Reagan’s Atrocities

[Tigerace117]

A lot of people on the right are rather found of Ronald Reagan, due to a wide variety of myths such as him “bringing down the USSR”(the simple truth is that had Gorbachev chosen to use force to keep the USSR together, he could have done it, and Reagan couldn’t have done anything but sit back and watch impotently— the USSR collapsed due to domestic factors far more than anything else)

Of course, in reality Ronald Reagan’s foreign policy decisions were utterly vile and warranted him and those who obeyed his orders a trial at The Hague and a stint in a prison cell. For example;

1) Reagan backed the genocidal dictator of Guatemala, Efrain Rios Montt. Montt, who had taken power in a coup, and in a relatively few months, unleashed a vicious reign of terror.

“ Critics have argued that, in practice, Ríos Montt's strategy amounted to a scorched earth campaign targeted against the indigenous Maya population, particularly in the departments of Quiché, Huehuetenango, and Baja Verapaz. According to the 1999 report by the UN-sponsored Historical Clarification Commission (CEH), this resulted in the annihilation of nearly 600 villages. One instance was the Plan de Sánchez massacre in Rabinal, Baja Verapaz, in July 1982, which saw over 250 people killed. Tens of thousands of peasant farmers fled over the border into southern Mexico. In 1982, an Amnesty International report estimated that over 10,000 indigenous Guatemalans and peasant farmers were killed from March to July of that year, and that 100,000 rural villagers were forced to flee their homes.[26] According to more recent estimates presented by the CEH, tens of thousands of non-combatants were killed during Ríos Montt's tenure as head of state. At the height of the bloodshed, reports put the number of disappearances and killings at more than 3,000 per month.[27] The 1999 book State Violence in Guatemala, 1960-1996: A Quantitative Reflection, published by the American Association for the Advancement of Science, states that Rios Montt's government presided over "the most indiscriminate period of state terror. More state killings occurred during Ríos Montt’s regime than during any other, and in the same period the monthly rate of violence was more than four times greater than for the next highest regime."[28]”

Efraín Ríos Montt - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Despite the fact that we knew full well that the Guatemalans were dumping bodies all over the country, Reagan continued pouring aid ina ns declared “ President Ríos Montt is a man of great personal integrity and commitment... I know he wants to improve the quality of life for all Guatemalans and to promote social justice."[45][46]”

2) Reagan also waged an undeclared war against the government of Nicaragua. He did this by arming and funding a gang of gloried drug dealers known as the Contras, who proceeded to commit a wide variety of atrocities with the full support— indeed, actively encouragement—of the CIA.

“ The United States began to support Contra activities against the Sandinista government by December 1981, with the CIA at the forefront of operations. The CIA supplied the funds and the equipment, coordinated training programs, and provided intelligence and target lists. While the Contras had little military successes, they did prove adept at carrying out CIA guerrilla warfare strategies from training manuals which advised them to incite mob violence, "neutralize" civilian leaders and government officials and attack "soft targets" — including schools, health clinics and cooperatives. The agency added to the Contras' sabotage efforts by blowing up refineries and pipelines, and mining ports.[12][58][59]”

“ Americas Watch, which subsequently became part of Human Rights Watch, accused the Contras of:[91]

targeting health care clinics and health care workers for assassination[92]

kidnapping civilians[93]

torturing civilians[94]

executing civilians, including children, who were captured in combat[95]

raping women[92]

indiscriminately attacking civilians and civilian houses[93]

seizing civilian property[92]

burning civilian houses in captured towns.[92]

Human Rights Watch released a report on the situation in 1989, which stated: "[The] contras were major and systematic violators of the most basic standards of the laws of armed conflict, including by launching indiscriminate attacks on civilians, selectively murdering non-combatants, and mistreating prisoners."[96]

Contras - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Reagan administration, of course, lied it’s ass off trying to defend the Contras, pumping vast amounts of aid into the group and engaging in “white propaganda” operations to clean up their image and hysterical fearmongering about “communist plots”.

