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NBC does it again

shuamort

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Stinger said:
There is really no need for you to waste time posting the definition of satire, we can stipulate that we all know they are using satire.

So the way to win Christians as an audience is to mock their deepest religious beliefs? Doesn't seem to be working so well for them.
It sounds like you have proof to backup that claim. Please show.
 

Stinger

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger
There is really no need for you to waste time posting the definition of satire, we can stipulate that we all know they are using satire.

So the way to win Christians as an audience is to mock their deepest religious beliefs? Doesn't seem to be working so well for them.<<

You>> Come on now, there's no need to repeat, we got it the first time.

Since there was no answer the first time.
 

shuamort

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Stinger said:
That proof doesn't support your claim that "So the way to win Christians as an audience is to mock their deepest religious beliefs? Doesn't seem to be working so well for them." Unless those statistics are directly correlated to the way Christians are watching NBC based upon their, they're syllogistic. The articles don't show direct causation.
 

jallman

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Stinger said:
So the way to win Christians as an audience is to mock their deepest religious beliefs? Doesn't seem to be working so well for them.

Why do we Christians have to have everything geared toward us and our sensibilities? Is it really necessary to lobby for the removal of shows like The Book of Daniel or cant we just turn the damned dial if we dont like what we see?
 

Deegan

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jallman said:
Why do we Christians have to have everything geared toward us and our sensibilities? Is it really necessary to lobby for the removal of shows like The Book of Daniel or cant we just turn the damned dial if we dont like what we see?

We don't have to, but enough people may be sensitive, that they may want to consider it. Still, you have this way of reverting back to the old "why not just change the channel" thing, what if the show was called "Stupid Homo's" would you then say "just change the channel"?

Of course not, we need to be active in what is seen on our televisions, especially when it's not a cable channel that can be controlled more easily.;)
 

jallman

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Deegan said:
We don't have to, but enough people may be sensitive, that they may want to consider it. Still, you have this way of reverting back to the old "why not just change the channel" thing, what if the show was called "Stupid Homo's" would you then say "just change the channel"?

Of course not, we need to be active in what is seen on our televisions, especially when it's not a cable channel that can be controlled more easily.;)

Actually, there is a show that should be called "Stupid Homo and Drunk Fag-hag". It's actually called Will and Grace...and guess what, if I am not in a particular mood to deal with the character of Jack, I turn the channel. Then there are all the countless shows sketch comedies that take their jabs at homos...I turn the channel or, I dunno, here s a crazy idea...take it for the joke that it is and laugh a little.

Being active about what is seen on your television is understanding the concept of the power button or the channel changing buttons on the remote. It is not the responsibility of the rest of society to censor its comedy to protect a bunch of whiny, humorless evangelicals.
 

Stinger

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shuamort said:
That proof doesn't support your claim that "So the way to win Christians as an audience is to mock their deepest religious beliefs? Doesn't seem to be working so well for them." Unless those statistics are directly correlated to the way Christians are watching NBC based upon their, they're syllogistic. The articles don't show direct causation.

So the way to win Christians as an audience is to mock their deepest religious beliefs?

Yes or no? NBC has been losing audience, and as someone noted since the vast majority of the US is Chrisitian then it is a reasonable assumption that the majority of NBC's audience is Christian, over their programming for years. So yes or no? Obviously they think so else they would not have cancelled the one or rewrote the second which are topics of this thread.
 

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jallman said:
Why do we Christians have to have everything geared toward us and our sensibilities? Is it really necessary to lobby for the removal of shows like The Book of Daniel or cant we just turn the damned dial if we dont like what we see?

I'm not a Christian so I can't speak for them. But as someone else noted and I will add to, when the gay groups were upset about Dr. Laura couldn't they have just changed the channel?
 

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jallman said:
Actually, there is a show that should be called "Stupid Homo and Drunk Fag-hag". It's actually called Will and Grace...and guess what, if I am not in a particular mood to deal with the character of Jack, I turn the channel. Then there are all the countless shows sketch comedies that take their jabs at homos...I turn the channel or, I dunno, here s a crazy idea...take it for the joke that it is and laugh a little.

Being active about what is seen on your television is understanding the concept of the power button or the channel changing buttons on the remote. It is not the responsibility of the rest of society to censor its comedy to protect a bunch of whiny, humorless evangelicals.


:rofl Will and Grace, that was funny.

I was merely pointing out that "just change the channel" is in no way a solution to better programing on public television. The power button has very little to do with public opinion, it is advertisers, and network executives that deal with these decisions, and public opinion forms those decisions for them.
 

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Stinger said:
I'm not a Christian so I can't speak for them. But as someone else noted and I will add to, when the gay groups were upset about Dr. Laura couldn't they have just changed the channel?

