How is abortion anyone's business or concern?

[Gordy327]

Abortion is a medical procedure as well as a woman's personal choice, regardless of the reasons, and is a matter between herself and her doctor. Any medical procedure is a private matter and concern of the patient seeking or needing it. But some anti abortionists argue abortion is "everyone's concern." But why is that? No other medical procedure gets the visibility and scrutiny abortion does. No one cares much less knows if someone has some other medical procedure, elective or otherwise. Why is abortion different? Abortion does not affect anyone (other than the pregnant woman) or society in general. Neither has anyone been able to demonstrate otherwise. So how is abortion anyone else's business or concern?

 

[SkyChief]

How is abortion anyone's business or concern?

1) When taxpayers' money is used at any point in the procedure.

2) When the person getting the abortion is a minor, it's her parent's or guardian's business to know about it.

 

[The Stars Tremble]

Some people have dumb and superstitious beliefs about fetuses.

 

[Grand Mal]

Abortion is a medical procedure as well as a woman's personal choice, regardless of the reasons, and is a matter between herself and her doctor. Any medical procedure is a private matter and concern of the patient seeking or needing it. But some anti abortionists argue abortion is "everyone's concern." But why is that? No other medical procedure gets the visibility and scrutiny abortion does. No one cares much less knows if someone has some other medical procedure, elective or otherwise. Why is abortion different? Abortion does not affect anyone (other than the pregnant woman) or society in general. Neither has anyone been able to demonstrate otherwise. So how is abortion anyone else's business or concern?

It's not. And it's downright creepy, people trying to wedge themselves between women and their doctors and thinking their opinions need to be heard.

 

[The Stars Tremble]

When taxpayers' money is used at any point in the procedure.

I expect you also oppose taxpayer money being used to save the lives of junkies.

Oh, and what's your attitude towards TANF?

 

[Gordy327]

When taxpayers' money is used at any point in the procedure.

It's not, per the Hyde Amendment. Even if it were, abortion is still much more cost effective and cheaper than taxpayers money going towards child rearing for those who have kids with limited resources. And what about those on Medicare or Medicaid? Those programs are supported with taxpayers money too. Do you support withholding care or procedures because of that too?

 

[Grand Mal]

When taxpayers' money is used at any point in the procedure.

Bullshit.
Private medical concerns between a woman and her doctor are never any of your business.

 

[SkyChief]

I expect you also oppose taxpayer money being used to save the lives of junkies.

What a remarkably lame straw-man argument.

Oh, and what's your attitude towards TANF?

My opinion on TANF is irrelevant - - we're not discussing TANF here.

 

[ColdHardTruth]

1) When taxpayers' money is used at any point in the procedure.

This is irrelevant.

2) When the person getting the abortion is a minor, it's her parent's or guardian's business to know about it.

This is right-wing mantra but isn't entirely true.

 

[SkyChief]

Bullshit.
Private medical concerns between a woman and her doctor are never any of your business.

This is 100% FALSE.

Un the U.S. we don't have taxation without representation. ALL American taxpayers have a right to know how our tax dollars are being spent.

It's the main reason our country was founded: the colonists demanded Taxation with representation.

 

[Gordy327]

This is 100% FALSE.

Un the U.S. we don't have taxation without representation. ALL American taxpayers have a right to know how our tax dollars are being spent.

It's the main reason our country was founded: the colonists demanded Taxation with representation.

Taxes is not the focus here. The question is how is abortion anyone else's business or concern? Abortion is generally paid out of pocket or possibly by insurance. Taxpayers coverage is a non issue.

 

[Grand Mal]

This is 100% FALSE.

Un the U.S. we don't have taxation without representation. ALL American taxpayers have a right to know how our tax dollars are being spent.

It's the main reason our country was founded: the colonists demanded Taxation with representation.

What goes on between a woman and her doctor is none of your damned business. Period. Nothing you can say can justify you sticking your nose in where it doesn't belong.
And this issue has nothing to do with 'taxation without representation'. You obviously don't understand the concept, or even know what the words mean.
Mind your own business.

 

[The Stars Tremble]

What a remarkably lame straw-man argument.

No, it's right to the point. If taxpayer money should not be spent on a procedure you disapprove of, does that also apply to Emergency Room treatment of junkies?

My opinion on TANF is irrelevant - - we're not discussing TANF here.

No, that also is relevant. Do you care for babies AFTER they're born, or only before?

 

[SkyChief]

It's not, per the Hyde Amendment.

That's not the point. You asked How is abortion anyone's business or concern?. I gave you two scenarios when it's rational for someone to be concerned about another person's abortion.

Even if it were, abortion is still much more cost effective and cheaper than taxpayers money going towards child rearing for those who have kids with limited resources.

Cost effectiveness is irrelevant. If a taxpayers' tax dollars are redistributed for abortions, then they have a right to know.

And what about those on Medicare or Medicaid? Those programs are supported with taxpayers money too.

That's a textbook Red herring argument. We're discussing abortion - not Medicare or Medicaid.

Do you support withholding care or procedures because of that too?

Off topic. Let's talk about abortion, and the cases when people need to be concerned.

Taxes is not the focus here.

It is now, apparently. You asked the question, and I gave you the answers. Taxes is one of answers.

The question is how is abortion anyone else's business or concern?

I understand the question perfectly. You don't like the answers because you mistakenly believed that there were no answers.

Abortion is generally paid out of pocket or possibly by insurance. Taxpayers coverage is a non issue.

Before the Hyde amendment it was.

What goes on between a woman and her doctor is none of your damned business.

100% FALSE. It's my business if my tax dollars are used to pay for it.

