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Poll: 74% (!!!) of Austrians support a total ban on private firearm ownership, after 11 were killed in a school shooting last week here.

How are those going to stop someone from kicking in the door or breaking the window?
Expecting a visit from ICE?
Else, you've seen too many movies. Abductions are extremely rare and thieves generally prefer the home empty.... they're cowards.
 
Expecting a visit from ICE?
Else, you've seen too many movies. Abductions are extremely rare and thieves generally prefer the home empty.... they're cowards.
Presumably he lives in Mogadishu.
 
Presumably he lives in Mogadishu.
Don't know anything about Somalia. Perhaps, he needs to move.....I wouldn't advise moving to the US. Canada is nice this time of year! 😉
 
I'd say yes, a house equipped with reinforced steel doors, concrete walls, and level 10 bullet resistant glass would provide superior protection to a gun in case of a burglary, but not everyone has hundreds of thousands of dollars to build themselves a near-bunker. A shotgun is $200-$300.
Typical wingnut post. Hyperbole at its finest.
 
Strong locks prevent doors and windows from being easily breached and door cams would have the preventive measure outlined in post #12. How will a shotgun prevent those things if you are not at home, or are asleep, or have it safely stowed?
Locks are only as good as the wall and door they're bolted into. Locks are cheap. Doors and walls are not. I expect I'd wake up if someone kicks in the door or breaks the window!

As for home invasions when I'm not home, I don't really care (that much). Most stuff is kept in banks these days. The burglars wouldn't be able to steal much of value - certainly less than the cost of improvements to reinforce the house.
 
Thieves are not into a hard time. They will always pick the easiest target. Having visible defenses such as good locks and light, a dog and alarms will deter them. A gun is only a last and desperate defense against a person already in your house. Prevention is better than a fight for your life.
Do you get into such heated discussions about seat belts and airbags as well? As in, telling people they need just one and not the other? Every tool has a purpose. Different houses have different reinforcement options. You can take reasonable steps to reinforce your home as well as reasonable steps to arm yourself.
 
Expecting a visit from ICE?
Else, you've seen too many movies. Abductions are extremely rare and thieves generally prefer the home empty.... they're cowards.
ICE and movie villains are smart and sophisticated. People doing burglaries/home invasions these days are likely drug addicts and retards. Are they gonna know the home is occupied? Maybe. Maybe not. Maybe they're too stoned to care.
 
Typical wingnut post. Hyperbole at its finest.
Are you going to keep pretending paying even for a small upgrade to doors and windows, along with the labor, is cheaper than a gun? Construction work is not cheap. Whether you upgrade to a $200 door or a $1,000, you still need to pay someone to do the work to replace it.
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Locks are only as good as the wall and door they're bolted into. Locks are cheap. Doors and walls are not. I expect I'd wake up if someone kicks in the door or breaks the window!

As for home invasions when I'm not home, I don't really care (that much). Most stuff is kept in banks these days. The burglars wouldn't be able to steal much of value - certainly less than the cost of improvements to reinforce the house.

Sorry to hear your house is so flimsy locks are useless. Doesn’t sound like you keep anything of value in it anyway. Hardly seems worth shooting someone who breaks in.
 
Sorry to hear your house is so flimsy locks are useless.
Never said they're useless, but nice strawman!
Doesn’t sound like you keep anything of value in it anyway. Hardly seems worth shooting someone who breaks in.
Right, people who do home invasions can never cause bodily injury or death to the occupants! :rolleyes:
 
Knees tend to jerk in Austria, too...right?
Maybe they do not want to be a ****ed up country where mass shooting happen weekly like they do here.
 
Never said they're useless, but nice strawman!

Right, people who do home invasions can never cause bodily injury or death to the occupants! :rolleyes:

Well I knew you liked strawman arguments when I saw you compare locks and a burglar alarm to “reinforced steel doors, concrete walls, and level 10 bullet resistant glass”.
 
Are you going to keep pretending paying even for a small upgrade to doors and windows, along with the labor, is cheaper than a gun? Construction work is not cheap. Whether you upgrade to a $200 door or a $1,000, you still need to pay someone to do the work to replace it.
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Value added by improvements? Health and emotional benefits to owning a dog? Risks of owning a firearm like accidental death or injury, being overpowered and losing your weapon, suicide, weapon malfunction. Emotional benefits and negatives of owning a firearm, probably a wide variation.

