I still vote D, but ...

[Antiwar]

Here's your statement I responded to: "Because it's unethical for people to be barely surviving (or not) while others plunder resources, and hold others down." That's all, in your view, because of "US hegemony and militarism ... chattel slavery and all that followed"? Or are some places suffering independent of the US's wealth?

I didn't say nor intend to imply all. I don't usually qualify my statements with things that detract from them.

Of course there are many different situations and factors. But a big reason many places in the Global South have problems is because some countries' governments and businesses have caused instabilities in the Global South, to put it nicely. In other words, some of the Western powers have ****ed over much of the rest of the world, where they could get away with it.

 

[Antiwar]

Perfect illustration of the problem. Equating, e.g., Trump and Clinton shows how juvenile the far left tends to be. Really, you can't tell which one is worse? For example, an overt racist who stakes the racism is, according to your value system, just as good as a pol who does not?

I didn't "equate Trump and Clinton."

And I'm not "far left."

 

[Antiwar]

Meaning you agree with Democrats on every one of the choices in the poll. Those are pretty good reasons to vote Democrat don't you think? It's a "big tent" party so you will never get everything you want. And then there is the alternative and a vote for a 3rd party is a vote for the Party of Trump. This one step forward and two steps back has got to stop. It's now killing us by the 1000's a day.

I made my own list of why most of the D Team is hardly any different than the R Team, on those key issues. There are a few progressives (versus liberal and neoliberals) on the D Team.

I would likely "hold my nose" and vote for a D presidential candidate, if I felt it was needed. I voted for Obama. I regret voting for Obama a second time because I should have known by then that Obama was a neoliberal. Obama's rhetoric was pretty good, but his record (as my short list illustrates, also) sucked.

My Green Party votes in presidential selections have never affected the outcome because I'm in a "blue" state. Progressives consider Trump as a symptom of America's problems, not the cause.

 

[skeptic llc]

I didn't "equate Trump and Clinton."

And I'm not "far left."

Is Clinton the "poo sandwich" or the "turd taco"?

 

[skeptic llc]

I didn't say nor intend to imply all. I don't usually qualify my statements with things that detract from them.

Of course there are many different situations and factors. But a big reason many places in the Global South have problems is because some countries' governments and businesses have caused instabilities in the Global South, to put it nicely. In other words, some of the Western powers have ****ed over much of the rest of the world, where they could get away with it.

Seems like you are being much more careful with your words all of a sudden; I like it. So you started with it being unethical for some to be rich and others to be poor (paraphrasing and simplifying); when I implicitly suggested the poverty of some was not caused by the wealth of others you pointed to US bad deeds (paraphrasing again). So ... how much global poverty has US bad deeds caused, in your opinion, vs. how much global poverty US initiatives (esp. free trade) have cured, in your view?

 

[Antiwar]

Is Clinton the "poo sandwich" or the "turd taco"?

Neither. I was much more referring to the two dominant parties and the similarities of their presidential candidates.

 

[btthegreat]

I still vote D, but I generally DISagree with the D party on the issue of _____________

This is very difficult to do because we have a very broad spectrum of ideas from the more moderate wing to the progressive wing and because the stereotype of what dems supposedly believe is a caricature of reality. Very few Dems actually believe the simplistic stereotyped radicalized version of these positions. You actually have to listen to dems tell you their views on immigration, policing taxation etc rather than some two sentence condensed idiocy claimed by Fox News.

I don't disagree with the Democratic view on defunding police or their use of tactics, because most people don't know what the Democratic view really is. Its not condensed neatly into a slogan, a few scary words taken off a BLM sign. Its the words taken without any context or nuance that is wrong, and the assumption that they apply to democratic party that is wrong, not the Democratic party position that is wrong.

 

[skeptic llc]

Neither. I was much more referring to the two dominant parties and the similarities of their presidential candidates.

So which of the two supposedly similar candidates are you referring to as the "poo sandwich" and the "turd taco"? Assuming poo and turd are equivalent, when has the D candidate been equivalent to the R candidate?

