Is the purpose of the electoral college to thwart the will of the people? When the majority of voters select one person and the E.C. another... (1 Viewer)

[MamboDervish]

No but it is designed to stop the tyranny of the majority. Which remains the reason I am on the fence about ditching it. For ex, what if a Christian majority started going after gay men and women? Ending SSM, allowing job discrimination and not allowing them to be teachers or otherwise involved with children? (This is some of the garbage from the fundie Christians.)

I have never suggested ditching it - and I doubt that under our current system, it could never be done. It'll never get past congress. Why on earth would the Senators and Congressmen from the grossly over-represented States ever vote for doing away with it?

 

[MamboDervish]

Ok, so amend it, until then….

Indeed. My sentiments exactly.

 

[bongsaway]

Nope. That's exactly how the Founders designed it - to prevent mob rule, aka tyranny of the majority.

That makes a lot of sense, of course the majority should not be in charge, the minority should be the ones making all the rules until they become the majority. Tell us, why should the minority dictate to the majority in your world?

 

[Bullseye]

That makes a lot of sense, of course the majority should not be in charge, the minority should be the ones making all the rules until they become the majority. Tell us, why should the minority dictate to the majority in your world?

The Electoral College is one SMALL bump in the road. All state elective offices are pure majority rule. All Senators and Representatives elections are majority rule as are most state, city, etc elections. Move to Venezuela if you want majority rule top to bottom.

 

[Integrityrespec]

And that person has received less votes and yet 'wins' the election, isn't that thwarting the will of the people?

The purpose is to protect the process and ensure that every state's votes figure in the election. Without the EC half of the nation would have no real voice in determining who the President would be. Of course the reason originally was as much because the founding fathers didn't think the American people were capable of getting it right. Nice way of saying not smart enough.

 

[Sandy Shanks]

The Constitution has provided Harris with a serious disadvantage ... the Electoral College.

The Electoral College strongly favors the "red states," which are largely rural with small populations.

California has 39m people and has 55 electors.

Montana has 1.1m people and has 3 electors.

In California each elector represents 709 people.

In Montana each elector represents 367 people.

It's how Trump won the 2016 election while losing the popular vote.

The President is the only elected official, local, state, or federal, not directly chosen by the American people!

 

[eman623]

The EC, like the Senate, only far less so, is an anti-democratic structure we have to live with. It’s a relic of the time when the leaders didn’t trust the (poorer) people to make decisions.

That is not the reason it exists.

 

[Linuxcooldude]

That makes a lot of sense, of course the majority should not be in charge, the minority should be the ones making all the rules until they become the majority. Tell us, why should the minority dictate to the majority in your world?

Checks and balances on our election system.

 

[Linuxcooldude]

The Electoral College is one SMALL bump in the road. All state elective offices are pure majority rule. All Senators and Representatives elections are majority rule as are most state, city, etc elections. Move to Venezuela if you want majority rule top to bottom.

Actually Russia and North Korea comes to mind.

 

[Bullseye]

Actually Russia and North Korea comes to mind.

I can't address the absurd turns and twists in your mind. I can only talk to the discussions and essays the founding fathers followed.
If I were you I'd file a suit against my school districts for poor performance

 

[eman623]

The Constitution has provided Harris with a serious disadvantage ... the Electoral College.

The Electoral College strongly favors the "red states," which are largely rural with small populations.

This is not true. Of the 11 states plus DC, with the lowest population per Elector, 5 of them are red (WY, AK, SD, ND, MT) and 7 of them are blue (VT, DC, DE, RI, ME, NH, HI)

Not sure why the chart is not orderly, but the median state looks like Oregon or Kentucky). Of the 25 states with less than the median, about 15 are red and 10 are blue. An imbalance to be sure, not sure if I'd call that a "serious" disadvantage, or "strongly" favoring the red states.

United States Electoral College - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Linuxcooldude]

I can't address the absurd turns and twists in your mind. I can only talk to the discussions and essays the founding fathers followed.
If I were you I'd file a suit against my school districts for poor performance

No, response to this comment…”Move to Venezuela if you want majority rule top to bottom”

 

[Pyrite]

Nope. That's exactly how the Founders designed it - to prevent mob rule, aka tyranny of the majority.

Ironic, isn't it....

trump tried to get his mob to overturn the election....itself an attempt at "tyranny of the minority".

 

[noonereal]

And that person has received less votes and yet 'wins' the election, isn't that thwarting the will of the people?

Of course it is.

It should be illegal.

 

[Lursa]

I have never suggested ditching it - and I doubt that under our current system, it could never be done. It'll never get past congress. Why on earth would the Senators and Congressmen from the grossly over-represented States ever vote for doing away with it?

I meant it as a general response to the OP.

 

[noonereal]

No, response to this comment…”Move to Venezuela if you want majority rule top to bottom”

Nah, i like that 7 states decide who will rule the other 43 regardless of population or vote. This makes great sense.

 

[Bullseye]

Ironic, isn't it....

trump tried to get his mob to overturn the election....itself an attempt at "tyranny of the minority".

Tragic is what it is, that the lunacy of "Trump did that" still survives. What part of "protest PEACEFULLY and PATRIOTLY". confuses you?

