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If Lax Gun Laws In The USA Are The Problem

The USA is in a state of mass psychosis and thus should urgently rethink its policies on gun-avaiability for all adults without qualifications and safety training.



The second amendment is no longer viable as the USA has the world's most powerful and professional standing army under federal control. Well-regulated state militias no longer have any hope of standing up to that powerful, federally-controlled armed forces. Thus the raison d'être of the 2nd A is no more.

Now it has become a grotesque barrier to thorough gun regulation badly needed in a time of mass delusion and social breakdown. However the 2nd A is defended fanatically by people who so often betray in their arguments against gun regulation that they don't give a damn about the safety and health of anyone but themselves and their immediate loved-ones. They lack humanity and empathy and are generally indifferent or dismissive of the great harms which guns are doing in their society. While such people are not the genesis of the mass psychosis gripping America, their paranoia, fear-mongering and refusal to stop the carnage of unfettered mass gun-ownership in a psychotic society is a great contributor to the pathology of modern American life (and death).

You all need gun control laws because as a country you lack self-control and are in the grip of multiple nation-wide delusional psychoses.

Cheers and be well (to all).
Evilroddy.
You haven't answered the question of why there weren't mass shootings, not like there are today, back sixty years ago and earlier when gun control was more relaxed in the USA. You're dodging and you're getting off the point, just like Allan.
 
They don't give a damn about themselves or their immediate loved ones. Since guns are frequently used in suicides, accidental discharges and domestic disputes if they gave a damn they wouldn't have a gun in the house.
That's not the point. Stop dodging.
 
You just had 10 people killed in Canada with knives. The U.S. is different than most countries. It was born out of violence. I don’t think you can apply commonsense to these killers. If one wants to kill, they will. Making bombs, chemicals, instructions are there on the internet. The highest death toll in a school was by a bomb in Michigan. 45 killed, 58 injured.
And yet, we didn't have this problem in the USA fifty years ago and earlier.
 
The Second Amendment isn't about militia. See Heller, Caetano, Bruen.
Rucker61:

Read the amendment. The words are as clear as the tens of thousands of dead bodies piled up like cord-wood each year in America. Hiding behind the false reality of politicians garbed in jurists' robes does not change the reality of the dead. This is a classic example of how self-delusion trumps reality in American psychosis. More of the amendment is about the militia than about not infringing gun rights.
We have 100 million legal gun owners; a fraction of 1% of gun related crimes are committed by this group. Statistically, that is under control.
The 45,000 people who died by guns last year is not an under control situation. That's about how many Americans died in fifteen years in the Vietnam War, but these are dying each year. More delusion and rejection of reality because as Mr. Twain said, "lies, damn lies and statistics", are useful tools of denial.
You should then move to the US, to a red state, gain citizenship and start working to repeal the Second Amendment.
Physicians, heal thy selves! Your country's mass psychosis, your job to fix it or adjust your gun laws accordingly to ameliorate it.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.
 
Extremely rare event. By the end of July you had more than 200 mass shootings.

Yeah - lax gun laws.

Many countries were. France, Germany etc. Mass shootings are very rare in those other "born out of violence" countries.

So stop making it so easy for them.

Extremely rare.
Stop getting off the point.
 
And none of those are very successful. Aren't you afraid that by making the U.S, like other developed countries you will stifle it's uniqueness. Geld the golden goose so to speak?
The point of this thread was not to compare the USA to other countries, the point of this thread was to compare the USA today to the USA fifty years ago and earlier.
 
You haven't answered the question of why there weren't mass shootings, not like there are today, back sixty years ago and earlier when gun control was more relaxed in the USA. You're dodging and you're getting off the point, just like Allan.
DebateChallenge:

Yes I did. A protracted period of mass psychosis/hysteria taking many forms in America since the end of the Cold War period; roughly 1989-today. Since your country cannot find an existential foreign threat to fixate upon, you've instead fallen upon yourselves. Your country is gripped by delusion, hysteria and violence. There are no more great open spaces for the tens of millions of people to get away anymore, you're mostly packed into or near cities and you're turning on one another like reality is some kind of first-person-shooter matrix. It's mass mental illness on a nation-wide scale.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.
 
