Obama’s Secret CIA Hit Squad Detailed in “The Way of the Knife”

[Jango]

Maybe later, if I'm bored. I'm not gonna go out if my way to prove something that anyone talking about US intelligence should know, though.

Sorry!

Correct me where I am wrong.

I know one instance where the C.I.A. had authority for lethal force pre-9/11 was with bin Laden. They were given some covert authority by Reagan when he declared War on Terrorism, but to my knowledge, they did not act upon it because of the ban on assassinations, their fear of being castrated publicly again and there wasn't anything solid in writing green lighting them for that type of covert action.

As to the Secretary of Defense having 80% of the IC under his hat, IIRC, I've heard the claim before, or read it somewhere before, but I can't be sure.

Hence, why I'm asking for evidence.

 

[humbolt]

****, you think most of the intelligence assets prior to 9/11 were run by the CIA too? And that they didn't engage in tactical operations?

lol how weird

No, I was kidding.

 

[cpwill]

And when you can produce links to prove that his specific statements are 'false' - I will believe you.

Until then, nothing personal, but I will take the word of a Pulitzer-prize winning author over a faceless poster on a chat forum anyday.

:shrug: "Ban on Assassination" was issued as part of Executive Order 12333 in order to forestall the Legislature applying similar language in a statute - this allows the President control over the measure, meaning that he can rescind it in cases he deems worthy. The Reagan corollary is that any action "taken in good faith by an agent on an approved mission" can be protected, which is a nice way of saying that the United States Central Intelligence Agency doesn't kill people - unless it wants to, and is operating within the approval of the President. In addition, the seven justifications of deadly force remain applicable to U.S. Agents as well as Servicemembers.

"In addition to the national intelligence organizations within the Department of Defense - the National Security Agency (NSA), the National Reconnaissance Office (NRO), and the National Geospatial-Intelligence Ageny (NGA) - the department has its own agenccy, the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), which operates in support of the Secretary of Defense, the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and military commanders, and participates in the production of national intelligence. DIA contains within it organizations for the collection of human intelligence, for technical collection, and for intelligence production.....

In December 1992, DOD Directive 5200.37, "Centralized Management of DOD Human Intelligence (HUMINT) Operations," centralized HUMINT decision-making under a DOD HUMINT manager, established the concept of HUINT support elements at combatant comands, and required consolidation of HUMINT support services...."


Etc. and so on and so forth. quick quotes are from Jeffrey T Richelson The U.S. Intelligence Community, 6th ed., which goes into greater detail. You'll want Chapter 3.

I would bet I know why the author is saying what he is saying. He's referencing the recent standup of DIA's Counterintelligence and HUMINT Center (the DCHC). But he's wrong for two reasons - 1. the Defense HUMINT Service was stood up in the 1990s and 2. the DOD collected plenty of HUMINT prior to 9/11 right on down to the tactical level - it's not exactly as if the Army and Marines trained HUMINT collectors and then had them sit around and stare at walls. In addition, Defense Attache's function as HUMINT collectors, as do the clandestine case officers who work for the DOD.

 

[DA60]

:shrug: "Ban on Assassination" was issued as part of Executive Order 12333 in order to forestall the Legislature applying similar language in a statute - this allows the President control over the measure, meaning that he can rescind it in cases he deems worthy. The Reagan corollary is that any action "taken in good faith by an agent on an approved mission" can be protected, which is a nice way of saying that the United States Central Intelligence Agency doesn't kill people - unless it wants to, and is operating within the approval of the President. In addition, the seven justifications of deadly force remain applicable to U.S. Agents as well as Servicemembers.

"In addition to the national intelligence organizations within the Department of Defense - the National Security Agency (NSA), the National Reconnaissance Office (NRO), and the National Geospatial-Intelligence Ageny (NGA) - the department has its own agenccy, the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), which operates in support of the Secretary of Defense, the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and military commanders, and participates in the production of national intelligence. DIA contains within it organizations for the collection of human intelligence, for technical collection, and for intelligence production.....

