HOW DOES THE U.S. HEALTHCARE SYSTEM COMPARE TO OTHER COUNTRIES?

[Lafayette]

WHERE IS A DECENT AMERICA AS REGARDS HEALTH CARE?

Interesting article regarding HC from here: HOW DOES THE U.S. HEALTHCARE SYSTEM COMPARE TO OTHER COUNTRIES?

Excerpt:

THE UNITED STATES IS AN OUTLIER IN HEALTHCARE SPENDING

The United States devotes more of its national income to healthcare relative to other OECD countries. On average, healthcare spending across those countries has remained in line with overall economic growth in the past decade. Between 2010 and 2019, health spending across the OECD averaged about 8.7 percent of gross domestic product (GDP) annually. Healthcare spending in the United States, however, rose from 16.3 percent to 17.0 percent of GDP in in that same time period.

So what does this mean for Americans? Simple answer:
*Some people just cant afford it so they don't get much "Health-Care".
*Meaning that they die younger than the rest of us who do have decent healthcare*!

And, believe me, "they" means the poor and down-and-out who live either "below" or "at" or "just above" the Poverty Threshold in America. Which means this nowadays (from here):

Families with incomes below 200% of the federal poverty threshold—$52,492 for two adults and two related children in 2020—are often classified as “low-income.” Families are classified as being in “deep poverty” if their income falls below 50% of the poverty guidelines ($13,123 for a family of four). (Jan 31, 2022)

Where is this "America" that is supposed to be so fair-and-decent a place to live a lifetime? Where?

Ask any medical-doctor next time you're playing golf with him/her ...

*Which is basically why, here in France, I will likely live 3/4-years longer than you in the US. Because French National Healthcare is almost totally assumed by the French government. Yes, that is why I pay taxes here more than you in the US!

 

[Sweden]

Good post. Americans do not realise how much Europeans pity them. None of us - left. right or centre - would consider for a second adopting their cruel health care system.

 

[Lafayette]

STATE GOVERNMENT HEALTHCARE IN AMERICA???????

*Which is basically why, here in France, I will likely live 3/4-years longer than you in the US. Because French National Healthcare is almost totally assumed by the French government. Yes, that is why I pay taxes here more than you in the US!

But, some parts of the US are making an effort at genuine state-provided healthcare. bUT? Do poor people get free healthcare in the US?

For instance, this bit from here: Steps to Medi-Cal

Steps to Medi-Cal Medi-Cal is California's Medicaid program. This is a public health insurance program that provides free or low cost medical services for children and adults with limited income and resources. (Mar 8, 2022)

So, yes, at least one state is trying to address this wicked-problem of inadequate generalized low-cost healthcare in the US!

Any others? Do let us know ... !

 

[Lafayette]

Good post. Americans do not realise how much Europeans pity them. None of us - left. right or centre - would consider for a second adopting their cruel health care system.

When I arrived in France, posted by an American company, I had no idea whatsoever of National Healthcare. For me, it was la-la-land - that is, nothing of significance.

Boy, did I get that wrong. It took me a while to get sufficiently sick such that I had to see a doctor for hospital care. Wow! Was I surprised when I learned that the reason my company made me obtain French National Healthcare Services (NHS) was because it is highly functional. (Meaning, "It works!")

That is, those who want to be "MDs" (Medical Doctors) go to French universities almost free, gratis and for nothing! They then graduate into a profession where their salary base is provided by the NHS. Nonetheless, the following is also true: A person working as a Doctor/Physician in France typically earns around 116,000 EUR per year. Salaries range from 42,800 EUR (lowest average) to 197,000 EUR.

Not bad at all, that! But, for those much-higher-salaries I am surprised that they are so very high. There must be other factors at play and I admit not knowing which ...

 

[Greenbeard]

STATE GOVERNMENT HEALTHCARE IN AMERICA???????



But, some parts of the US are making an effort at genuine state-provided healthcare. bUT? Do poor people get free healthcare in the US?

For instance, this bit from here: Steps to Medi-Cal


So, yes, at least one state is trying to address this wicked-problem of inadequate generalized low-cost healthcare in the US!

Any others? Do let us know ... !

Every state has a Medicaid program, and all but 12 states have adopted the Affordable Care Act's Medicaid expansion that made it a universal coverage program for the poor and near-poor.

Status of State Medicaid Expansion Decisions | KFF

This page displays an interactive map of the current status of state decisions on the Affordable Care Act's Medicaid expansion. Additional Medicaid expansion resources are listed (with links) below the map.

www.kff.org

 

[ttwtt78640]

When I arrived in France, posted by an American company, I had no idea whatsoever of National Healthcare. For me, it was la-la-land - that is, nothing of significance.

Boy, did I get that wrong. It took me a while to get sufficiently sick such that I had to see a doctor for hospital care. Wow! Was I surprised when I learned that the reason my company made me obtain French National Healthcare Services (NHS) was because it is highly functional. (Meaning, "It works!")