 

[Tigerace117]

Reagan didn’t stop there, of course. Argentina was in the midst of a period of dictatorship during which the junta in charge “disappeared” and murdered numerous innocent people, including multiple US citizens— all of which was covered up by the United States government, which saw the Argentines as doing an “excellent job wiping out the left”. Their atrocities, however, had reached the point where the Carter administration felt deeply uncomfortable providing such support and distanced itself. But by 1981 the Reagan admin was in town, and such concerns were trifling to them.

“ The Reagan administration, whose first term began in 1981, asserted that the previous Carter administration had weakened U.S. diplomatic relationships with Cold War allies in Argentina and reversed the previous administration's official condemnation of the junta's human rights practices. The re-establishment of diplomatic ties allowed for CIA collaboration with the Argentine intelligence service in training and arming the Nicaraguan Contras against the Sandinista government. The 601 Intelligence Battalion, for example, trained Contras at Lepaterique base in Honduras.[155]”

Dirty War - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

In Pakistan, meanwhile, the government was yet another brutal dictatorship under Muhammad Zia-up-Haq, who oversaw widespread stripping away of Pakistanis’ rights and increased “Islamization” of the country’s legal code and culture.

“ In one of his first and most controversial measures to Islamize Pakistani society was the replacement of parts of the Pakistan Penal Code (PPC) with the 1979 "Hudood Ordinance."[103] (Hudood meaning limits or restrictions, as in limits of acceptable behavior in Islamic law.) The Ordinance added new criminal offences of adultery and fornication to Pakistani law, and new punishments of whipping, amputation, and stoning to death.
In a 1979 address to the nation, Zia decried the Western culture and music in the country. Soon afterwards, PTV, the national television network ceased playing music videos and only patriotic songs were broadcast.[115] New taxes were levied on the film industry and most of the cinemas in Lahore were shut down.[116] New tax rates were introduced, further decreasing cinema attendances.[116]

Although ostensibly only holding office until free elections could be held, General Zia, like the previous military governments, disapproved of the lack of discipline and orderliness that often accompanies multiparty "parliamentary democracy." He preferred a "presidential" form of government[64] and a system of decision making by technical experts, or "technocracy". His first replacement for the parliament or National Assembly was a Majlis-e-Shoora, or "consultative council." After banning all political parties in 1979 he disbanded Parliament and at the end of 1981 set up the majlis, which was to act as a sort of board of advisors to the President and assist with the process of Islamization.[65] The 350 members of the Shoora were to be nominated by the President and possessed only the power to consult with him,[64] and in reality served only to endorse decisions already taken by the government.[64][66]”

Zia-ul-Haq - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Reagan didn’t mind that either; there was an insurgency to fund in Afghanistan, don’t ya know. Vast amounts of aid thus poured into Pakistan to be funneled to the Afghan rebels with little to no oversight of any sort, which later enabled leftover Stinger missiles to find their way into the hands of all manner of groups......such as North Korea.

 

[Tigerace117]

And then, of course, we have Saddam Hussein. When Iraq’s army failed to win its swift victory as anticipated and started being driven back out of Iran, the Reagan administration was horrified. After all, Iraq was supposed to win the war and crush the regime which had just humiliated America, not get its ass kicked. The US provided Iraq with all manner of support, from intelligence

“In March, President Reagan signed National Security Study Memorandum (NSSM) 4-82—seeking "a review of U.S. policy toward the Middle East"—and in June Reagan signed a National Security Decision Directive (NSDD) co-written by Teicher, who was now at the NSC, which determined: "The United States could not afford to allow Iraq to lose the war to Iran."[33][35] Pursuant to this Directive, Thomas Twetten arrived in Baghdad on July 27 to share CIA satellite imagery on Iranian troop movements with the Iraqi Mukhabarat.