Absolutely. There is only one slight difference, worth mentioning but not worth creating a huge debate over. Dr. Laura claims credibility and preaches absolute hate, not for entertainment and fun, but for the sole purpose of promoting intolerant and bigoted ideologies. Standing against her was no different than stopping a Klan leader from getting his own show.

That being said, if she did get a show and I didnt want to hear it, I am always free to turn the channel.
 

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Deegan said:
:rofl Will and Grace, that was funny.

I was merely pointing out that "just change the channel" is in no way a solution to better programing on public television. The power button has very little to do with public opinion, it is advertisers, and network executives that deal with these decisions, and public opinion forms those decisions for them.

I don't know what you mean by 'public opinion forms those decisions', but network executives want to make money, and they do that through advertising, which is solely dependent on the Nielsen Ratings system.

Since the Nielsen Ratings system directly deals with 'the power button' and changing the channel, I'd say that it IS a solution to better programing on public television.
 

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jallman said:
Absolutely. There is only one slight difference, worth mentioning .................

That being said, if she did get a show and I didnt want to hear it, I am always free to turn the channel.

No it was not worth mentioning concerning this issue.
 

shuamort

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Stinger said:
So the way to win Christians as an audience is to mock their deepest religious beliefs?

Yes or no?
There are a lot of assumptions in your argument here. One, that NBC is going for the Christian demo. Two, that "Crucifixins", a joke that has been done twice before with nary a peep from the Christians is an attempt to mock. Third that satire=mock.

That's a lot to assume.
Stinger said:
NBC has been losing audience, and as someone noted since the vast majority of the US is Chrisitian then it is a reasonable assumption that the majority of NBC's audience is Christian, over their programming for years. So yes or no?
That would mean that whatever happens in the US in a major way is influenced by Christians. Thusly, since obesity in America is becoming endemic, we can blame Christianity. It's a syllogism to come to this conclusion ESPECIALLY since Fox has run the same joke twice and you're not bringing in the ratings for them. It's easy to create an argument when you only take the statistics that support your claim into the picture.

Stinger said:
Obviously they think so else they would not have cancelled the one or rewrote the second which are topics of this thread.
Or maybe they just didn't want to offend some people that are so reactionary that they freak out before ever seeing it.

I'm offended by the church programming on all of the network channels every Sunday morning. You know what I do? I don't watch. Problem solved.
 

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shuamort said:
There are a lot of assumptions in your argument here. One, that NBC is going for the Christian demo.

No my assumption is that they ARE NOT. And since about 80% of this country is Christian, that's my point, it sure doesn't look like they are trying to attract them. Now if you were a stockholder in NBC and you knew they were trying to insult 80% of the viewing audience...........

That would mean that whatever happens in the US in a major way is influenced by Christians.

Now look who's assuming.

Thusly, since obesity in America is becoming endemic, we can blame Christianity.

Now there's a stretch and a complete mistatement. What could be said is that most obese people are Christiaian. But where you get the "blame" from is puzzling but not very interesting anyway.


I'm offended by the church programming on all of the network channels every Sunday morning. You know what I do? I don't watch. Problem solved.

Do you somehow believe the network pays for them or something. That is bought time by the church, the network doesn't care what you think about it. Apples and oranges.
 

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shuamort said:
There are a lot of assumptions in your argument here. One, that NBC is going for the Christian demo. Two, that "Crucifixins", a joke that has been done twice before with nary a peep from the Christians is an attempt to mock. Third that satire=mock.

That's a lot to assume.

That would mean that whatever happens in the US in a major way is influenced by Christians. Thusly, since obesity in America is becoming endemic, we can blame Christianity. It's a syllogism to come to this conclusion ESPECIALLY since Fox has run the same joke twice and you're not bringing in the ratings for them. It's easy to create an argument when you only take the statistics that support your claim into the picture.


Or maybe they just didn't want to offend some people that are so reactionary that they freak out before ever seeing it.

I'm offended by the church programming on all of the network channels every Sunday morning. You know what I do? I don't watch. Problem solved.

Very well said.
 

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Mikkel said:
I don't know what you mean by 'public opinion forms those decisions', but network executives want to make money, and they do that through advertising, which is solely dependent on the Nielsen Ratings system.

Since the Nielsen Ratings system directly deals with 'the power button' and changing the channel, I'd say that it IS a solution to better programing on public television.

I'm not sure why you are having a problem with this, maybe I need to explain this further. I am aware of the ratings, those are indeed "public opinion" I was referring to the the show in question, and if enough people object, that show will not survive, advertisers will pull out, and the executives will have little choice but to replace, or cancel the program. I believe we are on the same page, but one must certainly consider public opinion, or a public outcry from contraversial programs. This is all I am saying, you can't just say, "turn the channel" t.v does not work that way, and if you want a show to survive, you must consider A and B.