 

[skeptic llc]

This is very difficult to do because we have a very broad spectrum of ideas from the more moderate wing to the progressive wing and because the stereotype of what dems supposedly believe is a caricature of reality. Very few Dems actually believe the simplistic stereotyped radicalized version of these positions. You actually have to listen to dems tell you their views on immigration, policing taxation etc rather than some two sentence condensed idiocy claimed by Fox News.

I don't disagree with the Democratic view on defunding police or their use of tactics, because most people don't know what the Democratic view really is. Its not condensed neatly into a slogan, a few scary words taken off a BLM sign. Its the words taken without any context or nuance that is wrong, and the assumption that they apply to democratic party that is wrong, not the Democratic party position that is wrong.

Ignore the caricature. Ds generally push in a direction; on which direction do you think Ds are wrong?

 

[Antiwar]

Seems like you are being much more careful with your words all of a sudden; I like it. So you started with it being unethical for some to be rich and others to be poor (paraphrasing and simplifying); when I implicitly suggested the poverty of some was not caused by the wealth of others you pointed to US bad deeds (paraphrasing again). So ... how much global poverty has US bad deeds caused, in your opinion, vs. how much global poverty US initiatives (esp. free trade) have cured, in your view?

My positions are based on the criticisms I hear. Like most people, I don't have first-hand experience nor the knowledge to determine my positions on my own. The people I listen to make sense and are consistent with their principles. So, I've heard that free trade agreements like NAFTA benefit American corporations and hurt the smaller farmers in Mexico. That falls under neoliberalism.

There's more (mostly the US using its influence heavy-handedly, which I already generalized), but it's late. I might or might not get back to this.

 

[btthegreat]

Ignore the caricature. Ds generally push in a direction; on which direction do you think Ds are wrong?

Hmmm. None. I don't want to go to the right on any of it. But on some I would go with a gentle nudge here and there from the centrist position, and no pushing . On some I would try to hold ground from what I see as a general radical rightwing shove into a wall of cruel indifference for the last four years. On others I would push to the left pretty firmly.

 

[iguanaman]

I made my own list of why most of the D Team is hardly any different than the R Team, on those key issues. There are a few progressives (versus liberal and neoliberals) on the D Team.

I would likely "hold my nose" and vote for a D presidential candidate, if I felt it was needed. I voted for Obama. I regret voting for Obama a second time because I should have known by then that Obama was a neoliberal. Obama's rhetoric was pretty good, but his record (as my short list illustrates, also) sucked.

My Green Party votes in presidential selections have never affected the outcome because I'm in a "blue" state. Progressives consider Trump as a symptom of America's problems, not the cause.

Losing elections has consequences. That is what has been happening so do not have any illusions. If you want progress you need to win elections consistently. Let's start there. Bickering within is what gives the right wing an advantage.

 

[skeptic llc]

My positions are based on the criticisms I hear. Like most people, I don't have first-hand experience nor the knowledge to determine my positions on my own. The people I listen to make sense and are consistent with their principles. So, I've heard that free trade agreements like NAFTA benefit American corporations and hurt the smaller farmers in Mexico. That falls under neoliberalism.

There's more (mostly the US using its influence heavy-handedly, which I already generalized), but it's late. I might or might not get back to this.

The share of humans living in extreme poverty has fallen sharply in recent decades. Free trade is a likely reason why (basically, citizens being exploited by, e.g., US companies represents a far better standard of living than many nations' workers had previously ... and over time many countries build off that to develop their own industries I think). Here's a good article on same of the debated points on this topic, also noting some that no one really debates. https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2019/2/12/18215534/bill-gates-global-poverty-chart

 

[Moderate Right]

I still vote D, but I generally DISagree with the D party on the issue of _____________

Very interesting poll. As of now, the top three choices are police funding, gun rights, and immigration, with an honorable mention of taxes and spending. And yet many on the left claim they have a mandate for all of their policies. According to this unscientific poll, they don't have a mandate regarding these items even from their own party.

 

[Maccabee]

I still vote D, but I generally DISagree with the D party on the issue of _____________

I would vote D if it wasn't for there stance on abortion, gun rights, and police tactics.

 

[Moi621]

I would vote D if it wasn't for there stance on abortion, gun rights, and police tactics.

I would vote D again
if it wasn't for their stance against
straight, white men.


Moi
Straight, White Man