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Report Says North Korea May Be Readying Missile Launch

I see. So those missiles NK is firing are just lies. There's no threat at all to NK and Japan. It's all been manufactured by the Trump machine. Yeah, that's it.

Americans sure are gigantic hypocrites, aren't they, Maggie? Here the US has poisoned many peoples' worlds with their immoral/amoral nuclear tests all over others lands and you think you can deny the Koreans the right to defend themselves from US war crimes and terrorism?

The US was the country that introduced nuclear arms to the Korean peninsula in 1958 in direct contravention of the armistice agreement. The US is well known for breaking treaties and agreements. That's where "white man speaks with forked tongue" comes from.

It's all been 100% manufactured by the USA since 1943/44 when the US aligned with right wing Japanese troops to continue the subjugation of the Korean people under US financed, installed and supported vicious right wing dictatorships .

The USA did the same thing to Vietnam after the US got its butt kicked. They continued their terrorism, economic and military against Vietnam, until Clinton finally stopped the US crimes.
 
Americans sure are gigantic hypocrites, aren't they, Maggie? Here the US has poisoned many peoples' worlds with their immoral/amoral nuclear tests all over others lands and you think you can deny the Koreans the right to defend themselves from US war crimes and terrorism?

The US was the country that introduced nuclear arms to the Korean peninsula in 1958 in direct contravention of the armistice agreement. The US is well known for breaking treaties and agreements. That's where "white man speaks with forked tongue" comes from.

It's all been 100% manufactured by the USA since 1943/44 when the US aligned with right wing Japanese troops to continue the subjugation of the Korean people under US financed, installed and supported vicious right wing dictatorships .

The USA did the same thing to Vietnam after the US got its butt kicked. They continued their terrorism, economic and military against Vietnam, until Clinton finally stopped the US crimes.

You've got it all over me in the history dept, but I do know that NK agreed to six UN resolutions they're now violating...
 
what causes that position to not be aligned with china's national interests?
it has told NK that if it starts something china will not come to its aid
it tells tRump that if he starts something, the USA can expect china to intervene militarily
and in the meantime, china keeps its buffer from SK and the USA is spending its dollars developing the military capacity to respond while china is spending its capital developing more trading partners



1. how does china's position that it will not defend NK in the event of a first strike encourage such a first strike?
2. if NK does initiate the first strike, how was that china's responsibility?


no they haven't
the analogy is that the USA is responsible when israel conducts its military first strikes at targets in the middle east
and we are not


there is no gun to your head
it is more like NK has issued itself a concealed carry permit and has let everybody know it so they do not have to use it


that sentence makes NO sense. it implies china wins either way by (a) saving face and by (b) gaining stature
you may want to revisit that nonsensical assertion

What causes the position to not align is that if NK, completely under China's control, actually attacks first, it is as much a declaration of war by NK, as it is by China.

Suggesting the West must absorb what now could be a H-Bomb, before being allowed to respond is a completely unacceptable position.

China needs to remove the threat on it's own, and had better do it sooner, rather than later.
 
If we hadn't "Lied ourselves" into WWII you'd be speaking German.

Always great with the propagandist memes. The USA got into WWII because they saw a grand opportunity to steal away the European nations' colonies. That's the USA, Renae, you know the one that advances democracy, the one that brings freedom to the poor and huddled masses.

Russia was the one that really suffered. The USA made out like a bandit, doing business with the Nazis and the countries fighting the Nazis.
 
Americans sure are gigantic hypocrites, aren't they, Maggie? Here the US has poisoned many peoples' worlds with their immoral/amoral nuclear tests all over others lands and you think you can deny the Koreans the right to defend themselves from US war crimes and terrorism?

The US was the country that introduced nuclear arms to the Korean peninsula in 1958 in direct contravention of the armistice agreement. The US is well known for breaking treaties and agreements. That's where "white man speaks with forked tongue" comes from.

It's all been 100% manufactured by the USA since 1943/44 when the US aligned with right wing Japanese troops to continue the subjugation of the Korean people under US financed, installed and supported vicious right wing dictatorships .

The USA did the same thing to Vietnam after the US got its butt kicked. They continued their terrorism, economic and military against Vietnam, until Clinton finally stopped the US crimes.

The US of the past is not relevant. You seem to focus on that. Today it is the US of today. NK can be viewed by many as an existential threat to the US.
 
