Is it Un-American to work under the table?

ptsdkid · Dec 17, 2006

I believe its un-American to have hard working people taxed by the government at such an outlandish rate. So any time you can seek tax relief by moonlighting under the table--should be truly an all-American experience and natural right.

stildizzy · Dec 17, 2006

I wrote checks for $9700, for Federal, and $2900 for State income taxes last year. I would hose the bastards if I could.

CoffeeSaint · Dec 17, 2006

ptsdkid said:
I believe its un-American to have hard working people taxed by the government at such an outlandish rate. So any time you can seek tax relief by moonlighting under the table--should be truly an all-American experience and natural right.

I'd say it's the definition of un-American. I have been told many times that to be an American, you have to participate, you have to follow the laws, you have to assimilate.

By not paying taxes, you are not participating in the collective efforts.
By working "under the table" you are breaking the law.
By acting as if this is your right, you are not assimilating: you are not doing what everyone else does, you are denying the rightness of the commonly-held belief that taxes are a necessary evil.

You are un-American, sir. And a thief, and a liar.

Skip · Dec 17, 2006

I agree 100% with CoffeeSaint. Don't like our taxes? Leave our country.

Love it or leave it.

jamesrage · Dec 17, 2006

ptsdkid said:
I believe its un-American to have hard working people taxed by the government at such an outlandish rate. So any time you can seek tax relief by moonlighting under the table--should be truly an all-American experience and natural right.

I would have to no it is not un-American to work under the table.It all depends what the reason is for when paying someone under the table.If it to hire illegals then yes it is anti-American,if it is hire the neighbor's kid to mow your lawn no it is not anti-American.

CoffeeSaint · Dec 17, 2006

jamesrage said:
I would have to no it is not un-American to work under the table.It all depends what the reason is for when paying someone under the table.If it to hire illegals then yes it is anti-American,if it is hire the neighbor's kid to mow your lawn no it is not anti-American.

I don't really think it depends on the reason, I think it depends on the scale.
Kids being paid to mow lawns are not expected to pay taxes on their income. But adults who are not dependents, and who make over $400 a year, need to pay taxes.

The Real McCoy · Dec 17, 2006

CoffeeSaint said:
You are un-American, sir. And a thief, and a liar.

A thief?

So let me get this straight: you believe all money inherently belongs to the government?

talloulou · Dec 17, 2006

jamesrage said:
I would have to no it is not un-American to work under the table.It all depends what the reason is for when paying someone under the table.If it to hire illegals then yes it is anti-American,if it is hire the neighbor's kid to mow your lawn no it is not anti-American.

Many of the jobs that pay under the table are low paying jobs where the employer provides no insurance, benefits, ect.... If a college kid is being paid under the table to work a bit part time over christmas break I don't think it's such a big deal. However if an illegal alien, deadbeat parent, criminal, ect is seeking jobs where they are paid under the table long term I have a real problem with that. Many men who work under the table do so in order to avoid having money taken from their checks and given to those they owe. So if an employer is employing some guy under the table so the guy can avoid paying child support then they're both pieces of shite in my opinion.

ptsdkid · Dec 17, 2006

CoffeeSaint said:
I'd say it's the definition of un-American. I have been told many times that to be an American, you have to participate, you have to follow the laws, you have to assimilate.

By not paying taxes, you are not participating in the collective efforts.
By working "under the table" you are breaking the law.
By acting as if this is your right, you are not assimilating: you are not doing what everyone else does, you are denying the rightness of the commonly-held belief that taxes are a necessary evil.

You are un-American, sir. And a thief, and a liar.

***The point here is that most people do pay taxes by having their income taxed twice. So they are paying their taxes, and paying them at an outrageous rate. So I don't see working under the table to be breaking the law at all. What people do for and as a moonlighting endeavor--should be left up to them to do at their own discretion. Someone else here said that many people feel strapped because of their paltry tax-laden income, so they need to find and employ themselves again where the tax monster doesn't become a factor.

