Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey[W:14]

[Natan]

Surprise surprise. This survey comes at a time when Russia is propping up Assad:

Most Syrians arriving in Europe are fleeing the Assad regime and not Islamic State, according to the first survey of Syrian refugees arriving in Germany, underlining the West’s dilemma over whether to prop up Damascus. Seventy per cent of those who fled the fighting in Syria said that they were escaping violence by the regime. The survey also showed that most refugees would prefer to return to Syria, but 52 per cent said they would do so only if President Assad were overthrown.
Syrians are fleeing Assad bombs not Isis | The Times

Claiming they are fleeing Assad also reduces their odds of being sent back if they claim asylum. If you want to know why this survey is complete and utter bull****:

Only 8 per cent said they wanted to settle permanently in Europe, ...
Syrians are fleeing Assad bombs not Isis | The Times

 

[Lovebug]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

Just to think if all able bodied men would fight for their country instead of running like scared little girls, Assad would be done and gone.
Cowards

 

[OrphanSlug]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

At this point it is not surprising that journalism has completely made a mess of covering this long term multiple way civil war, that is also a complete mess in itself. I have all but given up on expectation of truth in reporting on this conflict now, made exponentially worse by Russia's active participation in an effort to salvage al-Assad's reign.

 

[joG]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

Surprise surprise. This survey comes at a time when Russia is propping up Assad:

Claiming they are fleeing Assad also reduces their odds of being sent back if they claim asylum. If you want to know why this survey is complete and utter bull****:

You might want to read this, to understand, what you are defending:

‘They were torturing to kill’: inside Syria’s death machine | Garance le Caisne | World news | The Guardian
(Introduction)


(To see meaning of torture you must read the last section as well as the first few lines)



And it would appear that we are in the middle of a policy debate on how to deal with Assad.

Can the U.S. Defeat ISIS Without Removing Assad? - The Atlantic

 

[anatta]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

I can't read the OP. But it wouldnot be surprising that the population centers being bombed by assad would
have more refugees.

Also many cannot flee Raqqa or Mosul -ISIS will not often let them leave where they have their 'State'

 

[betuadollar]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

It's been a subject of debate since the beginning but what surprised me is that Obama chose to align with the Bush administration. But if we go back to just 2007, wasn't Pelosi courting Assad?

 

[OrphanSlug]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

It's been a subject of debate since the beginning but what surprised me is that Obama chose to align with the Bush administration. But if we go back to just 2007, wasn't Pelosi courting Assad?

Sort of, Pelosi (being the complete idiot that she is) did meet with al-Assad in 2007 concerning Israel where Syria had some support for Hezbollah and Hamas, with the secondary issue being militants crossing from Syria into Iraq during that critical point of that campaign. It was largely ineffective and did not result in much.

 

[Natan]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

You might want to read this, to understand, what you are defending:

‘They were torturing to kill’: inside Syria’s death machine | Garance le Caisne | World news | The Guardian
(Introduction)

A report into the credibility of certain evidence with regard to torture and execution of persons incarcerated by the current Syrian regime | World news | theguardian.com
(To see meaning of torture you must read the last section as well as the first few lines)

Holocaust Museum Displays Echoes of Nazi Era in Syria War Photos | Foreign Policy

And it would appear that we are in the middle of a policy debate on how to deal with Assad.

Can the U.S. Defeat ISIS Without Removing Assad? - The Atlantic

Meh, Saudi Arabia probably does the same or worse and the US government doesn't bat an eye. Assad is a necessary evil.

 

[joG]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

Meh, Saudi Arabia probably does the same or worse and the US government doesn't bat an eye. Assad is a necessary evil.

It is alway a primitive trick to point at someone you don't like. But let's take this criminal for the moment. I know you support him. But why? Did you look at the material? Do you believe that treatment is permissible? Do you think a dictator should be allowed to shoot demonstrators?

 

[Natan]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

I know you support him. But why?

I have a colleague who is studying in my country with a scholarship from the Syrian government, from a place not so far where the Russians have their naval base. So he may be a bit biased, but when I asked him about the situation and what his opinion was, apparently under Assad it was not perfect but better than what it is now. According to him, a lot of the problems stem from the issue that a lot of people have their own version of religion and different strains of islam and no one is willing to compromise.

Did you look at the material? Do you believe that treatment is permissible? Do you think a dictator should be allowed to shoot demonstrators?

I saw the material months (years?) ago when it actually came out. I do not believe such treatment is permissible. I don't think shooting demonstrators should be allowed. I don't think either war is the answer as that might kill even more people and make things even worse.

 

[American]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

Muslim Women In Syria Speak Out About Men Leaving Them Behind To Fend For Themselves [Video] » 100percentfedUp.com

Might not be a solid source, but there is no doubt the men are leaving the women behind. And Europe is letting these cowards into their countries. It's ****ing pathetic!

 

[Chagos]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

Might not be a solid source,

........nails it to the point of nuff bein' said.

 

[Natan]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

........nails it to the point of nuff bein' said.

Ah yes, standard tactic of the intellectually lazy. Dismiss the source, regardless of truth of the matter. You can check UNHCR figures too if you want. Since clicking is hard on the thumbs and information is hard on the brain, I doubt you will. The majority ARE men.

 

[Gina]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

Moderator's Warning:

Enough with the snark. Remember which forum this is in.

 

[Chagos]

Re: Most Syrians are fleeing Assad, according to bogus survey

Ah yes, standard tactic of the intellectually lazy. Dismiss the source, regardless of truth of the matter. You can check UNHCR figures too if you want. Since clicking is hard on the thumbs and information is hard on the brain, I doubt you will. The majority ARE men.

