- Joined
- Oct 13, 2011
- Messages
- 1,145
- Reaction score
- 445
- Gender
- Male
- Political Leaning
- Libertarian - Right
Moderator's Warning: Gentlemen.... remember where you are. Respectful discussion. Leave everybody's mama out of it.
I actually had a point to that statement- which was that he was arguing out of ingrained belief and what he was taught, rather than fact or scripture. No disrespect to his mama.
Moderator's Warning: |
I wonder if those telling you what Christians out to believe on the topic are self-admitted Christians .. or not.And yet, I keep seeing threads telling me what Christians ought to believe about homosexuality, which seems to boil down to "ignore the Bible".... which is kind of contrary to the faith.
I wonder if those telling you what Christians out to believe on the topic are self-admitted Christians .. or not.
Regardless, I'm curious how this thread is going for you.
With so many posters stepping outside their religious texts and referencing their particularly selected historical references of the time to explain what their religious text meant, if you yourself do not consider valid those same historical reference materials or don't lean toward accepting the veracity of the posters' explanations in reference, how can they possibly convince you?
And, if you do accept the validity of their historical references outside the Bible and the veracity of their interpretations, if they've stepped outside the Bible in attempting to prove to you their point, did they not just violate your OP request to stay within the Bible alone?
Whether my mind is going to be changed or not remains to be seen. A couple of posters have raised doubts in my mind, and I am still collating data and considering how I will view what they have said.
I would trust the Word of God over the opinions of men on what's sinful, etc. But that's just me.
The word of god has always been passed down through the languages of men. That's the only means of delivery and comes with the baggage of human opinions and subjectivity as a result.I would trust the Word of God over the opinions of men on what's sinful, etc. But that's just me.
I would too if we had something I thought was the true Word of God.
The word of god has always been passed down through the languages of men. That's the only means of delivery and comes with the baggage of human opinions and subjectivity as a result.
I'm aware of this. That doesn't really account for the majority of my point.Sorry, that doesn't work.
We have the Dead Sea Scrolls, including the 150 BC complete "Great Isaiah Scroll." With very little substantial differences from what we have today.
The more you study the Bible the more you will find the Word of God.
Actually, the more I studied the Bible the more I hated myself and realized life was hopeless by believing the Bible is100% the word of God.
To be more precise, it isn't MY view on the matter that is in question, but NT verses mainly attributable to Paul and Timothy.
I've yet to hear a sufficiently compelling argument to change my mind.... but I'm going to admit to you that if I did, it would be a RELIEF. I could say "yay gay" along with everyone else and stop drawing all the hate that flies in when I point out what the Bible says about it.
Now here's the catch.... it has to be Biblical, and theologically sound. This is about BIBLICAL truth and is a THEOLOGICAL question. Secular arguments will be disregarded. Psychology is not relevant. Biology is not relevant. Politics is not relevant.
Why? Why do you so strongly feel that justification for your beliefs must be biblical and not grounded in reason and evidence? I would ask you to challenge your beliefs that the bible is of a higher authority than reason. That stance honestly baffles me.
I've read the whole thing many times and I realized the love and grace of Jesus Christ to pay for my sins at Calvary, and to afford me eternal love, joy, and peace in Heaven.
Doesn't reason tell you that if a being infinitely more wise than you wrote a book wherein he makes claims that don't make sense to you, those claims are likely to be right even if you can't make sense of them?
I'm not saying such a simplistic view of scripture is correct. I don't believe it is. But it is rational.
Reason tells me that if a being infinitely more wise than me wrote a book to tell me what is right or wrong
Christians don't believe that*. Are you sure you know anything about the topic you've chosen to discuss?
*Technically, Christians do believe God wrote such a book, The Torah, but that it is no longer necessary for the place in history we now inhabit (the messianic age)
Slavery in the Bible was either
1. Voluntary
2. Punishment for sin against wicked individuals or nations
3. A sin committed by Jews and/or others.
Apart from that, what part of "Love your neighbor as yourself" do you think justifies enslaving your neighbor?
The MORAL LAW has never passed away from Old Testament times.
Adultery, thievery, idolatry, murder, and gay sex relations, etc., were sins then (in both the Old and New Testaments) and they're still sins today.
Moderator's Warning: |
I don't have a personal hatred of gays or homosexuality.
I have a belief that the practice of it is sinful, because the Bible says so in many different scriptures.
I've heard people try to explain why those scriptures don't really mean what they say, or don't apply to modern homosexual relationships.
I've yet to hear a sufficiently compelling argument to change my mind.... but I'm going to admit to you that if I did, it would be a RELIEF. I could say "yay gay" along with everyone else and stop drawing all the hate that flies in when I point out what the Bible says about it.
So, here's a thread for it.... lay it out. Give me a compelling dissertation on why I should disregard what the Bible, OT and NT, says about homosexual activity being a sin.
Now here's the catch.... it has to be Biblical, and theologically sound. This is about BIBLICAL truth and is a THEOLOGICAL question. Secular arguments will be disregarded. Psychology is not relevant. Biology is not relevant. Politics is not relevant.
It has to be based in Scripture and theologically sound. For instance, if someone asks me why I don't obey the OT prohibition on eating pig or shellfish, I can point to Acts 10 and Acts 15 and say "that's why; as a modern Gentile Christian I am not subject to most OT law, because God and the authority of the Apostles collectively says so."
Scriptural and theologically sound; have at it.
I'll be genuinely interested if anyone can come up with such an assertion, that will withstand even the slightest scrutiny. If you don't know the Bible quite well, I'd recommend you not even try: this is the big leagues, if you don't know what you're talking about it will be quickly pointed out.
Bear in mind this is the Religious Discussion Forum, and the rules regarding respectful discussion and no religion-bashing apply.
Doesn't reason tell you that if a being infinitely more wise than you wrote a book wherein he makes claims that don't make sense to you, those claims are likely to be right even if you can't make sense of them?
I'm not saying such a simplistic view of scripture is correct. I don't believe it is. But it is rational.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?