Hardly the truth...as of right now there are a super majority of the STATES that have amendments already in their constitutions that Defend Marriage. There has only been ONE STATE that has passed legislation that grants Queer Eye for the straight Guy Marriage, a very small state....that was lobbied from all over the nation (gays) with brides and money going to that states representatives (documented), why did the gays pick this state to purchase? Because it is one only a few states that does not grant THE FREE PEOPLE thereof to have a reformation vote on any passed law. No other state in the union save this has seen legislation passed making gay marriage legal. Even the most liberal state in the Union (California) amended their constitution in defense of marriage. You are either gullible...or lying.
Obama chose not to pursue it out of respect for the office. It was independently determined that Bush did violate the Constitution and did torture those prisoners.
yeah right. and Bill Clinton did not have sexual relations with that woman...Miss Lewinski :lamo
yeah right. and Bill Clinton did not have sexual relations with that woman...Miss Lewinski :lamo
Most of the Constitutional amendments were made back when opinions were quite different. The public opinon has changed.
Americans' Acceptance of Gay Relations Crosses 50% Threshold
Also, you are a bit behind the times.
Maryland Senate Makes Case for Equal Rights, Gay Marriage - Yahoo! News
US Judge: Obama has the right to protect Bush-Cheney administration from prosecution for torture
Conservatives are not very informed people I see.
Right...that's why California passed an amendment in support of defending traditional marriage 52% to 47%, THE MOST LIBERAL STATE IN THE UNION and home to Queer Eye for the straight guy Paradise (San Fan). Yep...perfect DEFLECTION by you....not?
PUblic opinon does shift.
Post-Prop 8, gay marriage winning support in California | The Salt Lake Tribune'
I totally would support having a public referendum on same sex marriage today in California.
Oh, and Rhode Island is the most liberal state.
bush never tortured prisoners. waterboarding is not torture. hell, I was waterboarded, and worse, during training :2bigcry:
Definition of TORTURE
1
a : anguish of body or mind : agony b : something that causes agony or pain
2
: the infliction of intense pain (as from burning, crushing, or wounding) to punish, coerce, or afford sadistic pleasure
3
: distortion or overrefinement of a meaning or an argument : straining
Violators of the U.N. Convention against Torture should be prosecuted under the principle of 'universal jurisdiction' which allows countries to try accused war criminals from other nations, Arbour said.
"There are several precedents worldwide of states exercising their universal jurisdiction ... to enforce the torture convention and we can only hope that we will see more and more of these avenues of redress," Arbour said.
The United States knows quite a bit about waterboarding. The U.S. government -- whether acting alone before domestic courts, commissions and courts-martial or as part of the world community -- has not only condemned the use of water torture but has severely punished those who applied it.
After World War II, we convicted several Japanese soldiers for waterboarding American and Allied prisoners of war. At the trial of his captors, then-Lt. Chase J. Nielsen, one of the 1942 Army Air Forces officers who flew in the Doolittle Raid and was captured by the Japanese, testified: "I was given several types of torture. . . . I was given what they call the water cure." He was asked what he felt when the Japanese soldiers poured the water. "Well, I felt more or less like I was drowning," he replied, "just gasping between life and death."
I hope you can see the difference as the methodology was probably much less severe on you, and psychologically much easier on you.
Based on a poll of 1500 likely voters, you'd NOW support a vote by the people of CA.. LOL Dude you're such a liar!! We already had that vote, you lost, but wouldn't accept the loss so you coopted the judiciary to find a way for you to win anyway...
What color is the sky in your world?
Tim-
Man... are you joking? The basic definition of torture disagrees with you:
Torture - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
Not to mention we signed the UN Convention Against Torture.
United Nations Convention Against Torture - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (If you want to see all of the signers)
U.N. says waterboarding should be prosecuted as torture | Reuters
Also, it would be wise for Bush to be careful, because if he walks into the wrong country and they want to prosecute him, under international law, it is legal:
In fact, OscarB63, the United States has prosecuted others for waterboard:
Waterboarding Used to Be a Crime - washingtonpost.com
Thanks for this debate, by the way. It may be one of the easiest ones I have done in a while. It mostly requires common sense, but the facts also stare you in the face! Also, sorry you were water boarded though I assume it was done to you by a group of your peers and not by a foreign captor.
I hope you can see the difference as the methodology was probably much less severe on you, and psychologically much easier on you.
I didn't lose a thing since I don't live in California. In 2012 there will probably be another vote and we can certainly see how things turn out then.
Agreed! Probably going to battle this one out for a very long time to come, but as much as I am against gay marriage, I don't put this issue even in my top 20 at the moment. We should, and need to worry about other WAY more important issues, IMO.
Tim-
obvious you never spent one day in the military.
I am tortured everyday listening to the like of liberals like you.. According to your definition I am being tortured.. LOL
Amatuer..
Tim-
True. I have not. But are you saying that being capture and waterboarded by an enemy would be even remotely close to be waterboarded in training?
Thanks for addressing everything else, by the way. I suppose that means you have no argument against it?
well, since you have never been through the training, you have no basis for comparison do you?
no, it just means it's so ridiculous it's not worth my time.
Meh. I'm really looking forward to when a state approves of same sex marriage by referendum. It's coming and its going to signal a major turn.
You oppose same sex marriage Tim? That surprises me. I didn't realize you were religous.
You don't answer questions, do you? You mean international law is not worth your time? :lamo
Here's a question:
Why should anyone bother debating with someone like you?
international law written by a bunch of US hating pansies? I'll give it all the due consideration it deserves.
the same reason they should bother debating someone like you. entertainment.
If I wanted actual serious debate, I'd talk to real people... not puppets on an internet forum.
True. I have not. But are you saying that being capture and waterboarded by an enemy would be even remotely close to be waterboarded in training?
Thanks for addressing everything else, by the way. I suppose that means you have no argument against it?
What does this even mean? You got a "like" for this post? There wasn't one fact in it. Rather, it's just you being angry for no apparent reason other than you have no argument.
And it's amateur, amateur.
No, it means I have no time for people that are suffering from liberalism. I have not, nor can I ever support the idea that torture is always unacceptable. That to me is a mentally deficient attitude, and fills me with concern for my fellow man..
Tim-
I more concerned that anyone can find a way to excuse torture. Guess we're both in the same boat for different reasons. I'm OK where I am. :coffeepap
No, it means I have no time for people that are suffering from liberalism. I have not, nor can I ever support the idea that torture is always unacceptable. That to me is a mentally deficient attitude, and fills me with concern for my fellow man..
Tim-
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