By Verna Gates, Reuters
BIRMINGHAM, Ala. — A federal judge on Tuesday delayed until next year the enforcement of Alabama's new abortion law, which tightens restrictions on providers and, according to opponents, could force the closing of more than half of the state's abortion clinics.
The law, signed by Republican Gov. Robert Bentley in April, requires every doctor who performs an abortion at a clinic to have staff privileges at a local hospital and mandates the clinics meet the same facility standards as ambulatory care centers.
The law was set to go into effect Aug. 15.
If a state can determine the credentials necessary for a doctor to perform any type of operation or procedure, and a state can determine the types of facilities and certified staffing levels at a hospital in that state, why can't a state determine that one of the criteria for a doctor operating at an abortion clinic is also to have accreditation at a local hospital and that the abortion clinic have strong facility standards?
As a patient, I may have the right to have a particular treatment but that doesn't mean that just anyone and anywhere can offer and perform that treatment. Why do those who favor abortion want to have second rate, second class doctors and facilities? Some appear to be just one step above that back alley you so like to refer to.
For several reasons John. The first is that it is not "free" for a doctor to acquire "visiting rights" at a local hospital, hospitals charge a fee (monthly, annually, w/e). This costs the doctors and would increase prices for patients to offset the costs. In the second place, doctor's who perform abortions are usually already trained and accredited to do that type of medical procedure. The very few that aren't should be and that is something I would support.
The second question is why do you think abortion clinics don't have acceptable standards? States already do health inspections of all off-site medical facilities and only those which pass are allowed to continue to offer medical services.
The law is simply an attempt to make abortions as difficult to obtain as possible. They are not concerned about the welfare of the mother so much as preventing her access to abortion options.
Perhaps so, but to me that's just an emotional response rather than a reasoned one. If a family practice physician pays the fees necessary for "visiting rights" to a local hospital, why can't an abortion doctor do the same? If a family practice physician does it so they can visit their patients in the local hospital why shouldn't an abortion doctor have to do the same? I'm sure not all abortions go without complications and some women get hospitalized after - why shouldn't the abortion doctor have to follow-up at the hospital the way a family doctor does?
Secondly, I didn't say the abortion clinics' facilities were currently substandard, but what's wrong with improving those standards going forward? The government here does it all the time, rewriting and reviewing health care delivery standards for all kinds of facilities.
I don't know the details of abortion clinics in Alabama, but perhaps they do have issues with low standards and substandard care. There may be an emotional component related to "restricting" abortion but there could just as easily be a hard-headed component of making sure the citizens of Alabama aren't subjected to some of the abortion clinic horror stories that are happening in other states, such as Pennsylvannia recently.
Perhaps so, but to me that's just an emotional response rather than a reasoned one. If a family practice physician pays the fees necessary for "visiting rights" to a local hospital, why can't an abortion doctor do the same? If a family practice physician does it so they can visit their patients in the local hospital why shouldn't an abortion doctor have to do the same? I'm sure not all abortions go without complications and some women get hospitalized after - why shouldn't the abortion doctor have to follow-up at the hospital the way a family doctor does?...
Most Alabama clinics hire out-of-town physicians to perform abortions and partner with local doctors who have hospital admitting privileges to provide follow-up care.
Doctors at the clinics are often unable to obtain staff privileges because local hospitals oppose abortion or they live too far from the area, the lawsuit said.
The law "would unconstitutionally restrict the ability of Alabama women, including victims of rape and incest, to access safe and legal abortions,"
Perhaps so, but to me that's just an emotional response rather than a reasoned one. If a family practice physician pays the fees necessary for "visiting rights" to a local hospital, why can't an abortion doctor do the same? If a family practice physician does it so they can visit their patients in the local hospital why shouldn't an abortion doctor have to do the same? I'm sure not all abortions go without complications and some women get hospitalized after - why shouldn't the abortion doctor have to follow-up at the hospital the way a family doctor does?
Secondly, I didn't say the abortion clinics' facilities were currently substandard, but what's wrong with improving those standards going forward? The government here does it all the time, rewriting and reviewing health care delivery standards for all kinds of facilities.
I don't know the details of abortion clinics in Alabama, but perhaps they do have issues with low standards and substandard care. There may be an emotional component related to "restricting" abortion but there could just as easily be a hard-headed component of making sure the citizens of Alabama aren't subjected to some of the abortion clinic horror stories that are happening in other states, such as Pennsylvannia recently.
Actually the law requires the doctors to have "admitting privileges' to the local hospital but most of the abortion doctors are out of town physicians who partner with local doctors who have hospital admitting privileges.
Judge delays enforcement of Alabama abortion law until 2014 - U.S. News
"Out of town physicans" and "Travelling doctors"? That tells me a lot about the state of the segment of the profession that specializes in abortions.
Well, there is only one abortion clinic in all of Alabama.
As I have stated before abortions later than 13 weeks need specially trained abortion doctors.
Since so few abortions take place after 13 weeks some doctors fly in for those patients.
During 2009 in Alabama the percent of abortions ,weekly gestation was :
Under 8 weeks 60.4 %
9-13 weeks 30.7%
14-15 weeks 3.9%
16-17 weeks 2.6%
18-20 weeks 2.3 %
21 weeks or more 0.1 percent
Alabama Abortion Facts | Abort73.com
Gee, if every law covered 91% of the likely outcomes that would be considered a great success. Of the other 9%, how many would be what I'll call "lifestyle" choice abortions and not medically necessary abortions? In addition, if the "lesser" trained abortionists are performing 91% of the abortions in the state now, why can't a few of them or all of them get the advanced training necessary to perform the rest of the abortions?