Of course they are.

I'd go and have my head examined if I'd even think of taking my wife and kids onto those death buckets when trying to find a better life for all of us elsewhere.

If I find recognition as a political asylant, THEN is the time to arrange for their passage, if I can.

You may find this distasteful, unacceptable, sensible, understandable, whatever. Not pertinent to the issue.

It might also benefit to realize that the bulk is coming not directly from Syria (which they left considerable time ago already) but from Lebanon and Turkey, having (if they could manage) taken heir families with them to THERE first. So the article you cite is conveniently suppressing this little fact so that wholesale accusations of cowardice may be spread.

The camp conditions, especially in Lebanon and thru no particular fault of the Lebanese, are by now atrocious. Nevertheless the families left behind for the duration of the quest for better conditions in Germany or Scandinavia are less likely to be rained upon by barrel bombs meanwhile.

You may know a Syrian with an Assad scholarship for Belgium, I happen to know Syria (or used to before this whole thing went pear shaped). Same with Lebanon (when it WAS pear shaped far more than now). Even lived in the area for years, other countries included.

So I'll dismiss your comments on my perceived intellectual capacities as irrelevant to the issue.


P.S. Great Avatar BTW, even if out of timely context. Often read that thing when working in the BRD but it's been years meanwhile.

 

[Chagos]

Surprise surprise. This survey comes at a time when Russia is propping up Assad:



Claiming they are fleeing Assad also reduces their odds of being sent back if they claim asylum. If you want to know why this survey is complete and utter bull****:

Sorry, I'm a bit bemused by this.

You claim the survey to be bogus (which it may or may not be) and link to the same article (twice) to substantiate your claim.

Yet nothing is substantiated.

Help!

 

[Natan]

You claim the survey to be bogus (which it may or may not be) and link to the same article (twice) to substantiate your claim.

I am sorry if you have reading comprehension. I was kind enough to provide two relevant excerpts out of the same survey results (so YES, twice the same link), two claims, the latter of which should call into doubt the validity of all results due to the inherent unlikeliness of migrating through several safe countries to reach Germany, to end up with only 8% claiming they permanently want to stay there. If this is too difficult to comprehend, I suggest you go back to school or follow some online classes.

Let me explain it to you as if you were a child studying logical reasoning 101: if A and B are claimed to be true simultaneously, and B can be shown to be almost certainly false, how sure can we still be A is true?

 

[Chagos]

I am sorry if you have reading comprehension. I was kind enough to provide two relevant excerpts out of the same survey results (so YES, twice the same link), two claims, the latter of which should call into doubt the validity of all results due to the inherent unlikeliness of migrating through several safe countries to reach Germany, to end up with only 8% claiming they permanently want to stay there. If this is too difficult to comprehend, I suggest you go back to school or follow some online classes.

Let me explain it to you as if you were a child studying logical reasoning 101: if A and B are claimed to be true simultaneously, and B can be shown to be almost certainly false, how sure can we still be A is true?

On the matter of reading comprehension, let me remind you by pointing to

Moderator's Warning:

Enough with the snark. Remember which forum this is in.

I do not treat YOU like a child but maybe I should?

 

[Natan]

If you could stop being annoying like you don't know what is meant. Let me just ask you point blank: do you really believe only 8% of Syrian refugees went all the way to Germany to stay there permanently and the rest would (depending on conditions according to the survey) return?

 

[Chagos]

If you could stop being annoying like you don't know what is meant. Let me just ask you point blank: do you really believe only 8% of Syrian refugees went all the way to Germany to stay there permanently and the rest would (depending on conditions according to the survey) return?

This, so as to educate you on the issue of serious reporting, is not about what I believe and it's not about what you believe.

It's about, or should be, about what is actually known.

What seems to become apparent from your postings and in all their frequency is that you pursue an agenda that does not have gain of knowledge beyond what you prefer as its main persuasion.

That's perfectly all right by me and you can go and knock yourself out on it by all means. Fine.

Apart from which, if you find me annoying that's just as well. Give and take sort of thing. No guarantees offered here of having your cake and eating it, if you want guarantees I'd suggest purchase of a toaster

You ever been to Syria, know any Syrians beyond that Assad financed student in your country?

This thing is complex and will not be served by oversimplifying the issue into merely throwing dirt at random people, alternating between politicos (not altogether undeservedly) and randomly selected refugees (not altogether undeservedly in certain cases either).

So either you have something of intelligence to contribute to the problem discussed, intelligence, that is, which goes beyond the run of the mill xenophobic ranting, or you don't.

Either is fine by all means but which one is it?

 

[Natan]

I see you dodged answering a direct question. Tells a lot.

And no I don't know any other Syrians.

 

[Chagos]

I see you dodged answering a direct question. Tells a lot.

I answered it in detail. That you can't understand that is sad but I'm not going to make it MY problem.

And no I don't know any other Syrians.

I knew that, everything pointing that way.

 

[Natan]

I answered it in detail.

The original question:

Let me just ask you point blank: do you really believe only 8% of Syrian refugees went all the way to Germany to stay there permanently and the rest would (depending on conditions according to the survey) return?

was answered "in detail" with this diversion:

This, so as to educate you on the issue of serious reporting, is not about what I believe and it's not about what you believe. It's about, or should be, about what is actually known.

 

[Chagos]

The original question:



was answered "in detail" with this diversion:

Great, you finally got it.

 

[Paleocon]

Surprise surprise. This survey comes at a time when Russia is propping up Assad:



Claiming they are fleeing Assad also reduces their odds of being sent back if they claim asylum. If you want to know why this survey is complete and utter bull****:

I have some very valuable properties for sale to anyone who believes that survey.