All these facts, note none have been addressed.
Ah, yes, but not on this page. Color me doubtful that those joining in now will read through all 15 pages so far.
Ah, yes, but not on this page. Color me doubtful that those joining in now will read through all 15 pages so far.
derailing. why can't you discuss this operation that led to the death of 200 people, 2000 guns lost, and 1 border patrolman dead, and how the administration who claims had no knowledge of the incident, is now invoking "Executive privledge"?
I think this thread might profit from a walk down memory lane, specifically, November of 2011.
From the St. Louis Examiner:
In 75 seconds of pointed questioning of Attorney General Holder (see sidebar video), Senator John Cornyn has perhaps left the excuse makers scrambling for something better. In that time, he asked Holder if he knew that Operation Wide Receiver (the Bush-era operation) actually did involve an attempt to track the firearms, while Fast and Furious did not. Cornyn then asked Holder if he knew that Operation Wide Receiver was run in conjunction with the Mexican government--Fast and Furious was kept secret from not only Mexico, but from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) attaché to Mexico, Darren Gil. Gil, in fact, after discovering on his own what was going on, was basically pushed into retirement when he balked at the near act of war of "walking" guns into Mexico without the Mexican government's knowledge or permission.
Under oath, Holder discredits 'Bush did it too' excuse for 'Gunwalker' - St. Louis gun rights | Examiner.com
Right and now that we all agree that it is the GUNS that are the problem maybe we can talk about some meaningful gun control for the U.S. I mean if it wasn't for F&F all those cartels would be using pea shooters instead of AR-15's.
Ahh yes, defend your god king at all costs....
200 people dead, 2000 guns purposefully given to criminals, one border patrol agent dead, and you call it a "fishing expedition".... Kinda pathetic dude.
Right and now that we all agree that it is the GUNS that are the problem maybe we can talk about some meaningful gun control for the U.S. I mean if it wasn't for F&F all those cartels would be using pea shooters instead of AR-15's.
Guns kill people..... not people kill people. I so glad you all have come around.
What total bull ****! I guess if these guns had not been used, the criminals would have just done without, right? I mean, without these particular guns, they would not have had access to any others.
What total bull ****! I guess if these guns had not been used, the criminals would have just done without, right? I mean, without these particular guns, they would not have had access to any others.
If someone borrows my gun and tells me it's for an armed robbery then kills a clerk at the nearest convenience store I'll be sure to use that in court. "But your honor, if he hadn't used MY gun he would have just used another one, so I shouldn't be charged with accessory". You know how well that logic would work in court? Not very.What total bull ****! I guess if these guns had not been used, the criminals would have just done without, right? I mean, without these particular guns, they would not have had access to any others.
If you think that American's won't care about a botched federal program that resulted in the death of a federal officer that is being covered up by this President, you are gravely mistaken. This speaks to Obama's character. Remember, this was going to be the most transparent administration ever. :roll:
It now has the Obama supporter seal of approval, new business model now I guess.So by that argument, I should be able to sell my guns to gang members with criminal records, because they would have had access to guns anyway.... right? :roll:
Not indicated. Most importantly, Bush was not challenged further. Had he been, as Nixon had, then we might have found out.
Point is, your example was irrelevent. No one is questioning that communications between a President, and/or his staff, (or Clinton and his Staff, as with the Bush case you noted) are privileged. They usually are privileged. But internal DoJ documents about the conduct of the DoJ and other agencies are not.
No part of anything said here backs this assertion, but your assertion is one of the reasons people are concerned about this illegal federal action, because it was possibly a ploy to attack people's rights. Ends justify the means I guess, no matter how many innocents die and how many laws get broken, as long as we get gun control right?Right and now that we all agree that it is the GUNS that are the problem
This will hurt Obama in the election, big time. The video in post 95 will be played over and over again and he'll have a tough time explaining his way out of this one. He is covering up for Holder who has already proven to be inept at his job. With his numbers already falling, this might just hand the presidency over to Romney.
derailing. why can't you discuss this operation that led to the death of 200 people, 2000 guns lost, and 1 border patrolman dead, and how the administration who claims had no knowledge of the incident, is now invoking "Executive privledge"?
I don't think it will hurt him much. By the time of the election, the right-wing nuts will be attacking Obama over other irrelevant stuff. This is actually not much of a story at all. I imagine Rush will come up with other Bull **** within a couple of weeks.
So you are OK with this government supplying guns for the cartels to use?
It certainly sounds like you say if they didn't have these guns they would have had others so it is OK.
Wow, they just stepped in it up to their knees! By invoking EP Obama is virtually admitting he had something to do with the operation. I mean, really, the buck stopped at Holder before and it was a reach to get to Obama. But not now. He could very well see articles of impeachment on this one.
That's pretty asinine. The Government illegaly sold guns to criminals. This thread isn;t about hoplophobia either, why is it you all want to talk about everything else other than the topic?
This isn't meaningless BS.
The best thing that could happen to Obama is for Rush to come up with something that is to distract people from this.
Even if(huge if here) Obama had nothing to do with the operation the EP could be construed as obstruction. People forget that the only president to resign.....Nixon.....did so because he knew he was out for obstruction(high crimes and misdemeanors) and it would have been a long, painful process. He became basically a convicted criminal pardoned by Ford for something ill advised was done without even his knowledge. Obama is pulling a Nixon moment here *if* he had no other knowledge of the operation, and worse if he did, unlike Nixon though, people died here.Wow, they just stepped in it up to their knees! By invoking EP Obama is virtually admitting he had something to do with the operation. I mean, really, the buck stopped at Holder before and it was a reach to get to Obama. But not now. He could very well see articles of impeachment on this one.
So by that argument, I should be able to sell my guns to gang members with criminal records, because they would have had access to guns anyway.... right? :roll:
In this case the government provided the guns and allowed them to walk so please tell me how any type of gun control would have affected this situation.
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