This was "the first U.S. provision of intelligence to Iraq," and sparked a short-lived debate over whether Iraq would tolerate a CIA presence in the country: Mukhabarat head Barzan Tikriti told Twetten to "get the hell out of Iraq," but Iraqi military intelligence—"having already drooled over it and having said repeatedly how valuable it was"—subsequently informed Twetten "we'll continue to look at your information, and we'll assess whether it is of use to us in any way."[32] Reports of Iraq's use of chemical weapons against Iran reached the CIA as early as 1983, but the U.S. took no action to restrain Iraq's violations of international law, failing even to alert the UN.[36] By November 1983, the State Department had been briefed on Iraq's "almost daily use of [chemical weapons]".[37]

To weaponry

“ According to Teicher's 1995 affidavit and separate interviews with former Reagan and Bush administration officials, the CIA secretly directed armaments and hi-tech components to Iraq through false fronts and friendly third parties such as Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Kuwait, and they quietly encouraged rogue arms dealers and other private military companies to do the same:
[T]he United States actively supported the Iraqi war effort by supplying the Iraqis with billions of dollars of credits, by providing U.S. military intelligence and advice to the Iraqis, and by closely monitoring third country arms sales to Iraq to make sure that Iraq had the military weaponry required. The United States also provided strategic operational advice to the Iraqis to better use their assets in combat ... The CIA, including both CIA Director Casey and Deputy Director Gates, knew of, approved of, and assisted in the sale of non-U.S. origin military weapons, ammunition and vehicles to Iraq. My notes, memoranda and other documents in my NSC files show or tend to show that the CIA knew of, approved of, and assisted in the sale of non-U.S. origin military weapons, munitions and vehicles to Iraq.[38]”

To BIOLOGICAL WEAPONS.

On February 9, 1994, Senator Riegle delivered a report—commonly known as the Riegle Report—in which it was stated that "pathogenic (meaning 'disease producing'), toxigenic (meaning 'poisonous'), and other biological research materials were exported to Iraq pursuant to application and licensing by the U.S. Department of Commerce." It added: "These exported biological materials were not attenuated or weakened and were capable of reproduction."[48] The report then detailed 70 shipments (including anthrax) from the United States to Iraqi government agencies over three years, concluding "It was later learned that these microorganisms exported by the United States were identical to those the UN inspectors found and recovered from the Iraqi biological warfare program."[49]

Donald Riegle, Chairman of the Senate committee that authored the aforementioned Riegle Report, said:
U.N. inspectors had identified many United States manufactured items that had been exported from the United States to Iraq under licenses issued by the Department of Commerce, and [established] that these items were used to further Iraq's chemical and nuclear weapons development and its missile delivery system development programs. ... The executive branch of our government approved 771 different export licenses for sale of dual-use technology to Iraq. I think that is a devastating record.

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control sent Iraq 14 separate agents "with biological warfare significance," according to Riegle's investigators.[50]“

Even when the Iraqi Air Force attacked an American frigate, the US’ response was to blame......Iran.

“Washington used the incident to pressure Iran, which it later blamed for the whole situation. President Ronald Reagan said "We've never considered them [Iraq's military] hostile at all", and "the villain in the piece is Iran".[14][15][16]

USS Stark incident - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[mrjurrs]

A lot of people on the right are rather found of Ronald Reagan, due to a wide variety of myths such as him “bringing down the USSR”(the simple truth is that had Gorbachev chosen to use force to keep the USSR together, he could have done it, and Reagan couldn’t have done anything but sit back and watch impotently— the USSR collapsed due to domestic factors far more than anything else)

Of course, in reality Ronald Reagan’s foreign policy decisions were utterly vile and warranted him and those who obeyed his orders a trial at The Hague and a stint in a prison cell. For example;

1) Reagan backed the genocidal dictator of Guatemala, Efrain Rios Montt. Montt, who had taken power in a coup, and in a relatively few months, unleashed a vicious reign of terror.

“ Critics have argued that, in practice, Ríos Montt's strategy amounted to a scorched earth campaign targeted against the indigenous Maya population, particularly in the departments of Quiché, Huehuetenango, and Baja Verapaz. According to the 1999 report by the UN-sponsored Historical Clarification Commission (CEH), this resulted in the annihilation of nearly 600 villages. One instance was the Plan de Sánchez massacre in Rabinal, Baja Verapaz, in July 1982, which saw over 250 people killed. Tens of thousands of peasant farmers fled over the border into southern Mexico. In 1982, an Amnesty International report estimated that over 10,000 indigenous Guatemalans and peasant farmers were killed from March to July of that year, and that 100,000 rural villagers were forced to flee their homes.[26] According to more recent estimates presented by the CEH, tens of thousands of non-combatants were killed during Ríos Montt's tenure as head of state. At the height of the bloodshed, reports put the number of disappearances and killings at more than 3,000 per month.[27] The 1999 book State Violence in Guatemala, 1960-1996: A Quantitative Reflection, published by the American Association for the Advancement of Science, states that Rios Montt's government presided over "the most indiscriminate period of state terror. More state killings occurred during Ríos Montt’s regime than during any other, and in the same period the monthly rate of violence was more than four times greater than for the next highest regime."[28]”

