Judge Hannah Dugan arrested by FBI for allegedly helping undocumented immigrant 'evade arrest' (1 Viewer)

[cpwill]

Fascist is the correct descriptor and it is markedly different from any other American administration.

Okay, but, this is sworn testimony from multiple officers of that court, including the judge's own courtroom deputy. This isn't a statement by ICE. Sure, maybe those folks did all lie, but, I don't see any particular reason why we would assume they did so.

Refusing to accept evidence that contradicts their preferred narrative is a big part of how MAGA got to some of the darker - dumber - places that they have I would regret seeing the Left follow suit. Not everything is a simplified morality play in which My Team Gets To Be The Perfectly Good Good-Guys while Their Team Is Always The Perfectly Evil Bad-Guys.

 

[Hello My Son]

Okay, but, this is sworn testimony from multiple officers of that court, including the judge's own courtroom deputy. This isn't a statement by ICE. Sure, maybe those folks did all lie, but, I don't see any particular reason why we would assume they did so.

Refusing to accept evidence that contradicts their preferred narrative is a big part of how MAGA got to some of the darker - dumber - places that they have I would regret seeing the Left follow suit. Not everything is a simplified morality play in which My Team Gets To Be The Perfectly Good Good-Guys while Their Team Is Always The Perfectly Evil Bad-Guys.

But don't you understand? They're all fascists. That's what we've repeatedly been told by a great many people on the left.

 

[Slartibartfast]

You need me to explain why people actually notice when others engage in attention-seeking behavior?

No, I know a lot of the MAGA folks here revel in it.

 

[cpwill]

But don't you understand? They're all fascists. That's what we've repeatedly been told by a great many people on the left.

The Trump administration is marrying Nationalism with Left Wing Corporatist Economics in an authoritarian manner - it's not wrong to identify the Trump Movement as heavily overlapping with with Fascism.

However, in this case, that does not mean that the non-administration personnel did not say what they said in sworn testimony.

 

[Slartibartfast]

Okay, but, this is sworn testimony from multiple officers of that court, including the judge's own courtroom deputy. This isn't a statement by ICE. Sure, maybe those folks did all lie, but, I don't see any particular reason why we would assume they did so.

Refusing to accept evidence that contradicts their preferred narrative is a big part of how MAGA got to some of the darker - dumber - places that they have I would regret seeing the Left follow suit. Not everything is a simplified morality play in which My Team Gets To Be The Perfectly Good Good-Guys while Their Team Is Always The Perfectly Evil Bad-Guys.

I will wait and see. If this isn't immediately dismissed, then that will be worth looking at.

 

[Hello My Son]

The Trump administration is marrying Nationalism with Left Wing Corporatist Economics in an authoritarian manner - it's not wrong to identify the Trump Movement as heavily overlapping with with Fascism.

However, in this case, that does not mean that the non-administration personnel did not say what they said in sworn testimony.

I was talking about the witnesses in the sworn affidavit. They're all fascists. The whole system is nothing but fascists and the courts can no longer be trusted to serve their purpose effectively.

 

[cpwill]

I will wait and see. If this isn't immediately dismissed, then that will be worth looking at.

Sure - we'll see how it plays out in a court. I'm just... instinctively suspicious of any story that seems to fit too neatly into a single tribe's "narrative", especially when outside data seems to complicate it (as in this case).

It is possible both for this Judge to have broken the law and for the Trump administration's abuse of Due Process in its' zeal to deport people to be wrong. In this case, that seems to be where the best available evidence currently points. It's fine to maintain openness to new information coming out - it's sticking with defending a position that is contrary to current evidence on the hope that future evidence will validate one's position that becomes problematic :-/.

 

[Hello My Son]

I will wait and see. If this isn't immediately dismissed, then that will be worth looking at.

You didn't previously look at the totality of evidence against Dugan before forming conclusions and making assertions? And even after you're educated on the fact that even her own courtroom officers provided sworn affidavits that support her arrest, you STILL won't look at the evidence?

This has to be parody.

 

[cpwill]

I was talking about the witnesses in the sworn affidavit. They're all fascists. The whole system is nothing but fascists and the courts can no longer be trusted to serve their purpose effectively.

I dunno. That sounds like the kind of thing a fascist might claim.....

 

[Hello My Son]

I dunno. That sounds like the kind of thing a fascist might claim.....