That is, those who want to be "MDs" (Medical Doctors) go to French universities almost free, gratis and for nothing! They then graduate into a profession where their salary base is provided by the NHS. Nonetheless, the following is also true: A person working as a Doctor/Physician in France typically earns around 116,000 EUR per year. Salaries range from 42,800 EUR (lowest average) to 197,000 EUR.

Not bad at all, that! But, for those much-higher-salaries I am surprised that they are so very high. There must be other factors at play and I admit not knowing which ...

US doctors (primary care physicians) make about twice as much annually. Is the cost of that “almost free” college education for doctors and other medical care workers counted (included?) in the cost of French medical care?

Average Doctor Salaries by Specialty – Kaplan Test Prep

Review the average doctor salaries by specialty and learn how much doctors make per year. Find out where doctors get paid the most and the least in the U.S.

www.kaptest.com

 

[ttwtt78640]

Every state has a Medicaid program, and all but 12 states have adopted the Affordable Care Act's Medicaid expansion that made it a universal coverage program for the poor and near-poor.

Status of State Medicaid Expansion Decisions | KFF

This page displays an interactive map of the current status of state decisions on the Affordable Care Act's Medicaid expansion. Additional Medicaid expansion resources are listed (with links) below the map.

www.kff.org

Medicaid is much less expensive, having lower (or no) out-of-pocket cost for the subsidized person, than Medicare. Oddly, when folks talk about no out-of-pocket cost US UHC plans they do not call them “Medicaid for all”.

One lesser known ‘feature’ is that Medicaid covered long term elder care costs can be treated as a loan (from the state) payable by the estate of the covered person.

 

[Rexedgar]

Good post. Americans do not realise how much Europeans pity them. None of us - left. right or centre - would consider for a second adopting their cruel health care system.

Is healthcare treated as a ‘for profit’ industry in European countries?

 

[Helix]

Good post. Americans do not realise how much Europeans pity them. None of us - left. right or centre - would consider for a second adopting their cruel health care system.

Years ago, I asked our international members if any of them would trade health care access systems with us. I didn't get any takers or lying. My guess is that it's the same now, except I would probably see more lying. This was before election interference professionals really got going.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Is healthcare treated as a ‘for profit’ industry in European countries?

That is a good question since HR 676 would essentially make that illegal. I suspect that the answer is mixed.

 

[Rexedgar]

That is a good question since HR 676 would essentially make that illegal. I suspect that the answer is mixed.

This line is from the attached link.

”Only public or nonprofit institutions may participate. Nonprofit health maintenance organizations (HMOs) that deliver care in their own facilities may participate.”

H.R.676 - 115th Congress (2017-2018): Expanded & Improved Medicare For All Act

Summary of H.R.676 - 115th Congress (2017-2018): Expanded & Improved Medicare For All Act

www.congress.gov

I don’t get the same read as you. Plus the legislation is from 2018, what is the current status?

 

[Decypher]

Is healthcare treated as a ‘for profit’ industry in European countries?

In Ireland, the answer like @ttwtt78640 predicted is mixed. There is a basic health service run by the government. This is mostly free to use. It costs €50 to visit a GP but anyone poor or old has a medical card which means it’s free. The public hospitals are free as well.

There are also private hospitals and clinics. Anyone can use them but it’s better to have insurance. Mine costs €90 a month so if I have to see a consultant (€200) or get an MRI (€350) I get some back. I could wait for an appointment for these things in the public service but it can take time.

Cosmetic treatments are very much run for profit. Things like teeth straightening, Botox, hair restoration, etc. there are ads on tv for these things but very rarely ads for medication except for maybe Nurofen or cold medication in winter.

 

[ttwtt78640]

This line is from the attached link.

”Only public or nonprofit institutions may participate. Nonprofit health maintenance organizations (HMOs) that deliver care in their own facilities may participate.”

H.R.676 - 115th Congress (2017-2018): Expanded & Improved Medicare For All Act

Summary of H.R.676 - 115th Congress (2017-2018): Expanded & Improved Medicare For All Act

www.congress.gov

I don’t get the same read as you. Plus the legislation is from 2018, what is the current status?

How can you possibly not see that as banning for-profit providers of medical care goods/services from getting paid by the M4A single-payer (aka the federal government) system.

Most seem to think that only medical doctors (hospitals or clinics) are being paid (by insurance medical care companies), but ignore those who make (or sell) bandages, wheelchairs, drugs, provide lab/diagnostic tests or drive ambulances.

Is your local drug store a non-profit or publicly owned operation? I doubt it, but they are definitely now getting paid by various public and private medical care insurance providers.

 

[Rexedgar]

How can you possibly not see that as banning for-profit providers of medical care goods/services from getting paid by the M4A single-payer (aka the federal government) system.

Most seem to think that only medical doctors (hospitals or clinics) are being paid (by insurance medical care companies), but ignore those who make (or sell) bandages, wheelchairs, drugs, provide lab/diagnostic tests or drive ambulances.

Is your local drug store a non-profit or publicly owned operation? I doubt it, but they are definitely now getting paid by various public and private medical care insurance providers.