In December 1992, DOD Directive 5200.37, "Centralized Management of DOD Human Intelligence (HUMINT) Operations," centralized HUMINT decision-making under a DOD HUMINT manager, established the concept of HUINT support elements at combatant comands, and required consolidation of HUMINT support services...."


Etc. and so on and so forth. quick quotes are from Jeffrey T Richelson The U.S. Intelligence Community, 6th ed., which goes into greater detail. You'll want Chapter 3.

I would bet I know why the author is saying what he is saying. He's referencing the recent standup of DIA's Counterintelligence and HUMINT Center (the DCHC). But he's wrong for two reasons - 1. the Defense HUMINT Service was stood up in the 1990s and 2. the DOD collected plenty of HUMINT prior to 9/11 right on down to the tactical level - it's not exactly as if the Army and Marines trained HUMINT collectors and then had them sit around and stare at walls. In addition, Defense Attache's function as HUMINT collectors, as do the clandestine case officers who work for the DOD.

Rather impressive response, imo.


But, here is the sentence you say is wrong on it's two points:

'Prior to the attacks of September 11, the Pentagon did very little human spying, and the CIA was not officially permitted to kill.'

First, 'prior to September 11, the Pentagon did very little human spying'.

He is saying 'human spying' - which I assume refers to individuals of a non-military nature. Obviously the DoD has for years been 'spying' on other military individuals. But where is your evidence that it has been spying on civilian individuals not related to their countries military who are not members of the government prior to 9/11?
Remember, I am not looking for opinions or theories - I am looking for links to factual data that shows that that specific statement is erroneous. Not probably or possible, but I am looking for specific, unbiased data that proves the position conclusively.
Frankly, I doubt such evidence exists - at least in the public domain.
And he said 'very little human spying' - he did not say 'none at all'...granted, that gives him a lot of leeway. But nevertheless, that is what he said.


The second part is 'the CIA was not officially permitted to kill.'

I am sure that technically, the CIA was permitted under certain circumstances to kill people.

But obviously, he is referring to ongoing and semi-continuous assassinations of individuals. Not self-defense issues or short term orders for important situations. I am quite sure he is referring to a systematic AND OFFICIAL ability of the CIA to target individuals on an ongoing basis for execution.

Do you have links to unbiased evidence that before 9/11 the CIA was OFFICIALLY allowed to target and assassinate individuals on an ongoing basis without an apparent time limit to this mandate - as they are now?

Again, I highly doubt such documentation exists for public display...if it exists at all.


I am not saying he is correct or incorrect.

What I am saying is I am going to need links to unbiased, factual proof before I conclude that he IS wrong.

Not general guidelines or what was understood - but unbiased facts/stats/on-record statements.

 

[OldWorldOrder]

Correct me where I am wrong.

I know one instance where the C.I.A. had authority for lethal force pre-9/11 was with bin Laden. They were given some covert authority by Reagan when he declared War on Terrorism, but to my knowledge, they did not act upon it because of the ban on assassinations, their fear of being castrated publicly again and there wasn't anything solid in writing green lighting them for that type of covert action.

You don't know of the plans to assassinate Castro, then, through out the 1960s?

As to the Secretary of Defense having 80% of the IC under his hat, IIRC, I've heard the claim before, or read it somewhere before, but I can't be sure.

Hence, why I'm asking for evidence.

Considering the budget for all these agencies are classified, you're not going to find an unclass link. Common sense, though, will tell you that things like INSCOM, DIA, NSA, ONI, AFRISA, MCIA, NRO, and NGA are going to have more pieces of the pie than the CIA and FBI. Honestly, the only reason you could think otherwise would be if you got all your info about the US intelligence community from TV and movies. Now, there's other agencies out there, too. The Department of Energy has its own intel service, so does the State Department. But then when you consider that there are a multitude of intel units in the DoD that aren't even part of INSCOM/MCIA/ONI/AFRISA (the service component intel commands) things become much clearer. The 82nd/101st/3ID/10th Mountain/etc have their own intel units- and that's just XVIII airborne corps, to say nothing of other Army corps or other service tactical arms or JSOC.

