No smoking

[TJS0110]

What if the people at a bar are fellow smokers? Why can't there just be smokeing and non-smokeing bars? There are fast food "resteraunts" and healthy food resteraunts, very few, so if you want healthy food you go there.

 

[HTColeman]

What if the people at a bar are fellow smokers? Why can't there just be smokeing and non-smokeing bars? There are fast food "resteraunts" and healthy food resteraunts, very few, so if you want healthy food you go there.

Bars, I believe, are in the same category as private clubs, so they can do what they want. The difference with fast food is that my eating of a McDonald's hamburger does not affect you in any way. However, if I was to pull out a cigarette, you would inhale second hand smoke, which has been proven hazardous to your health.

 

[TJS0110]

I wasnt makeing a health peralellel just an availibility peralellel. Few health food places = few non-smokeing places.

 

[Kelzie]

What if the people at a bar are fellow smokers? Why can't there just be smokeing and non-smokeing bars? There are fast food "resteraunts" and healthy food resteraunts, very few, so if you want healthy food you go there.

That could never work. No bar would be non smoking if there was a smoking one down the street.

 

[TJS0110]

there are non-drinking bars, you would just cater to peole like you or me who dont smoke.

 

[Kelzie]

there are non-drinking bars, you would just cater to peole like you or me who dont smoke.

What in the freakin hell is a non drinking bar? Is that like a restaurant that doesn't have any food? :lol:

 

[TJS0110]

alchol free is what i meant in you know darn well what i meant. You are a thread killer and i will have you brought to justice! haha:lol:

 

[Kelzie]

alchol free is what i meant in you know darn well what i meant. You are a thread killer and i will have you brought to justice! haha:lol:

Seriously?!? That blows my mind. Why would someone go to a bar with no alcohol? It's like going to a zoo with no animals.

Oh wait, is it also known as a "coffee house"? :mrgreen:

 

[HTColeman]

alchol free is what i meant in you know darn well what i meant. You are a thread killer and i will have you brought to justice! haha:lol:

Bars can do whatever they want to do, aside from poisoning their drinks. I thought we were talking about restaurants?

 

[Kelzie]

Bars can do whatever they want to do, aside from poisoning their drinks. I thought we were talking about restaurants?

No they can't. They're subject to the same laws restaurants are.

 

[TJS0110]

nope, the law would apply to any inclosed areas aside from places with less than 50 seats and other special areas.

 

[HTColeman]

No they can't. They're subject to the same laws restaurants are.

Are you sure, I thought they were in the same category as clubs.

 

[Kelzie]

Are you sure, I thought they were in the same category as clubs.

Only if they're private bars. Although I haven't actually heard of any...But bars definitely have to follow the same laws. You think a "whites only" bar is legal?

 

[HTColeman]

Only if they're private bars. Although I haven't actually heard of any...But bars definitely have to follow the same laws. You think a "whites only" bar is legal?

Oh, I never thought about that, carry on...

 

[teacher]

Originally Posted by walrus
Most babies, if left to their own devices, will quite happily eat their own feces.

teacher-I'm guessing your evidence of that is your childhood pictures?

Thank you for that insightful contribution to the discussion. I await your next droplet of wisdom with great enthusiasm.

teacher-Here, class, we see walrus miss a subtle point.

Let me spell it out for you junior.

Say something stupid around me, and I'll find a way to address it with wit and humor, all while speaking to your point, yet without directly speaking to your remark, in such a fashion that most all around except you, understand quite clearly the gist of my post.

It's not my fault you are droll, unimaginative, without humor, (humor, IMHO a sign of intelligence), and can't respond directly to the fact of the matter put to you (though in oblique fashion). Can you say, "over my head"?

Simpler yet:

You've been smacked.

teacher style.

Gosh I just love copy/paste. Does any one use it more adroitly on this site than me? Please tell me if so. I want to learn from them.

Hey walrus, see how this works sport?

 

[teacher]

Seriously?!? That blows my mind. Why would someone go to a bar with no alcohol? It's like going to a zoo with no animals.

teacher-(In the voice of Marv Albert). Yes.

Oh wait, is it also known as a "coffee house"? :mrgreen

teacher-Ah, coffee houses, the summer of '86 in Amsterdam, Holland. I'm pretty certain that smoking was allowed there. Best beer I ever had. Fresh Heineken on tap in frosty mugs, tasty buds, the dollar was kicking ass, little Dutch girls grooving on soldiers, no monkeys though.

 

[walrus]

It's not my fault you are droll, unimaginative, without humor, (humor, IMHO a sign of intelligence), and can't respond directly to the fact of the matter put to you (though in oblique fashion). Can you say, "over my head"?

I am sorry that I seem unintelligent to you. I assure you I am not. I am sorry I seem unimaginative to you. I assure you I am not. Either you do not understand the definition of the word "droll" or you believe it to be a bad quality - either way I will accept that particular designation. I did in fact respond to the matter when it was put to me in a less (as you so adroitly put it) oblique manner. I can further assure you that your point was in no way over my head, it was simply beneath my interest.

You seem to feel that "I take it your evidence was your childhood pictures" addressed my comment with some insight and humour. I fail to see the insight and the humour is at best shoddy.

This discussion has degenerated into a ******* contest (for which I certainly share an equal amount of blame). We are simply stating the same points back and forth, when no one on either side is in the least interested in having their viewpoint changed. I believe that limiting smoking in privately owned buildings is not within the purview of the government, others disagree. The chances are excellent that none of us will budge. Anyone who wants to claim this as a victory is free to.