The point of this thread was not to compare the USA to other countries, the point of this thread was to compare the USA today to the USA fifty years ago and earlier.
You have presented no data. I doubt good data before 1985 exists. You would have to survey newspapers which would be unreliable. Many incidents were not documented like today. The majority of the population ws rural and schools very small by todays standards. Everybody knew everybody else.
 
And yet, we didn't have this problem in the USA fifty years ago and earlier.
Exactly, that is what most want to ignore. Mass shooting is a recent phenomenon, the last 50 years phenomena which wasn’t present in the past. They don't want to hear it. Most don’t want to face up to the problem, they’re too busy looking for a band aid approach instead of searching and delving deep within our society to find out what went wrong. What the root cause or reasons that all of a sudden mass shooting went from a rarity to common place. Most people are afraid of what they might find, they don’t want to find the causes or reasons. It would show our society has taken a wrong turn.
 
Rucker61:

Read the amendment. The words are as clear as the tens of thousands of dead bodies piled up like cord-wood each year in America. Hiding behind the false reality of politicians garbed in jurists' robes does not change the reality of the dead. This is a classic example of how self-delusion trumps reality in American psychosis. More of the amendment is about the militia than about not infringing gun rights.
I've read the amendment. The Second Amendment, like all of the Bill of Rights, is a restriction on government power. It neither defines nor limits the rights of the people.

You know who else read the Second Amendment? The state legislatures who ratified the Bill of Rights. They also ratified their own state constitutions around the same time, and those legislatures affirmed an individual right to self defense in those state constitutions. They certainly understood that a right for an individual to bear arms for self defense existed.

Pennsylvania: 1776: That the people have a right to bear arms for the defence of themselves and the state; and as standing armies in the time of peace are dangerous to liberty, they ought not to be kept up; And that the military should be kept under strict subordination, to, and governed by, the civil power. Declaration of Rights, cl. XIII.
Vermont: That the people have a right to bear arms for the defence of themselves and the State -- and as standing armies in time of peace are dangerous to liberty, they ought not to be kept up; and that the military should be kept under strict subordination to and governed by the civil power. Ch. I, art. 16 (enacted 1777, ch. I, art. 15).

Kentucky: 1792: "That the right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State shall not be questioned." Art. XII, § 23.

Ohio: 1802: "That the people have a right to bear arms for the defence of themselves and the State; and as standing armies, in time of peace, are dangerous to liberty, they shall not be kept up, and that the military shall be kept under strict subordination to the civil power." Art. VIII, § 20.

The 45,000 people who died by guns last year is not an under control situation. That's about how many Americans died in fifteen years in the Vietnam War, but these are dying each year. More delusion and rejection of reality because as Mr. Twain said, "lies, damn lies and statistics", are useful tools of denial.
Where's your denominator? There were 100 million times 365 days of opportunity for a gun related death. 45k is a statically tiny percentage of that number, and most of those deaths were by suicide.

If we get suicides down to 13,000 per year, is that good enough?
Physicians, heal thy selves! Your country's mass psychosis, your job to fix it or adjust your gun laws accordingly to ameliorate it.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.
Until there are 38 blue states, that's not going to happen.
 
Exactly, that is what most want to ignore. Mass shooting is a recent phenomenon, the last 50 years phenomena which wasn’t present in the past. They don't want to hear it. Most don’t want to face up to the problem, they’re too busy looking for a band aid approach instead of searching and delving deep within our society to find out what went wrong. What the root cause or reasons that all of a sudden mass shooting went from a rarity to common place. Most people are afraid of what they might find, they don’t want to find the causes or reasons. It would show our society has taken a wrong turn.
50 years ago? Check out the 1970s.