I'll pass on your simple, myopic analysis. I'm sure there are other risks and benefits I have not considered. Quite variable based on the individual.
 
Well I knew you liked strawman arguments when I saw you compare locks and a burglar alarm to “reinforced steel doors, concrete walls, and level 10 bullet resistant glass”.
Contrasting them, actually, to point out the difference between a cheap alarm that doesn't physically stop anyone to an expensive wall that does.
 
Value added by improvements?
It's value added to the current owner. A buyer might not want bars over the windows, or it might be a knockdown by the time you sell it. And what about people who live in an apartment that doesn't allow dogs or modifications of this sort?
Health and emotional benefits to owning a dog?
Depends on the dog. An attack dog is not always the best emotional support dog.
Risks of owning a firearm like accidental death or injury, being overpowered and losing your weapon, suicide, weapon malfunction. Emotional benefits and negatives of owning a firearm, probably a wide variation.
You can use a car to commit suicide, too, I suppose, but do you think suicide by carbon monoxide poisoning should be a deciding factor in getting a Tesla or a gas car? Come on, you're really, really reaching hard here!
I'll pass on your simple, myopic analysis. I'm sure there are other risks and benefits I have not considered. Quite variable based on the individual.
Thanks for your concern, but I'll keep my rights for now. (y)
 
It's value added to the current owner. A buyer might not want bars over the windows, or it might be a knockdown by the time you sell it. And what about people who live in an apartment that doesn't allow dogs or modifications of this sort?

Depends on the dog. An attack dog is not always the best emotional support dog.

You can use a car to commit suicide, too, I suppose, but do you think suicide by carbon monoxide poisoning should be a deciding factor in getting a Tesla or a gas car? Come on, you're really, really reaching hard here!

Thanks for your concern, but I'll keep my rights for now. (y)
Like I said, quite a few variables to factor. Never mentioned anything about banning guns. Just comparing the risks, costs and benefits of the scenario you posted. You have quantified nothing and got defensive over a position I did not mention or advocate. I have absolutely no concern for you just to be clear.
 
Like I said, quite a few variables to factor. Never mentioned anything about banning guns. Just comparing the risks, costs and benefits of the scenario you posted. You have quantified nothing and got defensive over a position I did not mention or advocate. I have absolutely no concern for you just to be clear.
You're in a total private gun ban thread arguing against me, and your position on guns is already known.
 
You're in a total private gun ban thread arguing against me, and your position on guns is already known.
Again, since you seem to have an English comprehension problem. The discussion was the cost of a gun as a defense against criminals vs. Other means to protect yourself. Cost being the main point of discussion. My personal opinion on banning assault weapons is irrelevant. You seem to be unable to quantify all the costs, risks and benefits associated with the discussion of self defense. I can't either since there is a major variable component based on the individual.
 
Again, since you seem to have an English comprehension problem. The discussion was the cost of a gun as a defense against criminals vs. Other means to protect yourself. Cost being the main point of discussion. My personal opinion on banning assault weapons is irrelevant. You seem to be unable to quantify all the costs, risks and benefits associated with the discussion of self defense. I can't either since there is a major variable component based on the individual.
Well, shit! I can't quantify all the costs of seat belts, either, like the potential to hang myself with one! :ROFLMAO:

And that means...what, exactly?
 
Well, shit! I can't quantify all the costs of seat belts, either, like the potential to hang myself with one! :ROFLMAO:

And that means...what, exactly?
Strawman with hyperbole. At least you are consistent.
 
It's no more ridiculous than the obtuse argument you presented to hide your obvious opposition to private gun ownership.
I never mentioned gun ownership in any way. My interest was purely from a cost and risk analysis perspective.
 
I never mentioned gun ownership in any way. My interest was purely from a cost and risk analysis perspective.
Do you do the same sort of cost/risk analysis, including jamming and suicide, when discussing the costs and risks of other items, like seat belts?
 
What third world countries think is not really relevant to me.
Austria aint third world and this is about Austria’s change in gun laws.
 
Do you get into such heated discussions about seat belts and airbags as well? As in, telling people they need just one and not the other? Every tool has a purpose. Different houses have different reinforcement options. You can take reasonable steps to reinforce your home as well as reasonable steps to arm yourself.
Do you always go for the lame emotional fallacy when the best you can manage here is to point out the obvious.
 
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