Efraín Ríos Montt - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Despite the fact that we knew full well that the Guatemalans were dumping bodies all over the country, Reagan continued pouring aid ina ns declared “ President Ríos Montt is a man of great personal integrity and commitment... I know he wants to improve the quality of life for all Guatemalans and to promote social justice."[45][46]”

2) Reagan also waged an undeclared war against the government of Nicaragua. He did this by arming and funding a gang of gloried drug dealers known as the Contras, who proceeded to commit a wide variety of atrocities with the full support— indeed, actively encouragement—of the CIA.

Reagan was Governor of CA before that. He also said...
"I think, too, that we’ve got to recognize that where the preservation of a natural resource like the redwoods is concerned, that there is a common sense limit. I mean, if you’ve looked at a hundred thousand acres or so of trees — you know, a tree is a tree, how many more do you need to look at?"

and in regards to Vietnam war protestors...
"If it takes a bloodbath, then let's get it over with."

I wonder how many people that question President Biden's mental health were perfectly fine with President Reagan's?
"In it, Ron Reagan describes his growing sense of alarm over his father's mental condition, beginning as early as three years into his first term. He recalls the presidential debate with Walter Mondale on 7 October 1984. My heart sank as he floundered his way through his responses, fumbling with his notes, uncharacteristically lost for words. He looked tired and bewildered," Ron Reagan writes.

Ronald Reagan had Alzheimer's while president, says son

Son Ron Reagan's claim that Ronald Reagan had Alzheimer's while in office leads to war of words with half brother Michael

www.theguardian.com

 

[Tigerace117]

Reagan was Governor of CA before that. He also said...
"I think, too, that we’ve got to recognize that where the preservation of a natural resource like the redwoods is concerned, that there is a common sense limit. I mean, if you’ve looked at a hundred thousand acres or so of trees — you know, a tree is a tree, how many more do you need to look at?"

and in regards to Vietnam war protestors...
"If it takes a bloodbath, then let's get it over with."

I wonder how many people that question President Biden's mental health were perfectly fine with President Reagan's?
"In it, Ron Reagan describes his growing sense of alarm over his father's mental condition, beginning as early as three years into his first term. He recalls the presidential debate with Walter Mondale on 7 October 1984. My heart sank as he floundered his way through his responses, fumbling with his notes, uncharacteristically lost for words. He looked tired and bewildered," Ron Reagan writes.

Ronald Reagan had Alzheimer's while president, says son

Son Ron Reagan's claim that Ronald Reagan had Alzheimer's while in office leads to war of words with half brother Michael

www.theguardian.com

I knew he did a lot of shitty stuff domestically too, but I wanted to focus specifically on like foreign affairs type stuff, because it’s just so appalling Americans happily accepted the whole thing.

 

[Integrityrespec]

A lot of people on the right are rather found of Ronald Reagan, due to a wide variety of myths such as him “bringing down the USSR”(the simple truth is that had Gorbachev chosen to use force to keep the USSR together, he could have done it, and Reagan couldn’t have done anything but sit back and watch impotently— the USSR collapsed due to domestic factors far more than anything else)

Of course, in reality Ronald Reagan’s foreign policy decisions were utterly vile and warranted him and those who obeyed his orders a trial at The Hague and a stint in a prison cell. For example;

1) Reagan backed the genocidal dictator of Guatemala, Efrain Rios Montt. Montt, who had taken power in a coup, and in a relatively few months, unleashed a vicious reign of terror.



