Poland Reverses Supreme Court Purge, Retreating From Conflict With E.U.

Rogue Valley · Dec 18, 2018

Poland Reverses Supreme Court Purge, Retreating From Conflict With E.U.

President Andrzej Duda of Poland, addressing a news conference in November. Mr. Duda waited until the last hours
before his formal deadline Monday night to sign the bill to reinstate judges who had been purged.

12/17/18
WARSAW — Backing down from a showdown with Brussels, Poland’s government reversed its purge of the country’s Supreme Court, as the president signed a law on Monday that will reinstate the judges who had been forced out of their jobs. It was a remarkable turnaround after months of Poland’s top officials saying they would resist pressure to stop the overhaul of the judiciary. The ruling party, Law and Justice, had put tightening its grip on the courts at the center of its agenda, claiming that it was vital to rid the courts of corrupt judges and Communist-era vestiges. The European Union sees the changes Poland has made to its judiciary in the last three years as a violation of the bloc’s core values, a threat to the rule of law and the end of judges acting as a check on political power. Last year, the union chastised Poland and took the first steps toward stripping the country of its voting rights in Brussels — a penalty that has never been used against a member nation. Poland’s concession on the Supreme Court is by no means the end of that conflict between the right-wing, nationalist Polish government and Brussels, but it represented a striking change in tone.

The government’s retreat seemed to be part of a larger campaign started recently by Law and Justice to change its image ahead of the elections. During the party’s national convention last weekend, its leaders insisted that “Poland is, was and will be in Europe and nobody can change that.” The Parliament approved the bill reinstating the Supreme Court judges three weeks ago, after less than four hours of debate. But President Andrzej Duda — who had been the face and force behind the court purge — waited until the last hours before his formal deadline Monday night to sign the bill into law. Michal Wawrykiewicz, a lawyer from the Free Courts Initiative and Committee for Defense of Justice, called the reversal “a failure of the ruling camp, and victory of the rule of law.” Before the government passed the law targeting the Supreme Court, politicians took full control over the National Council of the Judiciary, which selects judges, and created a new disciplinary chamber that critics view as a tool to punish unruly judges.

Despite this concession, The Court of Justice of the European Union will continue its case against the Polish government. Besides interfering with the Supreme Court, Law and Justice (PiS) had also opened attacks against the judiciary on numerous other fronts. The EU should also initiate actions against the authoritarian Hungarian Fidesz government of Viktor Orban.

haymarket · Dec 18, 2018

This is welcome news. Glad to see it happening. Its sad to see Poland embrace the right wing after the glorious history with the Solidarity movement and democratic values. Lets hope this helps turn things around.

SenorXm/Sirius · Dec 18, 2018

haymarket said:
This is welcome news. Glad to see it happening. Its sad to see Poland embrace the right wing after the glorious history with the Solidarity movement and democratic values. Lets hope this helps turn things around.

Yep, I felt bad for the Poles and other Eastern European countries that had to live under the USSR's totalitarian thumb for decades. The USSR falls, those countries get their freedom and democracy only to lately slip back towards totalitarian types governments.

If they stay totalitarian and start to slip under Putin's umbrella, and when Putin revives the USSR(which he is trying to do) and then Poland and the rest want out and our help again... Screw them..

Westphalian · Dec 18, 2018

So EU states can elect who they want to government, but those governments policy decisions are subject to scrutiny, censure and fines by an un-elected higher authority.

Does nobody see the problem with this? How it undermines national democracy and elections - makes them almost a pointless sham?

Looks a little like the Soviet Union to me.

SenorXm/Sirius · Dec 18, 2018

Westphalian said:
So EU states can elect who they want to government, but those governments policy decisions are subject to scrutiny, censure and fines by an un-elected higher authority.

Does nobody see the problem with this? How it undermines national democracy and elections - makes them almost a pointless sham?

Looks a little like the Soviet Union to me.

When the EU rolls tanks into Hungry and Prague to enforce their form of government, then you may have a point. Until then, not even close.

Westphalian · Dec 18, 2018

SenorXm/Sirius said:
When the EU rolls tanks into Hungry and Prague to enforce their form of government, then you may have a point. Until then, not even close.

I note that Brussels is very keen to form an EU army despite being perfectly happy with NATO.

Now, if it isn't needed for defence against external aggression, why is Brussels so keen?

Go figure.

SenorXm/Sirius · Dec 18, 2018

Westphalian said:
I note that Brussels is very keen to form an EU army despite being perfectly happy with NATO.

Now, if it isn't needed for defence against external aggression, why is Brussels so keen?

Go figure.

Trump, that's why. I don't remember them ever seriously talking about an Army until Trump started to kiss up to Putin and threaten to pull the US out of NATO..

It's no secret Putin is slowing moving West, he wants to bring back the USSR and is slowly doing it. As that's happening Trump threatens NATO, the alliance that suppose to deter a Russian move West? Can't blame the Europeans for being a little uneasy.

Rogue Valley · Dec 18, 2018

SenorXm/Sirius said:
Trump, that's why. I don't remember them ever seriously talking about an Army until Trump started to kiss up to Putin and threaten to pull the US out of NATO..

It's no secret Putin is slowing moving West, he wants to bring back the USSR and is slowly doing it. As that's happening Trump threatens NATO, the alliance that suppose to deter a Russian move West? Can't blame the Europeans for being a little uneasy.

You've had the distinct honor of interacting with a St. Petersburg troll trying to sow division.

