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Just checking in on Ukranian democracy…

EMNofSeattle

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I mean no surprise that the Ukranians don’t value democracy given the coup instigated by western powers against an elected president, but now Ukraine has given up the pretense, Herr Zelensky has now banned all political parties he doesn’t like.

No wonder the DNR, LNR and Crimea didn’t want to stick around.

We will see if any of these parliamentarians get the SBU Kirev treatment in the next few days. All hail democracy!

 

phoenix2020

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Did this make your brain excrete chemicals that made you feel pleasure?
 

EMNofSeattle

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Did this make your brain excrete chemicals that made you feel pleasure?
It did not. Sounds like a great case of projection as I’m sure you fully support what Z is doing
 

phoenix2020

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It did not. Sounds like a great case of projection as I’m sure you fully support what Z is doing
I am sad that you need more death and destruction to sate your desires, but hopefully we can get there soon. How many evil Ukrainians do you suppose it will take?
 

EMNofSeattle

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I am sad that you need more death and destruction to sate your desires, but hopefully we can get there soon. How many evil Ukrainians do you suppose it will take?
I don’t want any of them to die. But that’s a decision that’s up to their political leader ship right now. And I guess only up to them, because now their leadership is taking away any possibility they can select different leaders who will actually deal with the Russians.
 

Binary_Digit

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I mean no surprise that the Ukranians don’t value democracy given the coup instigated by western powers against an elected president, but now Ukraine has given up the pretense, Herr Zelensky has now banned all political parties he doesn’t like.

No wonder the DNR, LNR and Crimea didn’t want to stick around.

We will see if any of these parliamentarians get the SBU Kirev treatment in the next few days. All hail democracy!

The guy who wishes America had lost its war of independence pretends to care about democracy. SMH

I guess you forgot, but Ukraine is at war with Russia. Being pro-Russia in Ukraine amounts to being pro-enemy right now.

It's no surprise that you're still parroting the Russian lie that the west instigated a coup, even though you were proven wrong in the other thread and then ran off. Yanukovych went directly against the will of the people and was removed by parliament in a vote of 328 to 0, after massive protests by the people he chose to no longer represent.

It's also no surprise that you chose to ignore all relevant context in order to criticize the actions of a nation under attack, in a war they didn't start, while having nothing to say about the nation who started it all.
 

EMNofSeattle

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The guy who wishes America had lost its war of independence pretends to care about democracy. SMH

I guess you forgot, but Ukraine is at war with Russia. Being pro-Russia in Ukraine amounts to being pro-enemy right now.

It's no surprise that you're still parroting the Russian lie that the west instigated a coup, even though you were proven wrong in the other thread and then ran off. Yanukovych went directly against the will of the people and was removed by parliament in a vote of 328 to 0, after massive protests by the people he chose to no longer represent.

It's also no surprise that you chose to ignore all relevant context in order to criticize the actions of a nation under attack, in a war they didn't start, while having nothing to say about the nation who started it all.
Being attacked or not technically starting the war does not make Ukraine in the right. Nor should it give a supposed democracy the right to remove lawfully elected officials without trial.

I wouldn’t even bring this up if people just directly admitted Ukraine is an authoritarian dictatorial state. But so much of the leftist noise about why the Ukes are so great is because they’re a democracy, which has now removed lawfully elected officials extralegally at least 3 times in the past twenty years, they’re on track to have more coups than Argentina in the next couple decades.

You can try to dress up the clearly western instigated Maidan coup all you want, the fact American official were recorded on the phone planning for it two weeks before it happened says all we need to know,
 

Binary_Digit

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Being attacked or not technically starting the war does not make Ukraine in the right.
A state of war makes some things necessary. Ukraine also declared martial law, curfews, and won't let men of fighting age leave the country. I'd expect the US to do the same thing under the same circumstances.

Nor should it give a supposed democracy the right to remove lawfully elected officials without trial.
No trial is needed when the guy wasn't charged with a crime. He abandoned his post and was deemed unfit to serve by a unanimous vote in parliament. He campaigned and won the election on a promise to sign a trade deal with the EU, but then decided against his promises and got thrown out on his ass for it. That's what a democracy is supposed to do.

I wouldn’t even bring this up if people just directly admitted Ukraine is an authoritarian dictatorial state.
You won't prove that with examples of what they're doing during a state of war.

But so much of the leftist noise about why the Ukes are so great is because they’re a democracy, which has now removed lawfully elected officials extralegally at least 3 times in the past twenty years, they’re on track to have more coups than Argentina in the next couple decades.
They're not perfect, but they're clearly the victim in this war, and the citizens at large clearly don't want their system of government to be overthrown by Russia.