Despite the fact that we knew full well that the Guatemalans were dumping bodies all over the country, Reagan continued pouring aid ina ns declared “ President Ríos Montt is a man of great personal integrity and commitment... I know he wants to improve the quality of life for all Guatemalans and to promote social justice."[45][46]”

2) Reagan also waged an undeclared war against the government of Nicaragua. He did this by arming and funding a gang of gloried drug dealers known as the Contras, who proceeded to commit a wide variety of atrocities with the full support— indeed, actively encouragement—of the CIA.

“ The United States began to support Contra activities against the Sandinista government by December 1981, with the CIA at the forefront of operations. The CIA supplied the funds and the equipment, coordinated training programs, and provided intelligence and target lists. While the Contras had little military successes, they did prove adept at carrying out CIA guerrilla warfare strategies from training manuals which advised them to incite mob violence, "neutralize" civilian leaders and government officials and attack "soft targets" — including schools, health clinics and cooperatives. The agency added to the Contras' sabotage efforts by blowing up refineries and pipelines, and mining ports.[12][58][59]”

“ Americas Watch, which subsequently became part of Human Rights Watch, accused the Contras of:[91]

targeting health care clinics and health care workers for assassination[92]

kidnapping civilians[93]

torturing civilians[94]

executing civilians, including children, who were captured in combat[95]

raping women[92]

indiscriminately attacking civilians and civilian houses[93]

seizing civilian property[92]

burning civilian houses in captured towns.[92]

Human Rights Watch released a report on the situation in 1989, which stated: "[The] contras were major and systematic violators of the most basic standards of the laws of armed conflict, including by launching indiscriminate attacks on civilians, selectively murdering non-combatants, and mistreating prisoners."[96]

Contras - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Reagan administration, of course, lied it’s ass off trying to defend the Contras, pumping vast amounts of aid into the group and engaging in “white propaganda” operations to clean up their image and hysterical fearmongering about “communist plots”.

Could have, would have, should have, what it, but if, and if. Reagans the best President in the past 70-80 years. Left wing loves to complain.
Nothing is worse than the democrats Trump Russian Collusion hoax and subsequent investigations that were all based on fabricated lies and evidence that the DOJ and FBI knew all along were lies put together by the Hillary campaign and others inside the government.

 

[Tigerace117]

Could have, would have, should have, what it, but if, and if. Reagans the best President in the past 70-80 years. Left wing loves to complain.
Nothing is worse than the democrats Trump Russian Collusion hoax and subsequent investigations that were all based on fabricated lies and evidence that the DOJ and FBI knew all along were lies put together by the Hillary campaign and others inside the government.

Lol no, he wasn’t, as I just very clearly demonstrated.

Gee, I wonder why the left would have an issue with propping up genocidal dictators and giving Saddam Hussein ****ing ANTHRAX?

Unfortunately for you, no amount of sobbing “but Clinton” excuse his crimes.

 

[aociswundumho]

A lot of people on the right are rather found of Ronald Reagan, due to a wide variety of myths such as him “bringing down the USSR”(the simple truth is that had Gorbachev chosen to use force to keep the USSR together, he could have done it, and Reagan couldn’t have done anything but sit back and watch impotently— the USSR collapsed due to domestic factors far more than anything else)

Yeah, socialism. That's why the USSR collapsed.

2) Reagan also waged an undeclared war against the government of Nicaragua. He did this by arming and funding a gang of gloried drug dealers known as the Contras, who proceeded to commit a wide variety of atrocities with the full support— indeed, actively encouragement—of the CIA.

“ The United States began to support Contra activities against the Sandinista government by December 1981, with the CIA at the forefront of operations. The CIA supplied the funds and the equipment, coordinated training programs, and provided intelligence and target lists. While the Contras had little military successes, they did prove adept at carrying out CIA guerrilla warfare strategies from training manuals which advised them to incite mob violence, "neutralize" civilian leaders and government officials and attack "soft targets" — including schools, health clinics and cooperatives. The agency added to the Contras' sabotage efforts by blowing up refineries and pipelines, and mining ports.[12][58][59]”

Now I'll take a deep breath and hold it until you also condemn Bernie Sanders for his luv affair with Ortega and the Sandinistas.

 

[Tigerace117]

Yeah, socialism. That's why the USSR collapsed.