I hope that helps.;)
 

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Stinger said:
No it was not worth mentioning concerning this issue.

Then why did you bring up Dr. Laura to start with? It was worth mentioning Dr. Laura when you thought it made a point for you, but when the point was rebutted, the most you could come up with was..."No it wasnt worth mentioning". You got to do better than that...
 

shuamort

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Stinger said:
No my assumption is that they ARE NOT.
Then what's the big deal if they offend the non-demographics. I swear it seems you keep moving the argument. Maybe it's just me.


Stinger said:
And since about 80% of this country is Christian, that's my point, it sure doesn't look like they are trying to attract them. Now if you were a stockholder in NBC and you knew they were trying to insult 80% of the viewing audience...........
Still assumptions that All folks that watch the show are Christians and even a further assumption that all Christians would be offended by something so inane and repetitive that's already been done on Fox twice before.

Stinger said:
Now look who's assuming.
You.

Stinger said:
Now there's a stretch and a complete mistatement. What could be said is that most obese people are Christiaian. But where you get the "blame" from is puzzling but not very interesting anyway.

That's the problem with the syllogism you're proposing though. You're not seeing the forest for the trees. That's why I've linked the two to show you how your syllogism sinks like a stone.


Stinger said:
Do you somehow believe the network pays for them or something. That is bought time by the church, the network doesn't care what you think about it. Apples and oranges.
Networks care about how much the spots go for, right? If they could get more for the timeslot, they'd take it.
 

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Deegan said:
I'm not sure why you are having a problem with this, maybe I need to explain this further. I am aware of the ratings, those are indeed "public opinion" I was referring to the the show in question, and if enough people object, that show will not survive, advertisers will pull out, and the executives will have little choice but to replace, or cancel the program. I believe we are on the same page, but one must certainly consider public opinion, or a public outcry from contraversial programs. This is all I am saying, you can't just say, "turn the channel" t.v does not work that way, and if you want a show to survive, you must consider A and B.

I hope that helps.;)

You're right, we're on the same page. Public opinion, or outcry DOES affect what shows are put on the air, but not always in expected ways. Occasionally, a show will stay on the air BECAUSE it's controversial, and people become curious and the ratings go up. The bottom line is that controversial shows with poor ratings will get booted off the air immediately, and shows that are controversial, but have good ratings are a little tricker. I'd still bet on executives going with ratings over anything else. But you're right, public outcry does count as a separate factor from the ratings system, although it's somewhat unclear as to what effect it has.
 

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Did they cancel it? Nuf said.
 

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jallman said:
Then why did you bring up Dr. Laura to start with? It was worth mentioning Dr. Laura when you thought it made a point for you, but when the point was rebutted, the most you could come up with was..."No it wasnt worth mentioning". You got to do better than that...

On the point I was making it was a salient point, your attack on her was not worth mentioning, I could care less what she was saying or not, and you even said it was not worth debating, I agreed.
 

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I can't help but notice something.

Christians take perpetual beatings and disrespect from the news media, the academic world, and the entertainment industry, and they usually respond by writing offended letters or something of that nature.

Muslims across the globe right now are assaulting Westerners, expelling ambassadors, taking hostages, burning down embassies, boycotting all Danish products, and vandalizing E.U. buildings, etc. and over what? One cartoon.

It's a good thing Islam is a religion of peace. I would hate to see what it would look like if it was the bloodthirsty, fanatical, hate-mongering terror-machine conservatives usually take it for.
 

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aquapub said:
It's a good thing Islam is a religion of peace. I would hate to see what it would look like if it was the bloodthirsty, fanatical, hate-mongering terror-machine conservatives usually take it for.

I wonder why NBC won't do something like have a character who keeps a copy of the Koran in his bathroom and everytime he uses the toliet he pulls a page out and uses it for "hygenic" purposes. I mean toliet humour seems to be the favorite of brainless consumers these days, would probably get a big laugh.

Bet they won't disrepect Islam like they do Chrisitians. In fact I bet their would be a liberal outcry for being so hateful towards Muslims.
 

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Stinger said:
I wonder why NBC won't do something like have a character who keeps a copy of the Koran in his bathroom and everytime he uses the toliet he pulls a page out and uses it for "hygenic" purposes. I mean toliet humour seems to be the favorite of brainless consumers these days, would probably get a big laugh.

Bet they won't disrepect Islam like they do Chrisitians. In fact I bet their would be a liberal outcry for being so hateful towards Muslims.
This is rediculous. Have you seen any program that used te bible for the same purpose? You're arguments are based entirely out of nothing but partisan bickering.
 
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