"I Am In Favor Of Cutting Taxes Under ANY Circumstances . . .

[SkyChief]

. . . and for ANY excuse, for ANY reason, whenever it's possible." - Milton Friedman

I used to agree with this, however there is a critical flaw in Friedman's sentiment. The majority of Tax Cuts are given to hand-picked groups of people who must meet certain requirements. This is wrong.

Trump's Tax Cuts were enjoyed by the wealthy people, but middle-class taxpayers were left out. Kamala Harris' proposed ($50k) Tax Cuts for new business owners would be enjoyed only by new business owners - the middle-class taxpayers would be left out.

Tax Cuts are great, but they should be offered to ALL taxpayers. Everyone should benefit from Tax Cuts - not just a few people.

source https://www.businessinsider.com/kamala-harris-small-businesses-tax-breaks-cut-red-tape-2024-9 (paywall)

 

[Stealers Wheel]

. . . and for ANY excuse, for ANY reason, whenever it's possible." - Milton Friedman

I used to agree with this, however there is a critical flaw in Friedman's sentiment. The majority of Tax Cuts are given to hand-picked groups of people who must meet certain requirements. This is wrong.

Trump's Tax Cuts were enjoyed by the wealthy people, but middle-class taxpayers were left out. Kamala Harris' proposed ($50k) Tax Cuts for new business owners would be enjoyed only by new business owners - the middle-class taxpayers would be left out.

Tax Cuts are great, but they should be offered to ALL taxpayers. Everyone should benefit from Tax Cuts - not just a few people.

source https://www.businessinsider.com/kamala-harris-small-businesses-tax-breaks-cut-red-tape-2024-9 (paywall)

So . . . if tax cuts are not offered to everyone, then you believe no one should get a tax cut? Sounds like Newt Gingrich's no loaf is better than half a loaf take on bipartisan legislation. If you can't get 100% of everything you want, then make sure no one gets anything.

 

[Captain Adverse]

. . . and for ANY excuse, for ANY reason, whenever it's possible." - Milton Friedman

I used to agree with this, however there is a critical flaw in Friedman's sentiment. The majority of Tax Cuts are given to hand-picked groups of people who must meet certain requirements. This is wrong.

Trump's Tax Cuts were enjoyed by the wealthy people, but middle-class taxpayers were left out. Kamala Harris' proposed ($50k) Tax Cuts for new business owners would be enjoyed only by new business owners - the middle-class taxpayers would be left out.

Tax Cuts are great, but they should be offered to ALL taxpayers. Everyone should benefit from Tax Cuts - not just a few people.

source https://www.businessinsider.com/kamala-harris-small-businesses-tax-breaks-cut-red-tape-2024-9 (paywall)

I don't know what you meant by that bolded portion. I recall that during Trump's term after he got those tax cuts, my paychecks were several hundred dollars bigger than they were prior to those cuts. I am not going to pay to see that article you cited either.

Now I consider myself "middle class" based on earnings at the job (none of your business) I worked at. I had no "red tape" to go through. All I know is I got more back while those tax cuts were in force, and less after they expired.

 

[Rogue Valley]

I don't know what you meant by that bolded portion. I recall that during Trump's term after he got those tax cuts, my paychecks were several hundred dollars bigger than they were prior to those cuts.

The 2017 Trump tax cuts for everyone will expire in 2025.

The 2017 Trump tax cuts for the wealthy and corporations never expire.

 

[dmpi]

Generally the tax cut is larger for those who pay the most taxes. A tax cut is just a negative tax increase.

 

[switt]

If all get tax cuts, how will the gov. run? Even though I was a Reagan voter, I don't believe that the trickle down economics worked. The 50K tax credit for new companies is targeted to spur the economy and improve the tax base. Not sure it'll work, but am sure that the trickle down tax breaks for the rich will not work.