 

[Nickyjo]

That is not the reason it exists.

Why then?

 

[Pyrite]

Ironic, isn't it....

trump tried to get his mob to overturn the election....itself an attempt at "tyranny of the minority".

Tragic is what it is, that the lunacy of "Trump did that" still survives. What part of "protest PEACEFULLY and PATRIOTLY". confuses you?

The tragedy is that Americans still support trump, the loser who betrayed ALL of us on Jan 6, when he sent his thugs to try to overturn the election and install him as the incoming POTUS.

"Fight like hell" to stop the steal trumps your words.

So does trump's weeks of lying his obese ass off about the election results.

As does trump's hours'-long refusal to send help to the Capitol.

 

[Sandy Shanks]

This is not true. Of the 11 states plus DC, with the lowest population per Elector, 5 of them are red (WY, AK, SD, ND, MT) and 7 of them are blue (VT, DC, DE, RI, ME, NH, HI)

Not sure why the chart is not orderly, but the median state looks like Oregon or Kentucky). Of the 25 states with less than the median, about 15 are red and 10 are blue. An imbalance to be sure, not sure if I'd call that a "serious" disadvantage, or "strongly" favoring the red states.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Elec/ctoral_College#Apportionment

I said "largely rural." It would not be accurate to declare D.C. and New England states as rural. They are not farming states.

The fact remains Trump won in 2016 because of his support in rural states with small populations. The southern rural states are Trump country.

 

[Bullseye]

The tragedy is that Americans still support trump, the loser who betrayed ALL of us on Jan 6, when he sent his thugs to try to overturn the election and install him as the incoming POTUS.

"Fight like hell" to stop the steal trumps your words.

So does trump's weeks of lying his obese ass off about the election results.

As does trump's hours'-long refusal to send help to the Capitol.

Total

 

[Sandy Shanks]

The fact remains Trump won in 2016 because of his support in rural states with small populations. The southern rural states are Trump country.

There is another factor.

Trump is proving himself to be dysfunctional, foolish, and incompetent. He is so embarrassing his own followers avoid him. By any measure, Harris should be winning this election easily. She is not, and there is a reason for that.

“Great presidents?” Trump said. “Lincoln was probably a great president, although I’ve always said, why wasn’t that settled? You know, I’m a guy that—it doesn’t make sense we had a Civil War…. You’d almost say, like, why wasn’t that [settled]? As an example, Ukraine would have never happened, and Russia, if I were president. Israel would have never happened; October 7 would have never happened, as you know.”

This was Trump's reply to a ten-year old.

A voter named Ramiro González raised concerns about Trump’s inaction on Jan. 6. Trump responded, “Some of those people went down to the Capitol peacefully and patriotically. Nothing done wrong at all. Nothing done wrong. Action was taken. Strong action. Ashli Babbitt was killed,” he said, referring to one individual who was killed after entering the Capitol. “Nobody was killed. There were no guns down there. We didn’t have guns. The others had guns, but we didn’t have guns. … But that was a day of love.”

On Jan. 6, 2021, within thirty-six hours six people died: one was shot by Capitol Police, another died of a drug overdose, three died of natural causes, and a police officer died after being assaulted by rioters. Many people were injured, including 174 police officers.

Asked if there had been phone calls between he an Putin after he left office, Trump said, “I don’t comment on that, But I will tell you that if I did, it’s a smart thing. If I’m friendly with people, if I can have a relationship with people, that’s a good thing and not a bad thing in terms of a country.”
“They’re eating the dogs. They’re eating the cats. They’re eating the pets of the people that live there,” Trump.

"Former President Donald J. Trump declared himself the “father of I.V.F.” at a town-hall event Tuesday focused on women’s issues," Times.

There is much more. This is just in the last ten days.

“The polls — public and private — are closer in this election than any I have ever seen,” said Dan Pfeiffer, a former aide to Barack Obama. “Everything is within the margin of error.

So, why is it a dysfunctional Republican candidate for President isn't losing handily?

Because Harris is a black woman.

In 2016, a highly experienced woman -- First Lady for eight years, New York Senator, secretary of state -- ran against the incompetent, inexperienced Trump. Hillary Clinton lost, too.

 

[Nickyjo]

Nope. They distrusted mob rule destroying the nation. "democracy" in not mentioned in the founding documents on purpose.

Right, can’t have silly females and inferior non-property owners voting. And strange, we resisted “democracy” so much that we designed so many of our public buildings to look like those of Greece, which society had nothing to do with democracy. Oh for the great days when business-dominated state legislatures chose our Senators, not the silly voters.

 

[Nickyjo]

Tragic is what it is, that the lunacy of "Trump did that" still survives. What part of "protest PEACEFULLY and PATRIOTLY". confuses you?

What part of you will “lose your country” if you don’t act, of calling violent offenders “hostages,” of putting Pence’s life in danger confuses you?

 

[Bullseye]

Right, can’t have silly females and inferior non-property owners voting. And strange, we resisted “democracy” so much that we designed so many of our public buildings to look like those of Greece, which society had nothing to do with democracy. Oh for the great days when business-dominated state legislatures chose our Senators, not the silly voters.

Sorry, I flushed this verbal turd after reading the first sentence.