Period. Nothing you can say can justify you sticking your nose in where it doesn't belong.
And this issue has nothing to do with 'taxation without representation'. You obviously don't understand the concept, or even know what the words mean.
Mind your own business.

All American taxpayers have a right to know how our tax dollars are being spent.

Your flawed arguments are based on emotions and a profound lack of information.

 

[Artymoon]

Taxes is not the focus here. The question is how is abortion anyone else's business or concern? Abortion is generally paid out of pocket or possibly by insurance. Taxpayers coverage is a non issue.

I interpreted the comment is if a clinic is accepting any public funds, then they are inviting the scrutiny of the people providing those funds. Not the specific details between a doctor/patient but the operation of said clinic. If everything is private then obviously the taxpayer is out of the loop.

 

[justabubba]

Taxes is not the focus here. The question is how is abortion anyone else's business or concern? Abortion is generally paid out of pocket or possibly by insurance. Taxpayers coverage is a non issue.

abortion terminates the possibility of human life in the form of a zygote/fetus
that living creature cannot speak for itself
and others feel the need to embrace its plight
they do not distinguish between viability and non-viability
they do not distinguish between desired eventual child and unwanted future child
and they do not weigh the interests of the woman who bears the prospective child against the potential child's interests
those others stop at the prospect of terminating possible life and proceed no further
they speak for the prospective child because that zygote/fetus cannot speak for itself

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

This is 100% FALSE.

Un the U.S. we don't have taxation without representation. ALL American taxpayers have a right to know how our tax dollars are being spent.

It's the main reason our country was founded: the colonists demanded Taxation with representation.

You have representatives in the government. LOL good lord. smh. My god they fail to grasp even the simplest of concepts.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

they speak for the prospective child because that zygote/fetus cannot speak for itself

Right.

It cant speak for itself, it cant think for itself, it cant breathe for itself, it cant do a darn thing for itself, because it isnt a sentient being separate from the mother.

 

[The Stars Tremble]

It's the main reason our country was founded: the colonists demanded Taxation with representation.

Never more than implied in the Constitution, until the 17th Amendment killed it stone dead.

 

[Gordy327]

abortion terminates the possibility of human life in the form of a zygote/fetus
that living creature cannot speak for itself
and others feel the need to embrace its plight
they do not distinguish between viability and non-viability

Which is sanctimonious arrogance.

they do not distinguish between desired eventual child and unwanted future child
and they do not weigh the interests of the woman who bears the prospective child against the potential child's interests

In other words, they dont care about the pregnant woman and her circumstances.

those others stop at the prospect of terminating possible life and proceed no further
they speak for the prospective child because that zygote/fetus cannot speak for itself

Only the pregnant woman gets to speak for her ZEF.

 

[justabubba]

Right.

It cant speak for itself, it cant think for itself, it cant breathe for itself, it cant do a darn thing for itself, because it isnt a sentient being separate from the mother.

but absent abortion, chances are good that fetus/zygote would become a viable human
they speak out to give that prospect for human like, life

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

but absent abortion, chances are good that fetus/zygote would become a viable human
they speak out to give that prospect for human like, life

Chances are excellent that some sperm in my nutsack could one day "become a viable human". So what? Who cares? They certainly arent "viable humans" right now are they?

 

[justabubba]

Which is sanctimonious arrogance.

that reply causes me to believe you did not want an honest answer to your question
but prove me wrong and explain what causes my response to be found sanctimonious

In other words, they dont care about the pregnant woman and her circumstances.

while they may have concern about the desires of the impregnated woman, they seem to give greater weight to the preservation of human life
much like being against capital punishment. despite that the punished may be deserving of extreme punishment, they want to preserve life

Only the pregnant woman gets to speak for her ZEF.

there are six supreme court justices who disagree with your statement

 

[Gordy327]

That's not the point. You asked How is abortion anyone's business or concern?. I gave you two scenarios when it's rational for someone to be concerned about another person's abortion.

And those have been addressed.

Cost effectiveness is irrelevant. If a taxpayers' tax dollars are redistributed for abortions, then they have a right to know.
That's a textbook Red herring argument. We're discussing abortion - not Medicare or Medicaid.

You're bringing up taxpayer money going to medical procedures, right? Do you include that standard to ALL medical procedures, or only to abortion?

Off topic. Let's talk about abortion, and the cases when people need to be concerned.

Be my guest.

It is now, apparently. You asked the question, and I gave you the answers. Taxes is one of answers.

Im a taxpayer and abortion doesnt concern me nor is my business. Just because we pay taxes doesnt mean we get to dictate how tax money is spent. I already referenced the Hyde Amendment too, which explicity prohibits tax money going towards abortion except under specific circumstances.

I understand the question perfectly. You don't like the answers because you mistakenly believed that there were no answers.

wrong. Your answers generally do not apply, except more on fringe cases.

Before the Hyde amendment it was.

it still is.

100% FALSE. It's my business if my tax dollars are used to pay for it.

Good luck dictating that to the government. Or determining if your specific tax payment is going towards abortion, which it likely is not.

All American taxpayers have a right to know how our tax dollars are being spent.

Which is easy enough to reference. That doesn't mean we get to dictate who can

Your flawed arguments are based on emotions and a profound lack of information.

Oh the irony of that statement.

 

[SkyChief]

You have representatives in the government. LOL good lord. smh. My god they fail to grasp even the simplest of concepts.

Another nonsensical argument. Of course there are representatives in the government. It's called the House of Representatives.

If American taxpayers didn't have a right to know that our tax dollars were being spent on abortions, then there would not have been any need for the Hyde Amendment.

The Hyde Amendment is proof that many Americans do not want our tax dollars spent for abortions.