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Is gay a choice or innate....or both?

EdwinWillers said:
BTW - it's a choice.
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If it was a choice, EW, could you not simply decide that from now on I am going to be attracted to males rather than females? I certainly cant make such a choice. I am attracted to women and there is really nothing I can do about it if i tried. I dont even have a choice in which women I find attractive and which women I dont.
 
Questerr said:
Correct. Attraction is not a choice and I provided the science that supports that claim.
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It's called bottoming out with nothing left but reductio ad absurdum. He's got nothing left so divert divert!
 
vegas giants said:
That's my belief too. It is likely biology plays a part.....but is not the cause.


There is no single cause and choice is also an element of this
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The emboldened is a positive assertion on your part. What element does 'choice' play in sexual orientation? How does this element of 'choice' that you are identifying, manifest itself in which gender someone is attracted to? In 61 years, I have never been able to isolate any choice in any traditional sense of the word, that I made in the direction my orientation or attractions, so this is news to me. Maybe we have very different definitions of choice. I am delighted to learn from you on this subject. Do you have any scientific evidence of this choice gay people are making?
 
Questerr said:
What were you before you made that “choice”? You can’t have made a choice and also “always have been straight”.
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So you knew you were straight or gay at age 3? Age 6? Maybe 12?
A decision was made, a choice was made at some point.
I have heard some people say they knew they were gay as far back as they can remember.
I must admit I can not relate to that since that was never my experience.
 
KingLeo said:
I was heavily involved in sports.
From 6th grade through college I spent a lot of time in locker rooms, around lots of naked guys.
I never once had any romantic or sexual inclinations towards any other male.
For me the choice to be straight was an easy one.
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What you just described proves you didnt make a choice.

You are straight, not because you chose to be, but because you were atracted to girls not boys.

you just proved my point

Thanks.
 
Questerr said:
Off topic. When it comes to the things that control attraction, humans do not have control over them.
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Yes, that's kinda my point. I thought the comparisons at least similar.
 
vegas giants said:
I did. I was not attracted to boys or girls and then decided to like girls
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But your argument is that you can choose to be sexual with males, so for your argument to be valid, you would state that you have had sexual relations with a guy.
 
KingLeo said:
So you knew you were straight or gay at age 3? Age 6? Maybe 12?
A decision was made, a choice was made at some point.
I have heard some people say they knew they were gay as far back as they can remember.
I must admit I can not relate to that since that was never my experience.
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No choice was made. At some point around 12 I realized things that made me sexually attracted, but I didn’t choose what they were. No choice was made.
 
KingLeo said:
Sure I did.
I choose to be straight
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So you could choose to be sexually attracted to men? That's bi, that's fine.

But I dont mean just choosing to have sex with a man...that's an act, not an attraction.
 
btthegreat said:
The emboldened is a positive assertion on your part. What element does 'choice' play in sexual orientation? How does this element of 'choice' that you are identifying, manifest itself in which gender someone is attracted to? I have never been able to isolate any choice in any traditional sense of the word, that I made in the direction my orientation or attractions? I am delighted to learn from you on this subject because in 61 years nobody has pointed to any choice I made. Do you have any scientific evidence of this choice gay people are making?
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My op says we dont know for sure what causes sexuality but I believe it is likely a wide variety of factors. There is no reason to believe choice can not be one of them
 
Lursa said:
So you could choose to be sexually attracted to men? That's bi, that's fine.

But I dont mean just choosing to have sex with a man...that's an act, not an attraction.
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Bisexuals don’t choose their attraction either.
 
Questerr said:
But you could choose to be attracted to males? If not, then you didn’t make any choice to be straight.

And we know you didn’t make any such choice because attraction isn’t a choice and science confirms that.
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So again at some point I made the choice to be straight.
I have heard people say they knew they were gay as far back as they can remember.
I have talked to others who struggled with gay/straight/gay/straight for years before finally making a definitive choice.
I admit I can not fully understand that since my choice was a clear cut one for me.
 
Elora said:
Yes, they do...if they want to bad enough...mind over matter...
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No they don’t. And science supports me on this.

Your manual of child stabbing, wife rape, and how to beat slaves has no bearing on that.
 
vegas giants said:
My op says we dont know for sure what causes sexuality but I believe it is likely a wide variety of factors. There is no reason to believe choice can not be one of them
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You made a positive assertion. I expect some evidence behind it. What was the nature of this choice that I made to be attracted to men. How does in manifest itself in my daily life?
 
Elora said:
If nothing is a choice we should just all commit hairy carry right now...:rolleyes:
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"Hairy carry?" I realize you never demonstrate the ability to articulate what scriptures really mean but "hairy carry?"

Jeebus, Mary, and Joe Cocker
 
KingLeo said:
So again at some point I made the choice to be straight.
I have heard people say they knew they were gay as far back as they can remember.
I have talked to others who struggled with gay/straight/gay/straight for years before finally making a definitive choice.
I admit I can not fully understand that since my choice was a clear cut one for me.
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If you made a choice, then you can also “have always been” straight. Because there would have had to been a point before your “choice”.

Could you choose to be attracted to men?
 
btthegreat said:
You made a positive assertion. I expect some evidence behind it. What was the nature of this choice that I made to be attracted to men. How does in manifest itself in my daily life?
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It's like every other choice you made. You decided you liked something so you did it
 
vegas giants said:
It's like every other choice you made. You decided you liked something so you did it
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We don’t choose the things we like. You can’t force you brain to produce certain chemicals. I posted the science on this.
 
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