Somehow by working under the table keeps me from assimilating? LOL! You do have a weird sense of humor, but make me laugh...you did.

So I'm un-American for wishing people luck in finding tax-exempt moonlighting employment. And I'm a thief because what...because I wish to see people make enough money to help offset a tax-reduced paycheck? And I'm a liar, for what...for suggesting that people enjoy living the American dream?

You know, coffee...it seems to me that those taking the poll have outnumbered you 4 to 1 in their agreement with me on this working under the table issue. Perhaps it is you that is un-American, a thief in the night, and a habitual liar.

Caine · Dec 17, 2006

I am just wondering why you don't add the rest of the story in there.

What do you guys think about receiving Social Welfare and Social Security and working under the table, regularly to pay for things that your government handouts don't provide, and not paying taxes.

I think that stealing from your fellow american is totally un-american.

stildizzy · Dec 17, 2006

Working under the table is WRONG. Monica did it, and got a Hillbilly Impeached.:naughty

ptsdkid · Dec 17, 2006

Caine said:
I am just wondering why you don't add the rest of the story in there.

What do you guys think about receiving Social Welfare and Social Security and working under the table, regularly to pay for things that your government handouts don't provide, and not paying taxes.

I think that stealing from your fellow american is totally un-american.

***Perhaps if we were to get your feelings on the original poll question--that we could then begin to engage further discourse on this most important issue. For if yer agin under the table employment, then you'll surely be against anyone seeking tax relief income, regardless of their class status.

Caine · Dec 17, 2006

ptsdkid said:
***Perhaps if we were to get your feelings on the original poll question--that we could then begin to engage further discourse on this most important issue. For if yer agin under the table employment, then you'll surely be against anyone seeking tax relief income, regardless of their class status.

No, because under the table employment is illegal.
And thus, puts you on the same level as an illegal immigrant, or a guy who was drinking while driving, or a guy who steals cars, etc.

At least in my book, it makes you a common criminal.

Hatuey · Dec 17, 2006

I belive it's un-american to work under the table and then claim whatever that bullshit welfare you claim.

ptsdkid · Dec 17, 2006

Hatuey said:
I belive it's un-american to work under the table and then claim whatever that bullshit welfare you claim.

***That bullshit welfare is a veteran disability benefit for having fought in the Vietnam war defending our country for the safety of whining slackers like yourself.

CaptainCourtesy · Dec 17, 2006

Kid, I originally addressed this here: http://www.debatepolitics.com/448857-post40.html.
This poll is a disingeuous attempt to :spin: an issue that affects you personally. The poll is a red herring. The whole story of your situation clearly shows how un-American you are and how little you practice what you preach. If you earn enough money to pay taxes and, in concert with this, collect Social Security, you are doing something patently illegal, and are no better than an illegal alien milking the government, while contributing NOTHING that supports the government.

This poll is pointless because the choices are far to vauge. CoffeeSaint's point shows this.

CoffeeSaint said:
I don't really think it depends on the reason, I think it depends on the scale.
Kids being paid to mow lawns are not expected to pay taxes on their income. But adults who are not dependents, and who make over $400 a year, need to pay taxes.

Sorry, your thread is very self-serving and actually addresses no issues. Very disappointing.

ptsdkid · Dec 17, 2006

Caine said:
No, because under the table employment is illegal.
And thus, puts you on the same level as an illegal immigrant, or a guy who was drinking while driving, or a guy who steals cars, etc.

At least in my book, it makes you a common criminal.

***Not all under the table jobs or work is illegal. My son often works part time helping his freind's dad do some roofing for a pretty good hunk of change...tax free.

If I were to have followed your goody-two-shoes book of political correctness--I would have never had the ingenuity to give my sh-it burning detail in Vietnam over to the clueless new guy. Now I'm smelling nothing but roses, since I've been able to buy the entire flower store with help from my moonlighting job(s).

stildizzy · Dec 17, 2006

ptsdkid said:
***That bullshit welfare is a veteran disability benefit for having fought in the Vietnam war defending our country for the safety of whining slackers like yourself.