Welcome to your introduction of "horseshoe theory." Be mindful of who you're aligning yourself with on the far-left as well as the far-right.

 

[Slartibartfast]

You didn't previously look at the totality of evidence against Dugan before forming conclusions and making assertions? And even after you're educated on the fact that even her own courtroom officers provided sworn affidavits that support her arrest, you STILL won't look at the evidence?

This has to be parody.

I will wait and see how this plays out. Until then, your social commentary means very little.

 

[medi]

State law isn’t applicable as this is federal and the detention was civil in nature, not criminal.

Would you please be courteous and provide a link to the criminal/law code that supports the claim you have made in the post quoted above. Thank you.

 

[ClaraD]

I agree. A courtroom is not a hallway. Although I'm not sure how it's relevant.

it is relevant because that is where he was when this occurred

 

[ClaraD]

She was arrested for interfering with the arrest and harboring a fugitive.

how was she harboring him?

 

[ClaraD]

Would you please be courteous and provide a link to the criminal/law code that supports the claim you have made in the post quoted above. Thank you.

immigration law is exclusively federal law...the Constitution is your resource.

 

[dcsports]

it is relevant because that is where he was when this occurred

ok. Sure, a courtroom is not a hallway. And in this case, neither are private property, so it doesn't matter.

how was she harboring him?

We've been through it. Read the charging document.

 

[ClaraD]

Gee, how did he get there?

by leaving the court room...as long as he was in the courtroom they cannot exercise the administrative warrant...once he leaves, it is up to immigration to deal with arresting him in a public place...she isn't at any point obligated to help them. I would bet the farm that she knows more about the law than Pam Bondi.

 

[ClaraD]

ok. Sure, a courtroom is not a hallway. And in this case, neither are private property, so it doesn't matter.

We've been through it. Read the charging document.

Who has exclusive authority over a court room and what occurs in it? The judge right? Its not a public place.

 

[ClaraD]

ok. Sure, a courtroom is not a hallway. And in this case, neither are private property, so it doesn't matter.

We've been through it. Read the charging document.

I asked the person I responded to HOW...I don't care what the charging document says which is essentially just a list of charges...

 

[dcsports]

by leaving the court room...as long as he was in the courtroom they cannot exercise the administrative warrant...once he leaves, it is up to immigration to deal with arresting him in a public place...she isn't at any point obligated to help them. I would bet the farm that she knows more about the law than Pam Bondi.

Who has exclusive authority over a court room and what occurs in it? The judge right? Its not a public place.

Actually, the courtroom is a public space, There is no expectation of privacy there. But again, that was not an issue. The federal officers were working with the courthouse staff. The former judge may not have liked the type of warrant, but it was not relevant here.

Again (repeated many times for you) - no one was asking for anything from the judge. They didn't ask for her cooperation or compliance. It wasn't her case or jurisdiction.

She's in trouble for helping the subject evade a lawful arrest. As someone else pointed out, she may have put herself in a worse position through her behavior. By confronting the officers and causing a scene, she can't claim she didn't know who the officers were or why they were there. She removed any plausible deniability.

 

[dcsports]

I asked the person I responded to HOW...I don't care what the charging document says which is essentially just a list of charges...

That statement just confirms you haven't read it. The charging document gives the charges, as well as the probable cause statement - a detailed statement of the events and information obtained from witnesses to support the offenses charged.

 

[Bodecea]

But don't you understand? They're all fascists. That's what we've repeatedly been told by a great many people on the left.

Acknowledgement is a good step forward.

 

[Hello My Son]

Acknowledgement is a good step forward.

Yes, calling tens of millions of Americans "fascists" is definitely a great idea that has gotten you very far.

Keep it up! It's going so well!

 

[Hello My Son]

I asked the person I responded to HOW...I don't care what the charging document says which is essentially just a list of charges...

"just a list of charges" ...... and, you know, that thing called EVIDENCE against the accused.

It might come in just a wee bit handy for you to know such details before making completely ignorant posts on the topic...

 

[Hello My Son]

Would you please be courteous and provide a link to the criminal/law code that supports the claim you have made in the post quoted above. Thank you.

She won't, because she literally is making things up and posting it as if it's factual. That's basically what she's done in every post in this entire thread.

She's already admitted that she's refusing to even read the list of evidence against the judge because apparently there is no need to review the literal details of the case, witness statements, and basic matters of fact before formulating conclusions on what happened.