I have not been attempting to defend smoking. I think anyone with whom I have debated could testify that my views on individual liberties are consistent across the board whether the issue affects me or not. This is how it would work in my ideal world:

Mr. X owns a piece of land. Mr. X builds a bar on his land. Mr. X decides to allow the legal activity of smoking in his bar. Citizen Y doesn't like smoking in bars. Citizen Y forms a group to petition Mr. X to forbid smoking in his bar. Mr. X weighs the business he may lose by forbiding smoking against the business he would gain by forbiding smoking. If Mr. X decides his best business interests lie in forbiding smoking, that is what he does. This is the free market and democracy at it's purest.

People keep bringing up the "whites only" bar comparison. Here is a shocker - I have no problem with a "whites only" bar. I have no problem with a "blacks only" bar. I have no problem with a "latinos only" bar. I have no problem with a "left-handed lesbian cross-dressing Presbyterians" only bar. That is simply my understanding of freedom of association.

One other thing I must address. I have been accused of being insensitive to child abuse. I have spent a great deal of time assisting in the care of children with severe behavioural disorders in an institutional setting. Most of these disorders have been caused by hideous physical, mental, and/or sexual abuse (often all three). Many of these children will remain institutionalized for the rest of their lives. I carry the tortures these children suffered home with me often. Please do not confuse me with someone who does not care about children or their abuse. Please do not confuse smoking around a child with child abuse. I can point to millions of children raised by parents who smoked who suffered no ill effects. I do not know one child who suffered genuine child abuse without obvious mental and often physical scars. If you think I have no sense of humour, maybe this is why.

I was smacked? Gee - I didn't feel it. You must have a weak wrist.

Have fun everyone - See you on another thread.

 

[teacher]

I am sorry that I seem unintelligent to you. I assure you I am not.

me-Oh, but I'm convinced now.

I am sorry I seem unimaginative to you. I assure you I am not.

me-Mr. x and Citizen Y? Come on bro, how about Vague and Curly. Tarzan and Satan. cnredd and his girlfriend 26x world champs. Rewrite and turn in at the begining of class tommorro.

I can further assure you that your point was in no way over my head, it was simply beneath my interest.

Me-i.e., wha?

You seem to feel that "I take it your evidence was your childhood pictures" addressed my comment with some insight and humour. I fail to see the insight and the humour is at best shoddy.

me- I got a chuckle. This guy had such a spasm he wrote it down.....

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahhahaahhaahaahhaahha.

Teacher, you are an insane individual. :lol:

This discussion has degenerated into a ******* contest

me-I always win those, except against you and your vivid imagination.

Anyone who wants to claim this as a victory is free to.

me-Thank you. I'm teacher, I win, I'm the greatest, I win.

Mr. X owns a piece of land. Mr. X builds a bar on his land. Mr. X decides to allow the legal activity of smoking in his bar. Citizen Y doesn't like smoking in bars. Citizen Y forms a group to petition Mr. X to forbid smoking in his bar. Mr. X weighs the business he may lose by forbiding smoking against the business he would gain by forbiding smoking. If Mr. X decides his best business interests lie in forbiding smoking, that is what he does. This is the free market and democracy at it's purest.

me-Just for the record, I agree with you on this.

People keep bringing up the "whites only" bar comparison. Here is a shocker - I have no problem with a "whites only" bar. I have no problem with a "blacks only" bar. I have no problem with a "latinos only" bar. I have no problem with a "left-handed lesbian cross-dressing Presbyterians" only bar. That is simply my understanding of freedom of association.

me-But then the libs. We can have a Black Entertainment network. You know the rest....

If you think I have no sense of humour, maybe this is why.

me-Dude, kids need to laugh too. I hope you do that for them.

I was smacked? Gee - I didn't feel it. You must have a weak wrist.

me-See, that's not bad. See how I laugh when made fun of? So you can dish it but not take it. Or maybe you're just the sensitive type. My bad.

 

[Fantasea]

Mr. X owns a piece of land. Mr. X builds a bar on his land. Mr. X decides to allow the legal activity of smoking in his bar. Citizen Y doesn't like smoking in bars. Citizen Y forms a group to petition Mr. X to forbid smoking in his bar. Mr. X weighs the business he may lose by forbiding smoking against the business he would gain by forbiding smoking. If Mr. X decides his best business interests lie in forbiding smoking, that is what he does. This is the free market and democracy at it's purest.

This entire thread seems to ignore the essential element.

In order to build ANYTHING on his land, your hypothetical fellow must first seek the permission of the planning board in his municipality.

He will then be told what he may or may not build on his land and in the event he is given permission to erect a building, be apprised of any restrictions that may apply. He will be required to observe any and all laws, etc., which regulate the operation of his business.

If the municipality regulates smoking in a bar, what choice does he have?

 

[walrus]

Let me spell it out for you junior....

It's not my fault you are droll, unimaginative, without humor, (humor, IMHO a sign of intelligence), and can't respond directly to the fact of the matter put to you (though in oblique fashion). Can you say, "over my head"?

You've been smacked.

me-Oh, but I'm convinced now.

maybe you're just the sensitive type. My bad.

You know what I say about people who use personal attacks? They realize they're wrong and their arguments suck, but they hope that if make a fool of themselves by insulting the other person, noone will notice.

Thanks Kelzie, couldn't have said it better myself...

 

[Kelzie]

I meant to be done with this thread, but I couldn't resist showing that teacher isn't the only one who knows how to cut and paste...

In teach's defense, he rarely actually has an argument in the first place...:mrgreen:

 

[HTColeman]

me-But then the libs. We can have a Black Entertainment network. You know the rest....

Just for the record, BET is owned by the WHITE MAN! "What black people watch", yea whatever, I spit on it.