He's right you know, Vietnam was one of the most militarily botched wars in history. Take the Tet Offensive, I bet most people on this board would think even today, that was a military defeat, it wasn't. The Vietcong got their asses handed to them... but it's seen as a defeat because of politics (Thank you Walter, I hope you burn in the fiery pits of hell Cronkite)

Nixon is burning in hell for his treason in sabotaging the peace talks during the 1968 election, costing us 22,000 more lives and hundreds of thousands more wounded warriors ...
 
You've got it all over me in the history dept, but I do know that NK agreed to six UN resolutions they're now violating...

Are you aware of the resolutions that the USA has been completely out of touch with virtually the whole world on?

Are you aware that the US has been condemned for the last quarter century by the UNGA [UN General Assembly] for US terrorism against Cuba, votes have been in the range of 198 to 2 [Israel and the US voting 'no']?

Are you aware that the US is the only country to ever have been convicted of international terrorism, Nicaragua versus the USA 1986, and the USA refused to abide by the decision?

The USA carpet bombed, saturation bombed, napalmed the people of the north of Korea [south too] dropping more bombs, killing more people than in Japan in all of WWII. Why do you think they should trust the USA? Many of the people of the south of Korea don't.

Are you aware that there was a US war crimes against Korea tribunal in New York City in the 1990s and the US prevented many Korean delegates from attending? There evidence was presented describing the massive war crimes committed by the US against all the people of Korea.

Have you heard about that from your news media, have you read that in your history books?
 
The US of the past is not relevant. You seem to focus on that. Today it is the US of today. NK can be viewed by many as an existential threat to the US.

The past of the US is highly relevant because the past of the US is the PRESENT of the US. The USA has been the same since at least the turn of the 20th century.

Can you say Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Syria, Nicaragua, ... ?
 
Are you aware of the resolutions that the USA has been completely out of touch with virtually the whole world on?

Are you aware that the US has been condemned for the last quarter century by the UNGA [UN General Assembly] for US terrorism against Cuba, votes have been in the range of 198 to 2 [Israel and the US voting 'no']?

Are you aware that the US is the only country to ever have been convicted of international terrorism, Nicaragua versus the USA 1986, and the USA refused to abide by the decision?

The USA carpet bombed, saturation bombed, napalmed the people of the north of Korea [south too] dropping more bombs, killing more people than in Japan in all of WWII. Why do you think they should trust the USA? Many of the people of the south of Korea don't.

Are you aware that there was a US war crimes against Korea tribunal in New York City in the 1990s and the US prevented many Korean delegates from attending? There evidence was presented describing the massive war crimes committed by the US against all the people of Korea.

Have you heard about that from your news media, have you read that in your history books?

No, no, no and no. You've got me there. I don't even know what to say.
 
Always great with the propagandist memes. The USA got into WWII because they saw a grand opportunity to steal away the European nations' colonies. That's the USA, Renae, you know the one that advances democracy, the one that brings freedom to the poor and huddled masses.

Russia was the one that really suffered. The USA made out like a bandit, doing business with the Nazis and the countries fighting the Nazis.

My British Mother lived through Hitler's bombing of London. Good thing Americans favoring Germany kept us out of WWII until the USA provoked Japan, huh?

Good thing we lost all those merchant marines keeping Great Britain afloat, causing Hitler's deranged brain to attack the USSR ...
 
What causes the position to not align is that if NK, completely under China's control, actually attacks first, it is as much a declaration of war by NK, as it is by China.

Completely silly. China is doing what responsible nations do, attempting to stop what could be huge bloodshed. That is not something the US has ever cared one whit about - 3 million Vietnam; 3 million Korea; 1 million Cambodia; maybe 2 million more Cambodia; 1 plus million Indonesia; ...

Suggesting the West must absorb what now could be a H-Bomb, before being allowed to respond is a completely unacceptable position.

China needs to remove the threat on it's own, and had better do it sooner, rather than later.

Nobody with a brain thinks that Korea will unilaterally try to bomb anyone. If the USA acted like a real nation, not the rogue nation it is, peace could come easily to the Korean people. The US is really frightened that peace will bring out the truth of what the USA did to the Korean people. Actually much of the truth is out, but as always, it's buried by the US news media, the US propaganda system.
 