 

[eman623]

. . . and for ANY excuse, for ANY reason, whenever it's possible." - Milton Friedman

I used to agree with this, however there is a critical flaw in Friedman's sentiment. The majority of Tax Cuts are given to hand-picked groups of people who must meet certain requirements. This is wrong.

Trump's Tax Cuts were enjoyed by the wealthy people, but middle-class taxpayers were left out. Kamala Harris' proposed ($50k) Tax Cuts for new business owners would be enjoyed only by new business owners - the middle-class taxpayers would be left out.

Tax Cuts are great, but they should be offered to ALL taxpayers. Everyone should benefit from Tax Cuts - not just a few people.

source https://www.businessinsider.com/kamala-harris-small-businesses-tax-breaks-cut-red-tape-2024-9 (paywall)

The bolded part is simply not true. The vast majority of middle class tax payers got a cut. Even the NY Times said so. Even the IRS said so.

The middle class got less of a cut than the wealthy, only because they pay less in taxes under a progressive tax system. Even so, the wealthy went from paying 40% of all income tax revenue received by the federal government to 46%. Their share went UP!

In fact, if you are looking for a tax cut that helps the most people the most, the Trump tax cuts are about as close to that as you can get.

IRS data proves Trump tax cuts benefited middle, working-class Americans most

Republicans’ 2017 tax reform law did exactly what was promised: It lowered taxes for all income groups.

www.yahoo.com

MSN

 

[Stealers Wheel]

I don't know what you meant by that bolded portion. I recall that during Trump's term after he got those tax cuts, my paychecks were several hundred dollars bigger than they were prior to those cuts. I am not going to pay to see that article you cited either.

Now I consider myself "middle class" based on earnings at the job (none of your business) I worked at. I had no "red tape" to go through. All I know is I got more back while those tax cuts were in force, and less after they expired.

Are middle class? Here is a calculator to determine if you are.

 

[SNOWFLAKE]

Indeed, according to the United Nations’ latest World Happiness Report, as covered by CBS News, the top 10 happiest countries are:

1. Norway
2. Denmark
3. Iceland
4. Switzerland
5. Finland
6. Netherlands
7. Canada
8. New Zealand
9. Australia
10. Sweden

Those countries have one interesting thing in common: They’re all highly taxed.

That’s not a coincidence, says report co-author Jeffrey Sachs, who is also the director of the Sustainable Development Solutions Network. He tells CBS that “happiness is a result of creating strong social foundations,” and that if other nations prioritized “social trust” and “healthy lives,” they could also find that their citizens become more content.

The top three happiest countries, Norway, Denmark and Iceland, are all among the highest taxed countries in the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD), in terms of total tax revenue as a percentage of GDP.

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/09/the-happiest-countries-in-the-world-also-pay-a-lot-in-taxes.html

A few months ago, some international news headlines shared recent data on the world’s happiest countries. Not to my surprise, the top four happiest nations on earth are Finland, Denmark, Iceland, and Sweden – and Norway was seventh.

These are social democratic nations. They believe in free enterprise (think of companies like Bluetooth, Skype, Spotify, Nokia, or Minecraft) and yet they also believe in taking care of each other. The results are societies where wealth is being created by the private sector and yet there is a fairer distribution of that bounty through many social benefits.

The happiest countries pay more taxes — Lindsay Advocate

A few months ago, some international news headlines shared recent data on the world’s happiest countries. Not to my surprise,... Continue reading "The happiest countries pay more taxes"

lindsayadvocate.ca

AI Overview:
Yes, people in Scandinavian countries tend to be happier, and they pay higher taxes than many other countries:

Meanwhile in the US, and increasingly in Canada too, every one whines about paying too much tax, but end up paying MORE for benefits other nations enjoy.
Maybe on this side of the ocean we are just crybabies, or maybe on that side of the ocean they are just a bunch of woke hippies. Take your pick.

 

[eman623]

Are middle class? Here is a calculator to determine if you are.

