ricksfolly
DP Veteran
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2009
- Messages
- 2,236
- Reaction score
- 232
- Location
- Grand Junction, CO 81506
- Gender
- Male
- Political Leaning
- Independent
Why is murdering one person a crime and murdering thousands of innocent men, women and children in a war heroic?
ricksfolly
The death of one is a tragedy
The death of a million is just a statistic
-Marilyn Manson
A question with a very long answer...
Brrrr... All of a sudden it got very cold.
ricksfolly
Good lord, are you actually serious?
Killing in war isn't murder, for one. Murder is an unlawful killing.
The State maintains a monopoly on the initiation of force, and legally legitimizes the initiation of force in its name for its purposes. Therefore it isn't murder.
If you want to argue about whether it was just or not, that will require specifics. Some wars are just, some are not.
It is circumstantially dependent.
It is murder if the war is illegal, as our wars usually are. It's considered heroic because we apply a double standard.
The death of one is a tragedy
The death of a million is just a statistic
-Marilyn Manson
.
If the UN determines a war is not legal, can they bring it to the world court?
ricksfolly
Our wars are usually "illegal". Good lord man, are you feeling OK?
Yah, the UN... which has such a GREAT record of righting wrongs and protecting the innocent, a third of whose membership consists of tyrants and oppressive governments. Yeah, the UN. :roll:
I think Stalin originally said that
Our wars are usually "illegal". Good lord man, are you feeling OK?
You're the ill one... The only legal war is retaliation when we're attacked by a COUNTRY, not individuals who may or may not be connected to a country.
We were not attacked by Afghanistan, Iraq, nor any of the others excursions since Pearl Harbor, and since the UN is ran by us, any decision the UN makes is orchestrated by us, all because we're caught in the middle of partisan survival politics.
ricksfolly
I'm more chill than ill. But seriously folks... perhaps you can show me where in the US Constitution, or anywhere else, that it states the the United States, or any other country, can only go to war when we are attacked by a country. If congress supports the president or the UN's decision to go to war, or have a police action, then it is legal. End of story. Unless, that is, you have some evidence to the contrary...
Why is murdering one person a crime and murdering thousands of innocent men, women and children in a war heroic?
Why is murdering one person a crime and murdering thousands of innocent men, women and children in a war heroic?
ricksfolly
We can go to war without being attacked by a country, but the decision of Congress and the president isn't enough to make it legal. According to the UN Charter, it either has to be approved by the UN or it has to be in self-defense.
We can go to war without being attacked by a country, but the decision of Congress and the president isn't enough to make it legal. According to the UN Charter, it either has to be approved by the UN or it has to be in self-defense.
**** the UN.
Legal to whom? If Congress declares war, it is legal. The US Constitution makes it legal. Regardless, and going back to the intent of my question... what wars that the USA has been involved in have been "illegal".
The crimes hereinafter set out are punishable as crimes under international law:
(a) Crimes against peace:
(i) Planning, preparation, initiation or waging of a war of aggression or a war in violation of international treaties, agreements or assurances;
(ii) Participation in a common plan or conspiracy for the accomplishment of any of the acts mentioned under (i).
Under Article VI of the Constitution, our treaty agreements are part of the supreme law of the land, like the Constitution itself. Under the UN Charter, we have an agreement not to engage in crimes against peace, which are defined in the Nuremberg Principles:
A war that violates these principles violates not only international law but also American law. This is true regardless of whether Congress approves it.
The Iraq War, for example, was both a war of aggression and a violation of UN Resolution 1441. Resolution 1441 did not authorize the use of force against Iraq without further action by the UN Security Council, and the members who signed it did so only with that understanding. So, the invasion violated our international agreements and assurances as well as the UN Charter and therefore United States law.
Good lord, are you actually serious?
Killing in war isn't murder, for one. Murder is an unlawful killing.
The State maintains a monopoly on the initiation of force, and legally legitimizes the initiation of force in its name for its purposes. Therefore it isn't murder.
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