Now I'll take a deep breath and hold it until you also condemn Bernie Sanders for his luv affair with Ortega and the Sandinistas.

Gee, and yet had the USSR’s leaders decided to hold it together by force it would have held, leaving people like you to sob impotently.

Gee, did Bernie Sanders funnel vast amounts of aid to genocidal dictators?

No?

Then there’s no equivalence there.

 

[aociswundumho]

Gee, and yet had the USSR’s leaders decided to hold it together by force it would have held, leaving people like you to sob impotently.

Socialism gets worse over time, not better. Eventually it gets to the point where everybody has had enough.

Gee, did Bernie Sanders funnel vast amounts of aid to genocidal dictators?

No?

Then there’s no equivalence there.

I didn't say it was equivalent, and I agree with you about Reagan. However the funding came from congress, and the house had a Democratic majority at the time, while the Senate was Republican. Why don't you blame the house Democrats who gave Reagan the money?

There were no good guys in the Contra/cocaine/Sandinista mess. Reagan supported the Contras, and Bernie supported Ortega and the Sandinistas. You condemn Reagan, but that piece of shit communist Sanders gets a free ride.

 

[TheParser]

Oh, yes.

The United States of America has long interfered in Central American affairs.

And wasn't it the beloved Henry K. who told the Chilean army that it would be just dandy to overthrow their president?

You could even go back to the early twentieth century when the American ambassador to Mexico told the Mexican army that this country would not mind their overthrowing their elected president, which they then did (killing him when he tried to "escape").

Most Americans who have had even a superficial knowledge of American "diplomacy" know how this country has behaved very badly. (Like telling the Vietnamese army to go ahead and overthrow their president. Their army killed the president and his brother.)

Remember what a Mexican president once said? Something like "Poor Mexico. So far from God and so close to the United States!"

 

[watsup]

Could have, would have, should have, what it, but if, and if. Reagans the best President in the past 70-80 years. Left wing loves to complain.
Nothing is worse than the democrats Trump Russian Collusion hoax and subsequent investigations that were all based on fabricated lies and evidence that the DOJ and FBI knew all along were lies put together by the Hillary campaign and others inside the government.

Last paragraph: what do those repetitive lies have to do with Raygun?

 

[Tigerace117]

Socialism gets worse over time, not better. Eventually it gets to the point where everybody has had enough.


I didn't say it was equivalent, and I agree with you about Reagan. However the funding came from congress, and the house had a Democratic majority at the time, while the Senate was Republican. Why don't you blame the house Democrats who gave Reagan the money?

There were no good guys in the Contra/cocaine/Sandinista mess. Reagan supported the Contras, and Bernie supported Ortega and the Sandinistas. You condemn Reagan, but that piece of shit communist Sanders gets a free ride.

Except, of course, for the fact that the Soviet Union had more than enough power to utterly smash anyone of those who’d “had enough” had its leaders been sufficiently ruthless.

Gee, probably because Reagan didn’t go up and admit that he was planning to fund a bunch of terrorists and genocidal tyrants with the funds in the first place.

There is no equivalence between Bernie Sanders and the president of the United States. Saying “but Sanders did X!” is not an excuse.

 

[Lord of Planar]

A lot of people on the right are rather found of Ronald Reagan, due to a wide variety of myths such as him “bringing down the USSR”(the simple truth is that had Gorbachev chosen to use force to keep the USSR together, he could have done it, and Reagan couldn’t have done anything but sit back and watch impotently— the USSR collapsed due to domestic factors far more than anything else)

Of course, in reality Ronald Reagan’s foreign policy decisions were utterly vile and warranted him and those who obeyed his orders a trial at The Hague and a stint in a prison cell. For example;

1) Reagan backed the genocidal dictator of Guatemala, Efrain Rios Montt. Montt, who had taken power in a coup, and in a relatively few months, unleashed a vicious reign of terror.

