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Liberals are avoiding my point

Give them a good education. College should be free for anyone who wants a good education, it will allow them to get better paying jobs and escape the poverty of the ghetto. Stop putting blacks in prison on minor drug arrests. When someone needs psychological counseling call a therapist not 911 and a cop with a gun.
 
iguanaman said:
Cops are not supposed to be judge and jury. Why would there be anyone killed by cops? Each situation is different but that is why we need an independent investigation agency that looks into every cop killing. Police need to know that their behavior will be examined if they kill someone while under arrest.
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Self defense maybe?

I have no problem with police oversight.
 
HumblePi said:
Give them a good education. College should be free for anyone who wants a good education, it will allow them to get better paying jobs and escape the poverty of the ghetto. Stop putting blacks in prison on minor drug arrests. When someone needs psychological counseling call a therapist not 911 and a cop with a gun.
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I can agree on the drug issue, it’s insane to lock people up for drug use. It’s caused way more problems than it has solved.
 
Simpletruther said:
No, complain to the moon about it. I complain too. But we should do so based upon the truth and not false claims, which result in lots of suffering and misery for blacks themselves who have had their communities damaged based on a false narrative. Not to mention how much more crimes like robbery and rape are likely happening to defenseless blacks during this chaos where cops are backing off and letting criminals run wild.
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I'm not sure what any difference in crime makes to the hundreds of examples of police assaulting protesters over the past two weeks.
 
Simpletruther said:
Does anyone here care to answer directly and halve a dialog on this?

Blacks are 5 times more likely to murder and even higher numbers for other violent crimes like rape and felony assault etc.

That is staggering.

So, given this, why would you not expect the same proportions with regards to more dangerous encounters with police (5 times as often) and as a result proportionately more deaths by police (5 or more times the deaths)? How is that not a rational assumption?
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Problem is you are talking percentages, in raw numbers there are more whites killed by cops than blacks even though most crimes are committed by the much lower numbers of blacks. Over 360 whites were killed by cops, yet 56 percent of all crime is committed by blacks.

Police Shooting by the Numbers:
The Post's reporting shows that both the annual number and circumstances of fatal shootings and the overall demographics of the victims have remained constant over the past four years.
The dead: 45 per cent white men; 23 per cent black men; and 16 per cent Hispanic men. Women have accounted for about 5 per cent of those killed, and people in mental distress about 25 per cent of all shootings.
About 54 per cent of those killed have been armed with guns and 4 per cent unarmed.

US police shoot almost 1,000 people dead every year, figures show | The Independent
 
Lakryte said:
The statistics just as easily suggest that black people are more likely to be policed and convicted of crimes than white people, or that white people are more likely to get away with it.

Also, you have to consider the extent to which crime results from a lack of education and opportunities, both of which have been denied to black people throughout this country's history through persistent and systemic racism.
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Of course, if one group has a higher crime rate, that community will have more interactions with the police, with results that are good, bad or indifferent. What’s the point of all this? Poor neighborhoods are often higher crime areas. This has been true for over 150 years in the US.

What is weird reading these arguments that note crime rates by the race of the unarmed victim or emphasize bad things done by him/her while alive, is that they clumsily dodge telling us what society should do about it other than excuse the police or civilians when they kill them.
 
Cardinal said:
I'm not sure what any difference in crime makes to the hundreds of examples of police assaulting protesters over the past two weeks.
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Makes a big difference to the victims.

Link to these hundreds of assaults?
 
Nickyjo said:
Of course, if one group has a higher crime rate, that community will have more interactions with the police, with results that are good, bad or indifferent. What’s the point of all this? Poor neighborhoods are often higher crime areas. This has been true for over 150 years in the US.

What is weird reading these arguments that note crime rates by the race of the unarmed victim or emphasize bad things done by him/her while alive, is that they clumsily dodge telling us what society should do about it other than excuse the police or civilians when they kill them.
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More dangerous violent interactions with police Would tend to lead to proportionately more deaths.
 