The US of the past is not relevant. You seem to focus on that. Today it is the US of today. NK can be viewed by many as an existential threat to the US.

I think that from the standpoint of Kim Jong Un, the US of the past is very relevant. Especially it's long history of instigating regime change when it comes to leaders who for whatever reason are disinclined to play ball with Washington and/or Wall Street. The example of Saddam Hussein is probably looming pretty large in the vicious little Butterball's thinking.

He is also no doubt aware that the United States understandably favors short surgical operations against opponents who won't put up much of a fight. Ergo his mad dash for nuclear capability. Whether or not Kim is up to this game is an open question. I don't think he is. I don't think Trump is either.
 
ocean515 said:
China could end this dangerous situation at any time, but they haven't. I wonder why that is? What game is Xi playing?

There are a great many answers to this question. China is executing a multi-pronged strategy against us, formulated by Mao Zedong and Zhou Enlai. They used the normalization of relations to their advantage, knowing that they could create a new financial order by providing endless waves of cheap labor, the money flowing in the form of wages paid by western companies into China following Nixon's visit in 1972 has been used to purchase U.S. debt, and also U.S. property. Our position has weakened, and theirs strengthened by this long process.

In the meantime, NK is a valuable proxy--which is exactly why they will remain neutral if NK launches a strike against us, but will not be neutral if we attack NK. They test our resolve and actual intentions in the region. They work as a distraction from the larger process at work. And if they do manage to cripple us (suppose, for example, they are crazy enough to take out Chicago or Los Angeles), they cripple our economy to the point that we would have a hard time answering military aggression on the part of China. China, in turn, could expand into Japan, Indonesia, the South Pacific, and Southeast Asia. They might also march into the Middle East to sieze the mineral wealth of that region, though they would have to compete with Russia, and possibly India, to do so.

Trump's instinct to challenge China is exactly correct from a "great game" perspective. He hasn't actually made it policy to do so, but we should have challenged them long ago. If we do get in a war with China, at least we will have a pretext to void our debts to them.
 
My British Mother lived through Hitler's bombing of London. Good thing Americans favoring Germany kept us out of WWII until the USA provoked Japan, huh?

Good thing we lost all those merchant marines keeping Great Britain afloat, causing Hitler's deranged brain to attack the USSR ...

Those aren't good things but they are reality. What about the myriad good things the US has directly done to Vietnam, Korea, Cambodia, Laos, Nicaragua, Guatemala, Angola, Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, ... .

Would those merchant marines lost have totaled in the millions?

Did your British mother instill in you a sense of honesty, compassion for others?
 
Those aren't good things but they are reality. What about the myriad good things the US has directly done to Vietnam, Korea, Cambodia, Laos, Nicaragua, Guatemala, Angola, Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, ... .

Would those merchant marines lost have totaled in the millions?

Did your British mother instill in you a sense of honesty, compassion for others?

My older Vietnam friends would still be around without Nixon's treason during the 1968 election and the garbage pharmaceuticals fed to them by the VA when they got home.

Asking about what my British Mother instilled in me certainly crosses every line ...
 
No, no, no and no. You've got me there. I don't even know what to say.

You might consider that the USA isn't all it is cracked up to be. Why should the USA be allowed to terrorize the people of Korea? Of Cuba? Of Nicaragua? Of Vietnam? Of Cambodia? Of Indonesia?

How would you like it if your entire life was one of abject poverty and deprivation because some powerful country was trying to decide how your country should be run?
 
My British Mother lived through Hitler's bombing of London. Good thing Americans favoring Germany kept us out of WWII until the USA provoked Japan, huh?

Good thing we lost all those merchant marines keeping Great Britain afloat, causing Hitler's deranged brain to attack the USSR ...

I've got this weird idea that one man may have won WW2. I don't even know his name- the guy who shot Reinhard Heydrich in Yugoslavia. Hitler further delayed Operation Barbarossa, which had already been delayed by weather, so he could wreak vengeance for the death of his favourite. The failure of the invasion of Russia was the turning point of the war.
 
My older Vietnam friends would still be around without Nixon's treason during the 1968 election and the garbage pharmaceuticals fed to them by the VA when they got home.

Some ten millions slaughtered by the USA in SE Asia and it's still always about you and yours and the USA. Can't you folks grasp that this incredible conceit is not a virtue?
 