“ Critics have argued that, in practice, Ríos Montt's strategy amounted to a scorched earth campaign targeted against the indigenous Maya population, particularly in the departments of Quiché, Huehuetenango, and Baja Verapaz. According to the 1999 report by the UN-sponsored Historical Clarification Commission (CEH), this resulted in the annihilation of nearly 600 villages. One instance was the Plan de Sánchez massacre in Rabinal, Baja Verapaz, in July 1982, which saw over 250 people killed. Tens of thousands of peasant farmers fled over the border into southern Mexico. In 1982, an Amnesty International report estimated that over 10,000 indigenous Guatemalans and peasant farmers were killed from March to July of that year, and that 100,000 rural villagers were forced to flee their homes.[26] According to more recent estimates presented by the CEH, tens of thousands of non-combatants were killed during Ríos Montt's tenure as head of state. At the height of the bloodshed, reports put the number of disappearances and killings at more than 3,000 per month.[27] The 1999 book State Violence in Guatemala, 1960-1996: A Quantitative Reflection, published by the American Association for the Advancement of Science, states that Rios Montt's government presided over "the most indiscriminate period of state terror. More state killings occurred during Ríos Montt’s regime than during any other, and in the same period the monthly rate of violence was more than four times greater than for the next highest regime."[28]”

Efraín Ríos Montt - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Despite the fact that we knew full well that the Guatemalans were dumping bodies all over the country, Reagan continued pouring aid ina ns declared “ President Ríos Montt is a man of great personal integrity and commitment... I know he wants to improve the quality of life for all Guatemalans and to promote social justice."[45][46]”

2) Reagan also waged an undeclared war against the government of Nicaragua. He did this by arming and funding a gang of gloried drug dealers known as the Contras, who proceeded to commit a wide variety of atrocities with the full support— indeed, actively encouragement—of the CIA.

“ The United States began to support Contra activities against the Sandinista government by December 1981, with the CIA at the forefront of operations. The CIA supplied the funds and the equipment, coordinated training programs, and provided intelligence and target lists. While the Contras had little military successes, they did prove adept at carrying out CIA guerrilla warfare strategies from training manuals which advised them to incite mob violence, "neutralize" civilian leaders and government officials and attack "soft targets" — including schools, health clinics and cooperatives. The agency added to the Contras' sabotage efforts by blowing up refineries and pipelines, and mining ports.[12][58][59]”

“ Americas Watch, which subsequently became part of Human Rights Watch, accused the Contras of:[91]

targeting health care clinics and health care workers for assassination[92]

kidnapping civilians[93]

torturing civilians[94]

executing civilians, including children, who were captured in combat[95]

raping women[92]

indiscriminately attacking civilians and civilian houses[93]

seizing civilian property[92]

burning civilian houses in captured towns.[92]

Human Rights Watch released a report on the situation in 1989, which stated: "[The] contras were major and systematic violators of the most basic standards of the laws of armed conflict, including by launching indiscriminate attacks on civilians, selectively murdering non-combatants, and mistreating prisoners."[96]

Contras - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Reagan administration, of course, lied it’s ass off trying to defend the Contras, pumping vast amounts of aid into the group and engaging in “white propaganda” operations to clean up their image and hysterical fearmongering about “communist plots”.

Oh great.

More revisionist history.

 

[Fledermaus]

Gee, and yet had the USSR’s leaders decided to hold it together by force it would have held, leaving people like you to sob impotently.

Gee, did Bernie Sanders funnel vast amounts of aid to genocidal dictators?

No?

Then there’s no equivalence there.

You can be forgiven in your ignorance.

The 1991 Soviet coup d'état attempt, also known as the August Coup,[a] was a failed attempt by hardliners of the Soviet Union's Communist Party to forcibly seize control of the country from Mikhail Gorbachev, who was Soviet President and General Secretary of the Communist Party at the time. The coup leaders consisted of top military and civilian officials, including Vice President Gennady Yanayev, who together formed the State Committee on the State of Emergency (GKChP). They opposed Gorbachev's reform program, were angry at the loss of control over Eastern European states and fearful of the USSR's New Union Treaty which was on the verge of being signed. The treaty was to decentralize much of the central Soviet government's power and distribute it among its fifteen republics.

1991 Soviet coup attempt - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Tigerace117]

Oh great.

More revisionist history.

No “revisionist history” in the slightest. Reagan was a complete scumbag who backed all manner of vicious tyrants.