I scored in the upper class.

89% of Americans think they are in the middle class. 10% think they are lower class and only 1% think they are in the upper class.

https://www.rand.org/pubs/commentary/2021/05/most-americans-consider-themselves-middle-class-but.html

 

[Fletch]

. . . and for ANY excuse, for ANY reason, whenever it's possible." - Milton Friedman

I used to agree with this, however there is a critical flaw in Friedman's sentiment. The majority of Tax Cuts are given to hand-picked groups of people who must meet certain requirements. This is wrong.

Trump's Tax Cuts were enjoyed by the wealthy people, but middle-class taxpayers were left out. Kamala Harris' proposed ($50k) Tax Cuts for new business owners would be enjoyed only by new business owners - the middle-class taxpayers would be left out.

Tax Cuts are great, but they should be offered to ALL taxpayers. Everyone should benefit from Tax Cuts - not just a few people.

source https://www.businessinsider.com/kamala-harris-small-businesses-tax-breaks-cut-red-tape-2024-9 (paywall)

Trumps tax cuts went to everyone who paid taxes. But I would agree that when we are spending $2 trillion more than we are taking in, tax cuts dont make sense. If people want the goodies from the federal government, they need to be ready to pay for them.

 

[Felis Leo]

. . . and for ANY excuse, for ANY reason, whenever it's possible." - Milton Friedman

I used to agree with this, however there is a critical flaw in Friedman's sentiment. The majority of Tax Cuts are given to hand-picked groups of people who must meet certain requirements. This is wrong.

Trump's Tax Cuts were enjoyed by the wealthy people, but middle-class taxpayers were left out. Kamala Harris' proposed ($50k) Tax Cuts for new business owners would be enjoyed only by new business owners - the middle-class taxpayers would be left out.

Tax Cuts are great, but they should be offered to ALL taxpayers. Everyone should benefit from Tax Cuts - not just a few people.

source https://www.businessinsider.com/kamala-harris-small-businesses-tax-breaks-cut-red-tape-2024-9 (paywall)

I think this is utterly inane. Simply cutting taxes everywhere does not better the lives or livelihoods of our citizenry. And I highly doubt that Milton Friedman would propose this as serious policy if he saw that our country's national debt was standing at $35 trillion. How exactly are we going to pay down the national debt through tax cuts?

And if you say "Well, we need to cut spending an eliminate these wasteful social programs" okay. That is not going to happen. With the Baby Boomers being our largest voting bloc and mostly-retired, no politician is going to commit political suicide by proposing to end or meaningfully scale back their benefits.

 

[bomberfox]

I think this is utterly inane. Simply cutting taxes everywhere does not better the lives or livelihoods of our citizenry. And I highly doubt that Milton Friedman would propose this as serious policy if he saw that our country's national debt was standing at $35 trillion. How exactly are we going to pay down the national debt through tax cuts?

And if you say "Well, we need to cut spending an eliminate these wasteful social programs" okay. That is not going to happen. With the Baby Boomers being our largest voting bloc and mostly-retired, no politician is going to commit political suicide by proposing to end or meaningfully scale back their benefits.

Its mostly the Austrian ancaps that propose this.

 

[aociswundumho]

Trump's Tax Cuts were enjoyed by the wealthy people, but middle-class taxpayers were left out.

Not really, because he doubled the standard deduction, and something like 75% of all taxpayers take the standard deduction.

 

[aociswundumho]

I think this is utterly inane. Simply cutting taxes everywhere does not better the lives or livelihoods of our citizenry.

Really? You having more money in your pocket doesn't improve your life?

And I highly doubt that Milton Friedman would propose this as serious policy if he saw that our country's national debt was standing at $35 trillion. How exactly are we going to pay down the national debt through tax cuts?

Well, it's not going to get paid down by raising taxes. You'd have to raise taxes to generate another trillion per year just to cover the interest payments. The interest and the debt will be paid by printing money. That is the only politically possible "solution" to the problem.

