing a lousy job of committing genocide against Palestinians, don't you think?

Hamas does not want to give up. So it must be totally destroyed. No one wants a Gaza strip where the entire cause for the current conflict there was the brutal Hamas terrorists. Well, maybe Hamas wants it and a lot of stupid Palestinians who think it might still be possible to drive Israelis into the sea,

 

[jaypatriot]

Israeli murder forces


Just like Iraqi non deaths mattered more than deaths on Darfur as part of justification for the Iraq 2 invasion.

Or the 1000 deaths of Israelis seems to matter more than the 80 000 Palestinian deaths

I don't know what "an Iraqi non-death is". DId you just make that up?
Obviously, to the Israelis, 1200 slaughtered Israelis and 250 Israeli hostages is more important than Palestinian collateral damage caused by the Hamas has waged war against the IDF.
And I want the IDF to continue killing Hamas because Hamas does not give a shit about dead Palestinians. If they did, they would give up and end the war.
You would think that as humans they might have some sympathy for the deaths of Gazans brought about by the Hamas attack on 10/7/2023.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

I don't know what "an Iraqi non-death is". DId you just make that up?
Obviously, to the Israelis, 1200 slaughtered Israelis and 250 Israeli hostages is more important than Palestinian collateral damage caused by the Hamas has waged war against the IDF.
And I want the IDF to continue killing Hamas because Hamas does not give a shit about dead Palestinians. If they did, they would give up and end the war.
You would think that as humans they might have some sympathy for the deaths of Gazans brought about by the Hamas attack on 10/7/2023.

Part of the justification to invade Iraq was that Saddam had used violence to stop a Kurdish rebellion. Which occurred years before the invasion. While Darfur was seeing deaths regularly and viewed as a potential genocide

 

[AJG]

Some people simply cannot understand it is hypocritical to fret over one tragic war and completely ignore another tragic war.
I guess it's because the Gaza war involves Jews trying to defend their country from am implacable enemy trying to destroy it.
Whereas, a Muslim country of 42 million people torn apart by civil war has very little impact on those fretting over a nation of 8 million Jews and Arabs engaged in a war.

I can't speak for everyone, but I have strong personal connections to the region which is why I care a lot more about this conflict than others. Nearly half the world's Jewish population lives in the US and millions of Arab and Muslim Americans also have connections to the Middle East and other countries in the region like in Egypt/north Africa. That combined with a shared history, strong religious connections to the region, etc makes me think that's true for a lot of other people here as well. On the other hand there are less than 200,000 Sudanese Americans. Not saying we shouldn't care about other conflicts but I wouldn't say its hypocritical or surprising that a conflict in a region people have close ties to is getting a lot more attention.

 

[jaypatriot]

I can't speak for everyone, but I have strong personal connections to the region which is why I care a lot more about this conflict than others. Nearly half the world's Jewish population lives in the US and millions of Arab and Muslim Americans also have connections to the Middle East and other countries in the region like in Egypt/north Africa. That combined with a shared history, strong religious connections to the region, etc makes me think that's true for a lot of other people here as well. On the other hand there are less than 200,000 Sudanese Americans. Not saying we shouldn't care about other conflicts but I wouldn't say its hypocritical or surprising that a conflict in a region people have close ties to is getting a lot more attention.

Good point about a lot fewer Sudanese in this country than Jews and Muslims.
Tribalism triumphs. And if it bleeds it leads.
We never had a connection to the tens of millions of Russians and Chinese who died at the hands of their dictators in the 20th century. They were starved to death.
They might have been fellow human beings but we never saw them or knew them.
Whereas, with Jews and Muslims in our country everyone becomes a political pawn in the eyes of politicians and sympathetic Palestinians and Jews in this country. Every night we see bloodied Palestinians carried in white sheets and women and children weeping over the loss of their loved ones.
And if you don't care much for Jews, then who is going to accused of murder and genocide?

 

[snakestretcher]

It's a pretty effective genocide machine. Stave 'em till they come for food and then shoot 'em.

...and then make feeble propaganda excuses that Hamas did the killing and is stealing the food aid to sell for a profit! Profiting from whom, millions of starving, destitute Palestinian men, women and children?

No Proof Hamas Routinely Stole U.N. Aid, Israeli Military Officials Say

Israel has long restricted aid to Gaza on the argument that Hamas steals it to use as a weapon of control over the population. On Saturday, the Israeli military announced new airdrops of aid.

www.nytimes.com

 

[multivita-man]

Figures from a classified Israeli military intelligence database indicate five out of six Palestinians killed by Israeli forces in Gaza have been civilians, an extreme rate of slaughter rarely matched in recent decades of warfare.

As of May, 19 months into the war, Israeli intelligence officials listed 8,900 named fighters from Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad as dead or “probably dead”, a joint investigation by the Guardian, the Israeli-Palestinian publication +972 Magazine and the Hebrew-language outlet Local Call has found.