Chagos · Dec 18, 2018

Westphalian said:
So EU states can elect who they want to government, but those governments policy decisions are subject to scrutiny, censure and fines by an un-elected higher authority.

States don't elect governments, the people do. And if they elect to be part of the EU (as the majority of Poles does), they also support that their state subscribes to the rules that come with it.

Does nobody see the problem with this? How it undermines national democracy and elections - makes them almost a pointless sham?

WTH would a Russian and Putin fanboy like you know about national democracy and elections? And how the EU either undermines or strengthens democracy of its member states?

Looks a little like the Soviet Union to me.

Not just simply coming to you soon, but well on its way to you.

Westphalian · Dec 18, 2018

SenorXm/Sirius said:
Trump, that's why. I don't remember them ever seriously talking about an Army until Trump started to kiss up to Putin and threaten to pull the US out of NATO..

It's no secret Putin is slowing moving West, he wants to bring back the USSR and is slowly doing it. As that's happening Trump threatens NATO, the alliance that suppose to deter a Russian move West? Can't blame the Europeans for being a little uneasy.

It pre-dates Trump by some years, but has made progress recently because of Brexit and the now irrelevance of UK opposition:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...calls-for-eu-army-european-commission-miltary

The European Union needs its own army to help address the problem that it is not “taken entirely seriously” as an international force, the president of the European commission has said.

Jean-Claude Juncker said such a move would help the EU to persuade Russia that it was serious about defending its values in the face of the threat posed by Moscow.

However, his proposal was immediately rejected by the British government, which said that there was “no prospect” of the UK agreeing to the creation of an EU army.

Westphalian · Dec 18, 2018

Rogue Valley said:
You've had the distinct honor of interacting with a St. Petersburg troll trying to sow division.

A) - I'm not from Leningrad

B) - the division is entirely self sown and only a fool would seek to rationalise it away as all Russia's fault.

Westphalian · Dec 18, 2018

Chagos said:
States don't elect governments, the people do. And if they elect to be part of the EU (as the majority of Poles does), they also support that their state subscribes to the rules that come with it.WTH would a Russian and Putin fanboy like you know about national democracy and elections? And how the EU either undermines or strengthens democracy of its member states?Not just simply coming to you soon, bu well on its way to you.

I'm sure Chagos that a man of your intellect can see the problem here.

What happens when the policies of the democratically elected national government are stymied by the EU?

There is a democratic problem here, and unless you're also in perpetual head in sand mode like our American friend RV, then the issue needs addressing.

Witness not just Poland but also Italy and its 'illegal' budget.

Chagos · Dec 18, 2018

Westphalian said:
A) - I'm not from Leningrad

not since you've changed the location in your user profile from "St. Petersburg" to "East".

B) - the division is entirely self sown and only a fool would seek to rationalise it away as all Russia's fault.

It's actually one of the more positive effects your worshipped KGB thug has had on EU countries. Those that preferred to reside in blissful slumber have actually woken up to the point of getting their finger out.

Chagos · Dec 18, 2018

Westphalian said:
I'm sure Chagos that a man of your intellect can see the problem here.

Stop grovelling, Gospodin, it doesn't impress me.:2razz:

What happens when the policies of the democratically elected national government are stymied by the EU?

They're corrected to the point that the country agreed upon when joining.

There is a democratic problem here, and unless you're also in perpetual head in sand mode like our American friend RV, then the issue needs addressing.

If you weren't deafened and blinded by your own propaganda, you'd have noticed that it has been. As RV, far from having his head up wherever as far as you pretend to have yours, has pointed out here.

Witness not just Poland but also Italy and its 'illegal' budget.

Yeah, follow your own advice and witness that.

Westphalian · Dec 19, 2018

Chagos said:
Stop grovelling, Gospodin, it doesn't impress me.:2razz:They're corrected to the point that the country agreed upon when joining.
If you weren't deafened and blinded by your own propaganda, you'd have noticed that it has been. As RV, far from having his head up wherever as far as you pretend to have yours, has pointed out here.Yeah, follow your own advice and witness that.

Oh well, you're in denial too :roll:.

The EU is very sick, whether you pretend otherwise or not. No wonder it wants its own army to control the people.

The Euro Parl elections early next year should be interesting.

Rogue Valley · Dec 19, 2018

Poland's ruling conservatives strike strong pro-EU tone

Polish Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki speaks during the ruling party's Law and Justice convention in Warsaw,
Poland, Saturday, Dec. 15, 2018, as a map of Europe with Poland marked with a heart is in the background.

12/15/18
WARSAW, Poland (AP) — Poland's prime minister and other leaders of the ruling conservative party, long seen as euroskeptic, set a strongly pro-European tone at a party convention. The convention Saturday was held under the slogan "Poland Heart of Europe." It comes after local elections this fall gave the party, Law and Justice, a severe battering in cities, though the party did well in rural areas. Poles are enthusiastic about the European Union, with support around 80 percent in most polls. Commentators concluded Saturday that the new approach reflects the party coming to terms with the fact that it won't prevail with a euroskeptic platform in elections next year to the European Parliament and national parliament. Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki said "we are the beating heart of Europe" and that "today we inspire Europe."

Never ever believe disinformation spewed by Russian trolls.

Poland Reverses Supreme Court Purge, Retreating From Conflict With E.U.

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Poland Reverses Supreme Court Purge, Retreating From Conflict With E.U.

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