Seems pretty odd to me that you'd want a state to have it's laws struck down to accomodate a very few situations and some out of state doctors. ...
Gee, if every law covered 91% of the likely outcomes that would be considered a great success. Of the other 9%, how many would be what I'll call "lifestyle" choice abortions and not medically necessary abortions? In addition, if the "lesser" trained abortionists are performing 91% of the abortions in the state now, why can't a few of them or all of them get the advanced training necessary to perform the rest of the abortions?
Seems pretty odd to me that you'd want a state to have it's laws struck down to accomodate a very few situations and some out of state doctors. But then, liberals are all for grand laws that affect everyone to address small problems. Must have everyone conform to the prime directive.
In 2008 there were only 5 doctors ho performed abortions after viabilty in the USA.
These were the extreme cases , the cases where the woman's life or irreparable damage to a major bodilily function would take place, or where the fetus would be be stillborn or would only live a few minutes or hours.
Kansas was one of a small handful of states that allowed abortions after viability in these extreme cases.
Dr Tiller was one of those late term doctors.
Doctors from all over the USA old send their patients with these problem pregnancies to DR. tiller.
Kansas keep a record of all abortions at or after 22 weeks gestation.
There were 321 abortions at or after 22 weeks gestation in Kansas in 2008.
192 were not viaible. The fetus had died in the womb but did not expell, would be stillborn or would only live a few hours or minutes.
The other 132 were because irreparable damage to a major bodilily function would take place if the pregnancy continued.
These cases are rare but they are life threatening.
Some genetic / fetal admormalies may be caught as early as 13 weeks gestion but most are not found until 18 to 20 weeks.
Many abnormalities show up during the 18 week gestation ultrasound. They measure the spaces along the spine, for some defects like spina bifitia and Down syndrome. Also an 18 week gestation ultrasound can determine heart problems , brain problems,and other problems such as organs that growing on the outside of the abdomen. If the ultrasound is abnormal more tests such as an amino fluid sample to take a closer genetic look at cells may be taken.
In the USA abortions are allowed up to between 22 and 24 weeks gestation for these fetal abnormalies.
Abortions after 24 weeks gestation are allowed for the extreme cases where the womans life or irreparble damage to a major bodily function will take place or where the fetus will not be viaible. It will be stillborn or would only live a few minutes or hours.
There are only four abortion doctors who perform legal abortions after viability in the USA.
The later the pregnancy the much higher the risk for the woman which is why her life or irreparable damage to a major bodilily function , or a non viaible fetus which risks the woman's life because of a high chance of infection are the extreme cases these doctors perform abortions.
Some genetic / fetal admormalies may be caught as early as 13 weeks gestion but most are not found until 18 to 20 weeks.
Many abnormalities show up during the 18 week gestation ultrasound. They measure the spaces along the spine, for some defects like spina bifitia and Down syndrome. Also an 18 week gestation ultrasound can determine heart problems , brain problems,and other problems such as organs that growing on the outside of the abdomen. If the ultrasound is abnormal more tests such as an amino fluid sample to take a closer genetic look at cells may be taken.
In the USA abortions are allowed up to between 22 and 24 weeks gestation for these fetal abnormalies.
Abortions after 24 weeks gestation are allowed for the extreme cases where the womans life or irreparble damage to a major bodily function will take place or where the fetus will not be viaible. It will be stillborn or would only live a few minutes or hours.
There are only four abortion doctors who perform legal abortions after viability in the USA.
The later the pregnancy the much higher the risk for the woman which is why her life or irreparable damage to a major bodilily function , or a non viaible fetus which risks the woman's life because of a high chance of infection are the extreme cases these doctors perform abortions.
In 2008 there were only 5 doctors ho performed abortions after viabilty in the USA.
These were the extreme cases , the cases where the woman's life or irreparable damage to a major bodilily function would take place, or where the fetus would be be stillborn or would only live a few minutes or hours.
Kansas was one of a small handful of states that allowed abortions after viability in these extreme cases.
Dr Tiller was one of those late term doctors.
Doctors from all over the USA old send their patients with these problem pregnancies to DR. tiller.
Kansas keep a record of all abortions at or after 22 weeks gestation.
There were 321 abortions at or after 22 weeks gestation in Kansas in 2008.
192 were not viaible. The fetus had died in the womb but did not expell, would be stillborn or would only live a few hours or minutes.
The other 132 were because irreparable damage to a major bodilily function would take place if the pregnancy continued.
These cases are rare but they are life threatening.
Only God knows how many viable, healthy babies Tiller aborted. ....
You anti choicers are the ones wanting more laws. I, as a conservative, want the govt. OUT of the issue altogether.
Greetings, Minnie. :2wave:
Thanks for your excellent post. I certainly learned things I didn't know. :thumbs:
I'm not anti-choice, any more so than you would be considered pro-abortion. Denigrading people by calling names simply because you disagree with their views provides no light on the subject. In fact, I agree with your last comment, that the government should be out of the issue altogether.
You anti choicers are the ones wanting more laws.
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