At that time 53,000 Palestinians had been killed by Israeli attacks, according to health authorities in Gaza, a toll that included combatants and civilians. Fighters named in the Israeli military intelligence database accounted for just 17% of the total, which indicates that 83% of the dead were civilians.

Revealed: Israeli military’s own data indicates civilian death rate of 83% in Gaza war

Figures from classified IDF database listed 8,900 named fighters as dead or probably dead in May, as overall death toll reached 53,000

www.theguardian.com

Far more journalists have been killed in Israel than in other conflicts, too. Russia has killed far fewer journalists in Ukraine by comparison despite that conflict being much, much larger in terms of its overall deployment scale. Israel knows it can just accuse anyone of being Hamas and that greenlights killing them. They are making no effort whatsoever to limit civilian deaths. To the contrary, they seem to be hellbent on killing as many as they can. This is an ethnic cleansing if the term has any meaning at all. One which the United States is actively supporting and other Western nations are pretending not to see.

 

[snakestretcher]

You wrote: "Maybe in anther 100 years and 3 or 4 more generations we might have shaken off our racist past, but the stats say that we haven't achieved that yet."
What an excellent excuse for perpetuating racism in America. Let's wait another 100 years before race-baiters and excuse makers consider whether racism has decreased or not. There will always be racism and ethnic strife because humans are stupidly tribal and tribes want to think they are better than other tribes.

You are of the mindset Israel want to destroy all Palestinians. I am not.
If Israel actually wanted to destroy all Palestinians don't you they have the military means to do so? They are doing a lousy job of committing genocide against Palestinians, don't you think?

Hamas does not want to give up. So it must be totally destroyed. No one wants a Gaza strip where the entire cause for the current conflict there was the brutal Hamas terrorists. Well, maybe Hamas wants it and a lot of stupid Palestinians who think it might still be possible to drive Israelis into the sea,

Israel wants to destroy Palestine as an entity and state, and that has been the Zionist goal from the outset. You have only to read the Likud party platform of 1977 (which is led by Netanyahu).

"Judea and Samaria will not be handed to any foreign administration; between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty". Netanyahu has routinely rejected any suggestion of accepting and recognising a contiguous Palestinian state, and has openly bragged, on video, about deliberately sabotaging peace talks-notably the Oslo Accords. He isn't interested in peace, but only complete domination of 'Eretz Israel', the Zionist ambition of creating a Jewish ethno-state.

Original Party Platform of the Likud Party

Encyclopedia of Jewish and Israeli history, politics and culture, with biographies, statistics, articles and documents on topics from anti-Semitism to Zionism.

www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org

 

[Surrealistik]

...and then make feeble propaganda excuses that Hamas did the killing and is stealing the food aid to sell for a profit! Profiting from whom, millions of starving, destitute Palestinian men, women and children?

No Proof Hamas Routinely Stole U.N. Aid, Israeli Military Officials Say

Israel has long restricted aid to Gaza on the argument that Hamas steals it to use as a weapon of control over the population. On Saturday, the Israeli military announced new airdrops of aid.

www.nytimes.com

Actually Israel armed, protected and abetted the gangs that were doing the aid looting:

The 'uncharismatic, illiterate' criminal behind Gaza's aid-looting gangs

Violent gangs have been raiding convoys of aid as they are trucked through Gaza, and behind one of the largest groups is a criminal who has reportedly been armed and protected by Israel.

www.abc.net.au

 

[jaypatriot]

Israel wants to destroy Palestine as an entity and state, and that has been the Zionist goal from the outset. You have only to read the Likud party platform of 1977 (which is led by Netanyahu).

"Judea and Samaria will not be handed to any foreign administration; between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty". Netanyahu has routinely rejected any suggestion of accepting and recognising a contiguous Palestinian state, and has openly bragged, on video, about deliberately sabotaging peace talks-notably the Oslo Accords. He isn't interested in peace, but only complete domination of 'Eretz Israel', the Zionist ambition of creating a Jewish ethno-state.

The Palestinian Authority is still committed to destroying ISrael.
Why would Bibi ever agree to a two-state solution with the Palestinians?

Here is a big question for Israel bashers:

Did the PA Ever Revise Its Charter Calling for the Destruction of Israel?​

Dec 3, 2023, 9:39 PM

Biden proposes to give Gaza into the hands of the Palestinian Authority (the PA), based on the presumption that the PA has unequivocally confirmed that it had long ago nullified those articles in the Palestinian National Covenant (also known as the PLO Charter) calling for the destruction of Israel.

But is the PA still technically committed to the destruction of Israel? Unless the PA has officially amended the Palestinian National Covenant, then it is still official PA policy to destroy the State of Israel. So, did they revise the PLO Charter in accordance with the Oslo Accords?

The Blogs: Did the PA Ever Revise Its Charter Calling for the Destruction of Israel?

From the blog of James Cooper at The Times of Israel

blogs.timesofisrael.com