 

[aociswundumho]

But I would agree that when we are spending $2 trillion more than we are taking in,

2 trillion now. That's going to increase, and neither Trump nor Harris give a shit about it. In fact they are both big spenders.

tax cuts dont make sense. If people want the goodies from the federal government, they need to be ready to pay for them.

They can't pay for them. We are way past that point.

 

[SkyChief]

I think this is utterly inane. Simply cutting taxes everywhere does not better the lives or livelihoods of our citizenry.

Of course it does. People who benefit from Tax Cuts will have more disposable income to spend - - however they wish on goods and/or services. This additional wealth would create a demand for goods and services, which means more employment opportunity (JOBS).

And I highly doubt that Milton Friedman would propose this as serious policy if he saw that our country's national debt was standing at $35 trillion.

Milton Friedman definitely would advocate Tax Cuts for everyone, regardless of the National Debt. Friedman understands that our National Debt is NOT due to taxpayers not being taxed enough. We are WAY overtaxed.

The reason we have a runaway National Debt is because Congress SPENDS too much. Not many people know this, but Congress is never held accountable for their reckless spending. If they were held accountable for spending more than we take in tax revenues, then they would stop with the over-spending.

How exactly are we going to pay down the national debt through tax cuts?

The National Debt is too large to "pay down". The best we can hope for is to pay the interest on the National Debt. We can still pay the interest on the National Debt and Cut Taxes.

And if you say "Well, we need to cut spending an eliminate these wasteful social programs" okay.

Spending Cuts always go hand-in-hand with Tax Cuts. ALWAYS. That's why Trump's Tax Cuts were such a disaster - - he forgot about the Spending Cuts.

 

[ColdHardTruth]

If all get tax cuts, how will the gov. run? Even though I was a Reagan voter, I don't believe that the trickle down economics worked. The 50K tax credit for new companies is targeted to spur the economy and improve the tax base. Not sure it'll work, but am sure that the trickle down tax breaks for the rich will not work.

I agree with you. I do not believe it will work.

Trickle down economics was a scam created by Republicans to favor the wealthy.

 

[Captain Adverse]

. . . and for ANY excuse, for ANY reason, whenever it's possible." - Milton Friedman

I used to agree with this, however there is a critical flaw in Friedman's sentiment. The majority of Tax Cuts are given to hand-picked groups of people who must meet certain requirements. This is wrong.

Trump's Tax Cuts were enjoyed by the wealthy people, but middle-class taxpayers were left out. Kamala Harris' proposed ($50k) Tax Cuts for new business owners would be enjoyed only by new business owners - the middle-class taxpayers would be left out.

Tax Cuts are great, but they should be offered to ALL taxpayers. Everyone should benefit from Tax Cuts - not just a few people.

source https://www.businessinsider.com/kamala-harris-small-businesses-tax-breaks-cut-red-tape-2024-9 (paywall)

I would be happy without tax cuts if I knew that my taxes were being used to pay down the debt.

What I would also like to see is Trump's promises to develop the vast natural resources available come to fruition. But in a way where we not only become energy self-sufficient, but we can sell the excess oil/coal/whatever resources nationally and internationally allowing the government to use the profits to bring down the debt and strengthen the value of the Dollar.

We must strive to bring down the national debt or face a major economic disaster as in prior Depression Eras.

 

[Isidore]

All I know is I got more back while those tax cuts were in force, and less after they expired.

Which provisions of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act expire in 2025? | Brookings

Ahead of the 2024 presidential election, the Hutchins Center explains which provisions of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act expire at the end of 2025.

www.brookings.edu

 

[Captain Adverse]

Which provisions of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act expire in 2025? | Brookings

Ahead of the 2024 presidential election, the Hutchins Center explains which provisions of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act expire at the end of 2025.

www.brookings.edu

Hmmm, I'm retired now, so maybe it was my State taxes that increased before I retired.