Always great with the propagandist memes. The USA got into WWII because they saw a grand opportunity to steal away the European nations' colonies. That's the USA, Renae, you know the one that advances democracy, the one that brings freedom to the poor and huddled masses.

Russia was the one that really suffered. The USA made out like a bandit, doing business with the Nazis and the countries fighting the Nazis.
You got some bad education.
 
If Trump keeps giving our allies the middle finger and thinking the big bad USA can go alone, we are are going to be up **** creek all alone.

So much for Trumpanzes thinking his chest thumping caused NK to back down.

There's no middle finger here - America's taking it on the chin for South Korea - the whole reason the North is targeting the US mainland with ICBMs is because America's supporting South Korea. If the South wants America to put itself in harm's way, they can trade fairly with the US and not rely on special concessions. If the South doesn't want a fair relationship where they pull their weight, then the US can pack up its troops and go home. Then the South can deal with the North and its nukes all by themselves. America doesn't have to be a beast of burden, but you don't seem to understand that.
 
There's no middle finger here - America's taking it on the chin for South Korea - the whole reason the North is targeting the US mainland with ICBMs is because America's supporting South Korea. If the South wants America to put itself in harm's way, they can trade fairly with the US and not rely on special concessions. If the South doesn't want a fair relationship where they pull their weight, then the US can pack up its troops and go home. Then the South can deal with the North and its nukes all by themselves. America doesn't have to be a beast of burden, but you don't seem to understand that.

Many of the people of the south of Korea want the US to go home. And why wouldn't they, after the US slaughtered so many of their friends and relatives in the US/Rhee post 1944 massacres?

Cumings said he was able to draw upon a lot of South Korean research that has come out since the nation democratized in the 1990s about the massacres of Korean civilians. This has been the subject of painstaking research by the Truth and Reconciliation Commission in Seoul and Cumings describes the results as “horrific.” Atrocities by “our side, the South Koreans (ran) six to one ahead of the North Koreans in terms of killing civilians, whereas most Americans would think North Koreans would just as soon kill a civilian to look at him.” The numbers of civilians killed in South Korea by the government, Cumings said, even dwarfed Spaniards murdered by dictator Francisco Franco, the general who overthrew the Madrid government in the 1936-1939 civil war. Cumings said about 100,000 South Koreans were killed in political violence between 1945 and 1950 and perhaps as many as 200,000 more were killed during the early months of the war. This compares to about 200,000 civilians put to death in Spain in Franco’s political massacres. In all, Korea suffered 3 million civilian dead during the 1950-53 war, more killed than the 2.7 million Japan suffered during all of World War II.

One of the worst atrocities was perpetrated by the South Korean police at the small city of Tae Jun. They executed 7,000 political prisoners while Central Intelligence Agency and U.S. military officials looked on, Cumings said. To compound the crime, the Pentagon blamed the atrocity on the Communists, Cumings said. “The Joint Chiefs of Staff classified the photographs of it because they make it clear who’s doing it, and they don’t let the photographs out until 1999 when a Korean finally got them declassified.” To top that off, the historian says, “the Pentagon did a video movie called ‘Crime of Korea’ where you see shots of pits that go on for like a football field, pit after pit of dead people, and (actor) Humphrey Bogart in a voice-over says, ‘someday the Communists will pay for this, someday we’ll get the full totals and believe me we’ll get the exact, accurate totals of the people murdered here and we will make these war criminals pay.’ Now this is a complete reversal of black and white, done as a matter of policy.” Cumings adds that these events represent “a very deep American responsibility for the regime that we promoted, really more than any other in East Asia (and that) was our creation in the late Forties.” Other atrocities, such as the one at No Gun village, Cumings terms “an American massacre of women and children,” which he lays at the feet of the U.S. military.

The Korean War: The ?Unknown War?. The Coverup of US War Crimes | Global Research - Centre for Research on Globalization
 
You got some bad education.

Evidently, you got none, save for the grand propaganda spiel.

You can always tell this, Renae, because these are the lame types of memes that are thrown back.
 
I hinted at it in the last sentence. I would think that is just one of many things. China has become dependent on the West. It has complete control of NK. If it doesn't do something about the real threat, China, IMO will be the big loser.

you keep saying china will lose by failing to make NK heel
but you never say in what way it will lose, or why that will be the result
if you have a magic 8 ball, and nothing else, let us know that
 
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