You can try to dress up the clearly western instigated Maidan coup all you want, the fact American official were recorded on the phone planning for it two weeks before it happened says all we need to know,
Two weeks lol. The overthrow had been building for at least 3 months. The US helped in the end, but we didn't start it. Not even close. If anything, we negated Russia's meddling when they paid mercenaries to stir shit up in Donbas so the Ukrainian authorities could be blamed for the response.
 

Airyaman

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I mean no surprise that the Ukranians don’t value democracy given the coup instigated by western powers against an elected president, but now Ukraine has given up the pretense, Herr Zelensky has now banned all political parties he doesn’t like.

No wonder the DNR, LNR and Crimea didn’t want to stick around.

We will see if any of these parliamentarians get the SBU Kirev treatment in the next few days. All hail democracy!

The Ukrainian Ministry of Justice would act immediately to enforce the ban, which Mr Zelensky said would last for as long as martial law remains in place
 

EMNofSeattle

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A state of war makes some things necessary. Ukraine also declared martial law, curfews, and won't let men of fighting age leave the country. I'd expect the US to do the same thing under the same circumstances.
Well I mean if you take the position a state of war justifies anything without limits then the Nuremberg trials must really offend you.
No trial is needed when the guy wasn't charged with a crime. He abandoned his post and was deemed unfit to serve by a unanimous vote in parliament. He campaigned and won the election on a promise to sign a trade deal with the EU, but then decided against his promises and got thrown out on his ass for it. That's what a democracy is supposed to do.
Or if you happen to be an elected parliamentarian who’s party already pledged loyalty to Zelensky.

The Maidan coup was not an organic protest, it was opposed by the majority of Ukranians at the time. It’s really funny because your logic would justify if a Maidan style event demanding the immediate return of Donald Trump occurred in Washington. No need for an official election. The people who attend events where we give away free food and money to people are the only legitimate Demos that we need.
You won't prove that with examples of what they're doing during a state of war.
I think ejecting lawfully elected MPs who have already pledged loyalty to Kiev without proof of a crime is a pretty good sign of dictatorship, war or not.
They're not perfect, but they're clearly the victim in this war, and the citizens at large clearly don't want their system of government to be overthrown by Russ
What they want now hardly matterS, it’s fully out of their hands.
 

EMNofSeattle

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Which as we know from the “two weeks to stop the spread” lie, can last as long as Zelensky wants. He’s drunk with the power and he won’t give it up peacefully
 

Binary_Digit

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Well I mean if you take the position a state of war justifies anything without limits then the Nuremberg trials must really offend you.
Reductio ad absurdum. I said some things, not anything.

The Maidan coup was not an organic protest, it was opposed by the majority of Ukranians at the time.
Poll Reveals Ukrainian Majority Supports EuroMaidan

It’s really funny because your logic would justify if a Maidan style event demanding the immediate return of Donald Trump occurred in Washington. No need for an official election.
If enough people are stupid enough to think that's best for the country, then they're welcome to try (again) but they better be ready for the consequences of either outcome.

I think ejecting lawfully elected MPs who have already pledged loyalty to Kiev without proof of a crime is a pretty good sign of dictatorship, war or not.
Could be, or it could be that they rid themselves of pro-Russia traitors in the government.

What they want now hardly matterS, it’s fully out of their hands.
Are you under the delusion that Russia will win this war?
 

snakestretcher

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I don’t want any of them to die. But that’s a decision that’s up to their political leader ship right now. And I guess only up to them, because now their leadership is taking away any possibility they can select different leaders who will actually deal with the Russians.
And how do you propose any other leader would "actually deal with the Russians", and in what way? What is supremely ironic is that you, an admitted admirer of totalitarian dictators, would be whining about an alleged lack of democracy! Why is Zelensky's ban any different from when the UK banned Oswald Mosely's Nazi-supporting British Union of Fascists in 1940?
 
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multivita-man

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I mean no surprise that the Ukranians don’t value democracy given the coup instigated by western powers against an elected president, but now Ukraine has given up the pretense, Herr Zelensky has now banned all political parties he doesn’t like.

No, he's just banning treason.
 

Airyaman

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Which as we know from the “two weeks to stop the spread” lie, can last as long as Zelensky wants. He’s drunk with the power and he won’t give it up peacefully
I just checked, Russia is still at war with Ukraine. Seems if you want to see martial law ended in Ukraine, you should ask your leader Putin to put an end to the invasion.
 

EMNofSeattle

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Rogue Valley

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Viktor Medvedchuk was arraigned BEFORE the invasion for conspiracy against Ukraine.


iu


Putin, Medvedchuk, and Lukashenka. All are enemies of democracy and freedom.
 

CaughtInThe

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does everyone now understand who the OP is?

you should never trust him on anything.
 
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