 

[Tigerace117]

Gee bud, and the coup was opposed by not just the bulk of the Soviet government by the largest and most powerful SFSRs.

Which meant it never had a chance of succeding.

All the US could have done is sob and funnel more guns to genocidal dictators.

 

[Port & Starboard]

No “revisionist history” in the slightest. Reagan was a complete scumbag who backed all manner of vicious tyrants.

Didn't Montt replace another tyrant. What are your feelings about the previous tyrant decimating the Maya's?

 

[Lord of Planar]

Gee bud, and the coup was opposed by not just the bulk of the Soviet government by the largest and most powerful SFSRs.

Which meant it never had a chance of succeding.

All the US could have done is sob and funnel more guns to genocidal dictators.

Like what we are doing with Ukraine?

 

[Tigerace117]

Like what we are doing with Ukraine?

Uh…..no? The two situations aren’t even remotely comparable

 

[Tigerace117]

Didn't Montt replace another tyrant. What are your feelings about the previous tyrant decimating the Maya's?

The US shouldn’t have happily supported that genocidal dictator either. Outright praising the “moral character” of Rios Montt even though we knew full well he was carrying out a genocide is particularly blatant in its vileness though.

Of course, the string of dictators came about because in the early 1950s the US had launched a coup to overthrow the country’s democratically elected social democratic president because he wasn’t a toady for United Fruit.

 

[PoS]

Pretty much every POTUS has supported dictators in one form or another, so I dont see how this is strictly a Reagan issue.

But Reagan does indeed deserve credit for winning the Cold War. The Soviet economy was pretty much dead in the 1970s, and they could have coasted perhaps another 20-30 years, but Reagan's expansion of the US military and Star Wars (even though it didnt work) helped to hasten the USSR's collapse because it forced them to raise their defense spending in order to match us.

The support for Afghan insurgents also helped out a lot.

 

[Tigerace117]

Pretty much every POTUS has supported dictators in one form or another, so I dont see how this is strictly a Reagan issue.

But Reagan does indeed deserve credit for winning the Cold War. The Soviet economy was pretty much dead in the 1970s, and they could have coasted perhaps another 20-30 years, but Reagan's expansion of the US military and Star Wars (even though it didnt work) helped to hasten the USSR's collapse because it forced them to raise their defense spending in order to match us.

The support for Afghan insurgents also helped out a lot.

Which is a self congratulatory myth.

“It is a widely held belief that Soviet defense spending accelerated dramatically in response to the presidency of Ronald Reagan and proposals such as the Strategic Defense Initiative. In fact, the Soviet military budget had been trending upward since at least the early 1970s, but Western analysts were left with best guesses in regard to hard numbers. Outside estimates of Soviet military spending ranged between 10 and 20 percent of GDP, and, even within the Soviet Union itself, it was difficult to produce an exact accounting because the military budget involved a variety of government ministries, each with its own competing interests. What can be said definitively, however, is that military spending was consistently agnostic of overall economic trends: even when the Soviet economy lagged, the military remained well-funded. In addition, the military took priority when it came to research and development talent. Technological innovators and would-be entrepreneurs who could have helped support Gorbachev’s partial transition to a market economy were instead funneled into defense industries.”

Why Did the Soviet Union Collapse? | Britannica

There were many factors that led to the collapse of the Soviet Union, including political policies, economics, defense spending, and the Chernobyl nuclear disaster. Find out more about how this political entity dissolved.

www.britannica.com

The actual battlefield effect of the Stinger missile is likewise widely debated and has been significantly exaggerated by self congratulatory western sources; once again, domestic sentiment in the USSR, not anything Reagan did, was at play there.

 

[Fledermaus]

Gee bud, and the coup was opposed by not just the bulk of the Soviet government by the largest and most powerful SFSRs.

Which meant it never had a chance of succeding.

All the US could have done is sob and funnel more guns to genocidal dictators.

WTF are you talking about?

 

[Fledermaus]

The actual battlefield effect of the Stinger missile is likewise widely debated and has been significantly exaggerated by self congratulatory western sources; once again, domestic sentiment in the USSR, not anything Reagan did, was at play there.

Then isn't all the bleating about Mujahadeen sales of old Stingers to other countries rather silly?