Simpletruther said:
More dangerous violent interactions with police Would tend to lead to proportionately more deaths.
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Jogging isn't violent. Nor is sleeping in your apartment. Allegedly passing a counterfeit $20 bill isn't violent, either.

The OP is a red herring.
 
Cardinal said:
The protesters are the victims.

GeorgeFloyd Protest - police brutality videos on Twitter - Google Drive
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I clicked on A random sample of two of them, one was a cop shooting tear gas maybe? It had no context at all who or why. No evidence at all of an assault.


Second sample I clicked on, cops beating people,with billy clubs. No context of what started it. No evidence of an assault at all. And there was clearly during this some others charging at and assaulting the police. A far cry from “peaceful protestors”.


Of course that was about what I expected.

I have no doubt the cops assaulted a few people though, and just like the false claims of wide spread black deaths by cop, this claim of yours of hundreds is likely false as well. It’s probably just a small handful.
 
Michael Cole said:
Jogging isn't violent. Nor is sleeping in your apartment. Allegedly passing a counterfeit $20 bill isn't violent, either.

The OP is a red herring.
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No, this ^ is a red herring.

The fact that cops sometimes wrongly kill people doesn’t change the statistical reality that on the whole they are not disproportionality killing blacks, not by a long shot. Both blacks and whites are occasionally wrongly killed by cops. Nobody denies that.


You’re point about cops killing innocents would only drive up the numbers and create more disproportion, yet we don’t see it in the stats. Which means it’s rare.
 
Simpletruther said:
I clicked on A random sample of two of them, one was a cop shooting tear gas maybe? It had no context at all who or why. No evidence at all of an assault.


Second sample I clicked on, cops beating people,with billy clubs. No context of what started it. No evidence of an assault at all. And there was clearly during this some others charging at and assaulting the police. A far cry from “peaceful protestors”.


Of course that was about what I expected.

I have no doubt the cops assaulted a few people though, and just like the false claims of wide spread black deaths by cop, this claim of yours of hundreds is likely false as well. It’s probably just a small handful.
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Which “random videos” did you click on?
 
Simpletruther said:
So, given this, why would you not expect the same proportions with regards to more dangerous encounters with police (5 times as often) and as a result proportionately more deaths by police (5 or more times the deaths)? How is that not a rational assumption?
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First, you're basing your assumption that African Americans are more likely to commit crimes on the fact that they're arrested more often.

But the more important point is that all of that is still driven by poverty and the war on drugs which are still problems that wee need to fix.
 
Simpletruther said:
No, this ^ is a red herring.

The fact that cops sometimes wrongly kill people doesn’t change the statistical reality that on the whole they are not disproportionality killing blacks, not by a long shot. Both blacks and whites are occasionally wrongly killed by cops. Nobody denies that.


You’re point about cops killing innocents would only drive up the numbers and create more disproportion, yet we don’t see it in the stats. Which means it’s rare.
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Blah, blah, blah.

Nobody cares. Not even your statistics instructor.
 
MrWonka said:
First, you're basing your assumption that African Americans are more likely to commit crimes on the fact that they're arrested more often.

But the more important point is that all of that is still driven by poverty and the war on drugs which are still problems that wee need to fix.
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At least we can agree on the drug issue. The war of drugs is a terrible policy and failure.

And it’s violent crimes. You think whites are just getting away with lots of violent crimes?
 
Simpletruther said:
More dangerous violent interactions with police Would tend to lead to proportionately more deaths.
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Of course they would. The issue i was raising was not being clueless about that obvious factor, but the tendency to search the background of the dead guy to suggest that an obvious brutal, vicious, even horribly mistaken action was justified due to the dead person’s flaws
 
Simpletruther said:
You don’t care about truth it seems.
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Truth? Lmao. The OP is about statistical analysis of police homicides. I don't care about statistical analysis of police homicides. Nor does anyone else. Seriously, where have you been?

This is what everyone cares about:

Ahmaud Arbery hit by truck and shot dead while jogging

Breonna Taylor shot dead while sleeping in her apartment

George Floyd strangulated while being detained for allegedly passing a counterfeit $20 bill

Why do I need to repeat this?
 
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