 
DebateChallenge:

Yes I did. A protracted period of mass psychosis/hysteria taking many forms in America since the end of the Cold War period; roughly 1989-today. Since your country cannot find an existential foreign threat to fixate upon, you've instead fallen upon yourselves. Your country is gripped by delusion, hysteria and violence. There are no more great open spaces for the tens of millions of people to get away anymore, you're mostly packed into or near cities and you're turning on one another like reality is some kind of first-person-shooter matrix. It's mass mental illness on a nation-wide scale.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.
So you're saying its the end of the cold war that is the cause for all the mass shootings today.
 
You have presented no data. I doubt good data before 1985 exists. You would have to survey newspapers which would be unreliable. Many incidents were not documented like today. The majority of the population ws rural and schools very small by todays standards. Everybody knew everybody else.
Before 1985 we had big cities and we had densely populated places and densely populated schools. Today we have places that are very sparsely populated and we have schools that have low population and low population density. Its all about location. Manhattan is and was very densely populated before 1985. Nibrara County in Wyoming is and was very sparsely populated before 1985.

If you want to talk about population its not a matter of time period its a matter of location.
 
They are all necessary. Guns in civilian hands are not.

Canada has guns in civilian hands. Quite a few of them.
 
Your link talks about intentional homicide, Im talking about mass shootings. Mass shootings weren't much of a problem in the USA fifty years ago and earlier.
Noted, but the poster you responded had posted a link about homicide rates in total, not mass shootings.
 
50 years ago? Check out the 1970s.

Not paying attention, huh? The stats were from 1900-1970, 28 mass shootings with 17 of them occurring during the Al Capone gangster era. 1970 saw 13. So, if you want to include the 1970’s that would bring the total from 1900-1980, 80 years to 41. After 1980, a couple of hundred maybe? I hadn't bothered to count them.

https://www.globalresearch.ca/mass-shootings-in-america-a-historical-review/5355990

Keep in mind we’re talking mass shootings. Mass school shootings, the first one occurred in 1966, the University of Texas Tower shooting. No mass school shootings prior to 1966. Keep in mind the criteria is mass shootings, not 1 or 2, but mass.
 
DebateChallenge:

Yes I did. A protracted period of mass psychosis/hysteria taking many forms in America since the end of the Cold War period; roughly 1989-today. Since your country cannot find an existential foreign threat to fixate upon, you've instead fallen upon yourselves. Your country is gripped by delusion, hysteria and violence. There are no more great open spaces for the tens of millions of people to get away anymore, you're mostly packed into or near cities and you're turning on one another like reality is some kind of first-person-shooter matrix. It's mass mental illness on a nation-wide scale.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.

You may be right. Americans suffer from some sort of mass psychosis, and so having rights to guns is a bad idea for us.

Canadians- not having the level of insanity as Americans- can easily handle the rights and responsibilities inherent in possessing firearms.

So why is your government incrementally taking them away?
 
So you're saying its the end of the cold war that is the cause for all the mass shootings today.
DebateChallenge:

The timing is consistent with the end of the Cold War but the Cold War's end is only one pseudo-cause of the mass psychosis//hysteria. The real cause is America needs enemies and so does American gun culture. No serious enemies abroad means you have to find them at home. That ratchets up domestic tensions and triggers one facet of the mass psychosis. There are many facets however. What is consistent is the psychosis. The causes vary.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.
 
Before 1985 we had big cities and we had densely populated places and densely populated schools. Today we have places that are very sparsely populated and we have schools that have low population and low population density. Its all about location. Manhattan is and was very densely populated before 1985. Nibrara County in Wyoming is and was very sparsely populated before 1985.

If you want to talk about population its not a matter of time period its a matter of location.
I know, I grew up in North Dakota. Then the population was distributed across the state in small towns and family farms. Now it is concentrated in the Fargo area and a couple other medium sized cities.
 
DebateChallenge:

The timing is consistent with the end of the Cold War but the Cold War's end is only one pseudo-cause of the mass psychosis//hysteria. The real cause is America needs enemies and so does American gun culture. No serious enemies abroad means you have to find them at home. That ratchets up domestic tensions and triggers one facet of the mass psychosis. There are many facets however. What is consistent is the psychosis. The causes vary.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.
Alright if that's the case then explain why mass shootings in the USA weren't much of a problem before the cold war.
 
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