You are NOT going to find many Liberals with a DD214.

ptsdkid · Dec 17, 2006

CaptainCourtesy said:
Kid,

This poll is a disingeuous attempt to :spin: an issue that affects you personally. The poll is a red herring. The whole story of your situation clearly shows how un-American you are and how little you practice what you preach. If you earn enough money to pay taxes and, in concert with this, collect Social Security, you are doing something patently illegal, and are no better than an illegal alien milking the government, while contributing NOTHING that supports the government.

This poll is pointless because the choices are far to vauge.

Sorry, your thread is very self-serving and actually addresses no issues. Very disappointing.

***Choices are far too vague? Isn't that where the action of debate could help broaden the choices? Sorry I didn't give you more than the obligartory two choices of No and Yes. I'm surprised that you couldn't devise an option of your own to add to the debate. Captain's generally have the knack to inspire and lead. Please don't let us down. Every poll or post I put here is presented with a personal feeling toward the issue. Sorry if my posts don't live up to your standards. There are other postings from less controversial politicos that you could feel more satisfaction with...I'm sure. Please don't feel the need to disrupt any or all of my postings. This post will surely survive without you.

Kandahar · Dec 17, 2006

ptsdkid said:
***That bullshit welfare is a veteran disability benefit for having fought in the Vietnam war defending our country for the safety of whining slackers like yourself.

1. You didn't defend anyone. You never saw combat, and cried about PTSD like a little ***** until they let you go home.

2. You aren't entitled to ANYTHING from the taxpayers - including veteran disability benefits - if you cheat on your taxes.

3. Say hi to Big Bertha for me.

Caine · Dec 17, 2006

stildizzy said:
You are NOT going to find many Liberals with a DD214.

Oh.. And what is your experience on this subject, what knowledge do you have?

There is one in this household.
As well as me, a moderate who if forced would rather identify with Liberals than Conservatives.

Kandahar · Dec 17, 2006

ptsdkid said:
If I were to have followed your goody-two-shoes book of political correctness--I would have never had the ingenuity to give my sh-it burning detail in Vietnam over to the clueless new guy.

You're quite the patriot. :roll:

ptsdkid · Dec 17, 2006

stildizzy said:
You are NOT going to find many Liberals with a DD214.

**Excellent point, Stilldiz. In my day, liberals were too busy heading to Toronto to escape the draft. Those that came back to the states after Nixon granted them amnesty--still managed to knock the war and the soldiers that fought it. Some even managed to plagerize or make fake copies of DD-214's of a fake combat tour so as to claim the same type of benefits that I had earned fighting and honoring our country by doing it the old fashioned way. Burkett's book called 'Stolen Valor' gives a troubling detailed look into many of these liberal charlatans, many of which are doing hard time in prison for their efforts.

Caine · Dec 17, 2006

ptsdkid said:
**Excellent point, Stilldiz. In my day, liberals were too busy heading to Toronto to escape the draft. Those that came back to the states after Nixon granted them amnesty--still managed to knock the war and the soldiers that fought it. Some even managed to plagerize or make fake copies of DD-214's of a fake combat tour so as to claim the same type of benefits that I had earned fighting and honoring our country by doing it the old fashioned way. Burkett's book called 'Stolen Valor' gives a troubling detailed look into many of these liberal charlatans, many of which are doing hard time in prison for their efforts.

Not to be knocking a fellow combat veteran.

But Rumor has it you never even saw soil of Vietnam, and never saw combat either.

stildizzy · Dec 17, 2006

Caine said:
Oh.. And what is your experience on this subject, what knowledge do you have?

First hand, thanks.:2razz: Never knew a Liberal in the Corp, and in the 2004 election 95% active duty Army voted for GWB, while 98% of Marines voted GWB. Semper Fi.:2wave:

Is it Un-American to work under the table?