 

[donhughesmusic]

Really? You having more money in your pocket doesn't improve your life?

Yes it does. Speaking only for myself, I have had more money in my pocket under Biden than I ever had under Trump.

 

[Nemiroff]

I would be happy without tax cuts if I knew that my taxes were being used to pay down the debt.

What I would also like to see is Trump's promises to develop the vast natural resources available come to fruition. But in a way where we not only become energy self-sufficient, but we can sell the excess oil/coal/whatever resources nationally and internationally allowing the government to use the profits to bring down the debt and strengthen the value of the Dollar.

We must strive to bring down the national debt or face a major economic disaster as in prior Depression Eras.

Hello!
I don't think that's accurate.
From my understanding, deficit spending is what again and again gets us out of depressions. From the great depression, to the great recession.
Neither side pays off the debt, but I believe fiscal conservatives sometimes forget that no organization of any kind has ever realized grow or innovation by simply cutting corners.

By taxing the people, and withholding public investment, aren't you sabotaging both the public and private spheres from making investments in our nation?

 

[Econ4every1]

. . . and for ANY excuse, for ANY reason, whenever it's possible." - Milton Friedman

I used to agree with this, however there is a critical flaw in Friedman's sentiment. The majority of Tax Cuts are given to hand-picked groups of people who must meet certain requirements. This is wrong.

Trump's Tax Cuts were enjoyed by the wealthy people, but middle-class taxpayers were left out. Kamala Harris' proposed ($50k) Tax Cuts for new business owners would be enjoyed only by new business owners - the middle-class taxpayers would be left out.

Tax Cuts are great, but they should be offered to ALL taxpayers. Everyone should benefit from Tax Cuts - not just a few people.

source https://www.businessinsider.com/kamala-harris-small-businesses-tax-breaks-cut-red-tape-2024-9 (paywall)

To understand the question of tax cuts and who to tax, it's important to understand the purpose of taxes at the federal level.

The purpose is primarily to maintain the proper level of scarcity of the dollar when looking at the economy overall.

If you have demand driven inflation (outside of an event like COVID), it might be time to increase taxes, otherwise, taxes are regressive and reduce demand, increase unemployment, increase reliance on government to provide essential services and increase income disparity and reduce economic growth and opportunity just to name a few.

The federal minimum deduction for a couple today is just shy of $30k, it should be at least 10 times that.

 

[SkyChief]

To understand the question of tax cuts and who to tax, it's important to understand the purpose of taxes at the federal level.

The purpose is primarily to maintain the proper level of scarcity of the dollar when looking at the economy overall.

That is false. The reason the Federal government imposes income Tax on us is not to "maintain the proper level of scarcity of the dollar". The purpose of taxes is now, and always has been, to provide funding for the operations of Federal government, the military forces, and essential national infrastructure.

The scarcity of the dollar has nothing to do with the reason(s) for taxation.

If you have demand driven inflation (outside of an event like COVID), it might be time to increase taxes, otherwise, taxes are regressive and reduce demand, increase unemployment, increase reliance on government to provide essential services and increase income disparity and reduce economic growth and opportunity just to name a few.

It's been said that Inflation is caused by too many dollars chasing too few goods and services. When Biden dumped $2 Trillion into the economy, this created a runaway inflation. The Federal Reserve had to step in and incrementally increase interest rates to curb the excess of money which Biden dumped into the economy. It worked. Our 9% inflation went down to 3% - - still a bit higher that we'd like, but it got under control.

Of course, Joe Biden took credit for bringing the inflation down, which is hilarious.

The federal minimum deduction for a couple today is just shy of $30k, it should be at least 10 times that.

Americans are over-taxed because Congress spends too much money. They are not held accountable for their over-spending. If they were, then they would stop, and all tax paying Americans could enjoy some well-deserved Tax Cuts.