Of course most the intel assets fall under the DoD. It's a no-brainer. You can ask for 'proof' til you're blue in the face- I'm just gonna laugh. Maybe someday I'll show you (again, if I'm really bored), but it should be something that you know if you're going to talk about intel in the first place.

 

[OldWorldOrder]

He is saying 'human spying' - which I assume refers to individuals of a non-military nature.

That's not what that refers to.

I have yet to read this book, although it's been on my list for some time. I heard a radio interview with the author in April and it was very interesting. I'm sure the author is mostly correct in the things he says in the book- who among us is always right? But that little blurb is extremely misleading. To wit: people are arguing about the specific verbiage when the author himself would admit that most intel assets belonged to the DoD before 9/11, and that the CIA had many assassination missions before that as well. The blurb is misleading, that's all.

 

[Jango]

You don't know of the plans to assassinate Castro, then, through out the 1960s?

No, I do, as well the African leader whose name escapes me at the moment. I was thinking this conversatiion didn't apply pre-Church Committee though. My error. At any rate, there are probably plenty of names that could go on, but there's no way of telling for sure without documentation to back it up.

 

[davidtaylorjr]

Well TEA-PUURRTY "patriots" .......your hero ....old HONG-KONG Ed Snowden is off to Russia!
How long before he runs to Iran?

It's so obvious he sat around drinking the right wing kool-aide .....the kool-aide that was started the minute Obama was elected in '08 to try and deligitimize the President!

So right on cue .... Hong-Kong Ed is seeking refuge from adversories or enemies of the US....enemies Obama had nothing to do with!!!

How long before the TEA PUURRTY blow hards ....start ...Pal-ing around with Ahmadinejad?

This is what happens when you're stuck only to an ideology!!

Wow, completely ignorant...

 

[wbcoleman]

'President Barack Obama has converted the CIA into his personal army and granted it unfettered assassination authority.

The story behind the development and deployment of this presidential killing corps is told inThe Way of the Knife: The CIA, a Secret Army, and a War at the Ends of the Earth, the latest book by Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist Mark Mazzetti.

Mazzetti, who writes for the New York Times, describes a role reversal between the army of agents in the CIA and the actual army:

And just as the CIA has come to take on tasks traditionally associated with the military, with spies turned into soldiers, so has the opposite occurred. The American military has been dispersed into the dark spaces of American foreign policy, with commando teams running spying missions that Washington would never have dreamed of approving in the years before 9/11. Prior to the attacks of September 11, the Pentagon did very little human spying, and the CIA was not officially permitted to kill. In the years since, each has done a great deal of both, and a military-intelligence complex has emerged to carry out the new American way of war.'

Obama’s Secret CIA Hit Squad Detailed in “The Way of the Knife” | Tenth Amendment Center

If so, why is Mr. Snowden still out and about?

 

[Spartacus FPV]

If so, why is Mr. Snowden still out and about?

Government incompetence.

 

[wbcoleman]

Government incompetence.

That's our O!

 

[DA60]

If so, why is Mr. Snowden still out and about?

I think if the CIA could find him and get a drone to kill him - they would do so.

Obama - that dickhead - has killed American(s) before without trial.

Why should Snowden be any different?

 

[Jango]

I think if the CIA could find him and get a drone to kill him - they would do so.

Obama - that dickhead - has killed American(s) before without trial.

Why should Snowden be any different?

Because he's white. The outrage would be immediate and severe.

 

[DA60]

Because he's white. The outrage would be immediate and severe.

Whether they were outraged or not - why would Obama care...he has no more elections to win.

Especially after the mid-term elections.

 

[Jango]

Whether they were outraged or not - why would Obama care...he has no more elections to win.

Especially after the mid-term elections.

Something like that could lead to protests in country, maybe even large protests.

 

[OldWorldOrder]

If he would kill Snowden, why hasn't he killed Assange? Why hasn't he killed Manning?

Critical thinking, boys.