IDK, you stated that the proposed bill would make ‘for profit’ medical care illegal, now you say banned, “only……….may participate,” says something different to me….

 

[Lafayette]

Is healthcare treated as a ‘for profit’ industry in European countries?

No, in fact, in order to join the European Union a country must adopt pertinent "EU" laws and healthcare is stipulated as a government provided service. So, how do country government obtain a profit for Healthcare Services when provided by a government owned and run service.

I don't know where you live - but a profit-making government run service is simply not possible in the European Union.

As well as, btw, how and to whom the service is provided ...

PS: The law itself is shown here for those who intellectually gluttons-for-punishment.

 

[ttwtt78640]

IDK, you stated that the proposed bill would make ‘for profit’ medical care illegal, now you say banned, “only……….may participate,” says something different to me….

If (when?) there is only one funding source (other than paying cash) for medical care goods/services then a medical goods/services provider would be foolish not to ‘qualify” for use of M4A insurance.

Semantics aside, the affect would be the same.

 

[Rexedgar]

If (when?) there is only one funding source (other than paying cash) for medical care goods/services then a medical goods/services provider would be foolish not to ‘qualify” for use of M4A insurance.

Semantics aside, [/B[the affect would be the same.

How long have the critters been debating the ‘semantics’ in the ongoing gun safety measure?

The bill hasn’t seen any action since MAR2018 and I failed to see where they banned or made anything illegal. Did I miss something?

We are heading into the dreaded “dead horse“ zone.

meant to turn bolded off…..

 

[Sweden]

Is healthcare treated as a ‘for profit’ industry in European countries?

In Sweden partially. Some of it is delivered by share-holder owned companies

 

[Sweden]

No, in fact, in order to join the European Union a country must adopt pertinent "EU" laws and healthcare is stipulated as a government provided service. So, how do country government obtain a profit for Healthcare Services when provided by a government owned and run service.

I don't know where you live - but a profit-making government run service is simply not possible in the European Union.

As well as, btw, how and to whom the service is provided ...

PS: The law itself is shown here for those who intellectually gluttons-for-punishment.

Not quite right. Sweden is of course in the EU and health is provided by the government. But it sometimes delivered by companies. I had a cataract operation in our county - not government - owned hospital. My wife had two cataract operation at an eye-clinic owned and run by a firm called Capio. Both our operation were ultimately funded by government.

So companies CAN make profits. An important rule is that their charges must be lower than what the same service costs within equivalent public bodies.

 

[Lafayette]

Is healthcare treated as a ‘for profit’ industry in European countries?

No, throughout the European Union (EU) healthcare is a government provided service to the entire population.

Also, consider the fact that since doctors/nurses obtain their degrees for a very modest fee throughout the EU, they have no real post-secondary schooling debt to be repaid. This depends upon the country however. France and Germany have extremely low post-secondary schooling fees. Whilst Italy charges a significant annual fee ...

 

[Lafayette]

Is healthcare treated as a ‘for profit’ industry in European countries?

Not one!

A country - to join the European Union - must adopt ALL the particulars of the Union.

The most important of which is National Healthcare ...

PS: There is also the fact that any country must be a geographic neighbor of the European-Union collection of states. So, the invitation to join is not universal.

 

[jaeger19]

Is healthcare treated as a ‘for profit’ industry in European countries?

Yes

 

[jaeger19]

Not one!

A country - to join the European Union - must adopt ALL the particulars of the Union.

The most important of which is National Healthcare ...

PS: There is also the fact that any country must be a geographic neighbor of the European-Union collection of states. So, the invitation to join is not universal.

Umm.. you want to check that.
France has a lot of for profit healthcare.
So do most other countries. The UK being an exception.

 

[Bear5131]

WHERE IS A DECENT AMERICA AS REGARDS HEALTH CARE?

Interesting article regarding HC from here: HOW DOES THE U.S. HEALTHCARE SYSTEM COMPARE TO OTHER COUNTRIES?

Excerpt:



So what does this mean for Americans? Simple answer:
*Some people just cant afford it so they don't get much "Health-Care".
*Meaning that they die younger than the rest of us who do have decent healthcare*!

And, believe me, "they" means the poor and down-and-out who live either "below" or "at" or "just above" the Poverty Threshold in America. Which means this nowadays (from here):


Where is this "America" that is supposed to be so fair-and-decent a place to live a lifetime? Where?

Ask any medical-doctor next time you're playing golf with him/her ...

*Which is basically why, here in France, I will likely live 3/4-years longer than you in the US. Because French National Healthcare is almost totally assumed by the French government. Yes, that is why I pay taxes here more than you in the US!

This has been debunked a 1000 times the WHO just reports what the country's tell them, different countries use different metrics, for example Denmark doesn't have one case recently of a down syndrome birth..


Because they kill them all in the womb

 

[Napoleon]

Is healthcare treated as a ‘for profit’ industry in European countries?

Yes. The public institutions are not comprehensive and operate alongside the private sector. Those who can afford it rely on the private sector. The public arm, such as the NHS, are run largely on unpaid debt and are destined to implode.