What opinions of yours changed and why did they change?Refugee from another another "discussion" site, didn't notice this forum when I signed up last weekend. Became an Ivory Tower Libertarian in College, called myself a Pragmatic Religious Libertarian for years as Real Life ground away at the edges, until I've recently admitted I've turned into a (mostly) Conservative.
That might be an upgrade, tbh
What opinions of yours changed and why did they change?
Of course depending on today's definition of "conservative".That might be an upgrade, tbh
While I completely disagree with all of those positions, this is not the thread for all that. Im sure we will get into it in other threadsNot so much a change of opinion when it comes to theory as a recognition that reality is messier than any theory can truly explain--the map is not the territory. So, for example, while theoretically I can recognize that banning sex outside of marriage only when money exchanges hands doesn't make much sense (just how is the cash supposed to make a major moral difference from a college-age modern dollymop?), in the real world legal prostitution makes investigating and prosecuting sex slavery much more difficult. While theoretically we shouldn't be the world's policeman, in the real world the American Protectorate has made the world a wealthier, more free, more peaceful place. While theoretically marriage is a personal decision whose continuation should be left purely to the couple, in the real world no-fault divorce has been a disaster and marriage is the fundamental building block of society in which, therefore, society has a vested interest.
My condolences.Refugee from another another "discussion" site, didn't notice this forum when I signed up last weekend. Became an Ivory Tower Libertarian in College, called myself a Pragmatic Religious Libertarian for years as Real Life ground away at the edges, until I've recently admitted I've turned into a (mostly) Conservative.
Allow me to challenge your conclusions, Doug.Not so much a change of opinion when it comes to theory as a recognition that reality is messier than any theory can truly explain--the map is not the territory.
Does it? Why? As we know from the countries that have long had legalized prostitution, legal prostitutes are regulated. Their business is open to scrutiny, they meet with social workers and they meet with healthcare workers. They are, in fact, less likely to be sex slaves. Sexual slavery thrives in those countries that do not have legal prostitution! Sexual slavery is most prevalent in southern Europe, such as in the Balkan States. But the countries where prostitution is legal ?? In Germany, Netherlands, Austria, Switzerland, et al, it is NOT a widespread problem.So, for example, while theoretically I can recognize that banning sex outside of marriage only when money exchanges hands doesn't make much sense (just how is the cash supposed to make a major moral difference from a college-age modern dollymop?), in the real world legal prostitution makes investigating and prosecuting sex slavery much more difficult.
Another fallacy. We'd all love to believe it, but the hard evidence actually runs 180 degrees from that conclusion. In fact, over the past 20+ years, our military adventurism, albeit well intentioned, has produced anything but, and we need look no further than the Middle East and Central Asia to conclude that. For example, under the pretext of saving Iraqis from the tyrant Saddam Hussein, the US has been directly responsible for more than 200,000 civilian deaths in that country, and 5 million displaced persons, half of which became refugees in neighboring countries before 2010. The reverberations of our myopic actions echo to this day in the cultivation of more and larger terrorist organization, and terrorist bombings of civilians continues today, nearly 19 years after our American Protectorate actions to "save" them.While theoretically we shouldn't be the world's policeman, in the real world the American Protectorate has made the world a wealthier, more free, more peaceful place.
Vague and dubious contentions, and no counterpoint to your own assertion that marriage "should be left purely to the couple". Surely your not suggesting that "the State" should have any say in whether or not a couple remains married ... are you? Explain how no-fault divorce is more of a disaster than people being somehow compelled to remain in a marriage that often serves neither of their best interests. It should seem obvious that continued strained relationships between spouses unable to separate leads to much more domestic abuse and violence, including spouses killing each other. I'd call that a disaster!While theoretically marriage is a personal decision whose continuation should be left purely to the couple, in the real world no-fault divorce has been a disaster and marriage is the fundamental building block of society in which, therefore, society has a vested interest.
Allow me to challenge your conclusions, Doug.
Hi @Doug64! Welcome
Welcome...
Welcome to DP!
Refugee from another another "discussion" site, didn't notice this forum when I signed up last weekend. Became an Ivory Tower Libertarian in College, called myself a Pragmatic Religious Libertarian for years as Real Life ground away at the edges, until I've recently admitted I've turned into a (mostly) Conservative.
While I completely disagree with all of those positions, this is not the thread for all that. Im sure we will get into it in other threads
Thank you for answering my question in such detail and welcome to the forum!
in the real world legal prostitution makes investigating and prosecuting sex slavery much more difficult.
Not so much a change of opinion when it comes to theory as a recognition that reality is messier than any theory can truly explain--the map is not the territory. So, for example, while theoretically I can recognize that banning sex outside of marriage only when money exchanges hands doesn't make much sense (just how is the cash supposed to make a major moral difference from a college-age modern dollymop?), in the real world legal prostitution makes investigating and prosecuting sex slavery much more difficult. While theoretically we shouldn't be the world's policeman, in the real world the American Protectorate has made the world a wealthier, more free, more peaceful place. While theoretically marriage is a personal decision whose continuation should be left purely to the couple, in the real world no-fault divorce has been a disaster and marriage is the fundamental building block of society in which, therefore, society has a vested interest.
Yes, compromising your principles definitely makes you more of a conservative than a libertarian.
I have a libertarian friend who's in love with Ron Paul. Though I like Paul, I find him unrealistic. He speaks the truth, but in a world that's passed him by.
Not so much a change of opinion when it comes to theory as a recognition that reality is messier than any theory can truly explain--the map is not the territory. So, for example, while theoretically I can recognize that banning sex outside of marriage only when money exchanges hands doesn't make much sense (just how is the cash supposed to make a major moral difference from a college-age modern dollymop?), in the real world legal prostitution makes investigating and prosecuting sex slavery much more difficult. While theoretically we shouldn't be the world's policeman, in the real world the American Protectorate has made the world a wealthier, more free, more peaceful place. While theoretically marriage is a personal decision whose continuation should be left purely to the couple, in the real world no-fault divorce has been a disaster and marriage is the fundamental building block of society in which, therefore, society has a vested interest.
Believing your traditionalist principles should be enforced by the state makes one more of a conservative than a libertarian.
What about libertarian socialism?But also the hypocrisy. Like socialism, conservatism is a failure. It goes against human nature.
What about libertarian socialism?
But also the hypocrisy. Like socialism, conservatism is a failure. It goes against human nature.
That's what most libertarians are. Conservatives in denial.Refugee from another another "discussion" site, didn't notice this forum when I signed up last weekend. Became an Ivory Tower Libertarian in College, called myself a Pragmatic Religious Libertarian for years as Real Life ground away at the edges, until I've recently admitted I've turned into a (mostly) Conservative.
Thats an oxymoron.
Every time I see someone flying a Gadson flag and then the thin blue line flag bellow it I lose a year off my life expectancy. I recon I have a few years left to live.That's what most libertarians are. Conservatives in denial.
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