How does one ban abortion & not violate the woman's current legal human rights?

[GEIxBattleRifle]

What do you mean, it isn't a statutory right? It certainly is in certain states.

Like in what certain states?

Rape? When the unborn human has something severe like anercephaly?

 

[opendebate]

I added more to the comment I gave to you which I edited right away when I posted my bad.

Consciousness was difficult to detect maybe back in the 1800's but now not really.

Its physical substrate, the thalamo-cortical complex that provides consciousness with its highly elaborate content, begins to be in place between the 24th and 28th week of gestation.

Just out of curiosity, how does that understanding affect your stance on abortion?

 

[Scrabaholic]

Because I believe it is clear that he is referring to the initiator of force. Which in this case would be the person seeking abortion. Left to its own devices, the baby would develop and be born in most cases. To change that requires force, and it's that initiation of force to which he would be responding to. He's not the initiator of force, but a respond-er. Both sides would be looking to use force. One against the rights of human life, the other against property and pursuit of happiness.

Though there's also the semantics in the difference between aggression and force.

Actually, the zef forces itself on the woman's uterus when it attaches itself to the uterine wall and makes changes to her immune system so that her body doesn't reject it.

 

[Ikari]

Actually, the zef forces itself on the woman's uterus when it attaches itself to the uterine wall and makes changes to her immune system so that her body doesn't reject it.

No, that's just biology. A result of choice made by the adults.

 

[Scrabaholic]

No, that's just biology. A result of choice made by the adults.

It is still force.

 

[Ikari]

It is still force.

No, it's nature. In the natural state free of force it develops into a baby and is born. You're merely attempting to redefined terms to suit your argument. But you're wrong.

 

[AGENT J]

It is still force.

yep just like a volcano is still force

 

[Scrabaholic]

No, it's nature. In the natural state free of force it develops into a baby and is born. You're merely attempting to redefined terms to suit your argument. But you're wrong.

It may be nature, but that doesn't mean it isn't or can't be force. Force occurs in nature all the time.

 

[Ikari]

It may be nature, but that doesn't mean it isn't or can't be force. Force occurs in nature all the time.

In some cases, but the embryo is not at a stage where it can act on aggression and initiate force. Left in the natural state it would develop. It takes force to deviate from that path.

 

[JayDubya]

Actually, the zef forces itself on the woman's uterus when it attaches itself to the uterine wall and makes changes to her immune system so that her body doesn't reject it.

No, a Homo sapiens in the blastocyst stage of life (your ignorant, bigoted slur is noted) does not initiate any force against its parents.

Our parents create us and place us in an environment where we can undergo the process of implantation. Ergo, any force from pregnancy is caused by the parents.

It's perverse to not only exaggerate the harm of pregnancy, but to blame the innocent kid for something he or she had no say in. It is not at all surprising to see you post something that morally bankrupt.

 

[AGENT J]

No, a Homo sapiens in the blastocyst stage of life (your ignorant, bigoted slur is noted) does not initiate any force against its parents.

Our parents create us and place us in an environment where we can undergo the process of implantation. Ergo, any force from pregnancy is caused by the parents.

It's perverse to not only exaggerate the harm of pregnancy, but to blame the innocent kid for something he or she had no say in. It is not at all surprising to see you post something that morally bankrupt.

every time you post this lie im going to expose it. I gonna point out how uneducated you are about this topic and how dishonest you are about this topic ecah and everytime you make up this lie.


when i look up ZEF
Zygote Embryo Fetus - What does ZEF stand for? Acronyms and abbreviations by the Free Online Dictionary.

it says acronym for zygote, embryo fetus

no mention of slurs or bigotry or ignorance etc etc
just more dishonest, inane, visceral, hyperbolic dishonest lies, misinformation and biased rhetoric expressed that nobody honest and educated will ever buy. THis is why there isnt one respected and honest poster here that takes the info you post seriously, not one.

once again, as usual, your made up fantasy and lie polluted posts lose to facts again

as always if you disagree please factually prove otherwise[/QUOTE]

 

[opendebate]

thank you for your answer

I answered a little more thoroughly earlier

 

[AGENT J]

I answered a little more thoroughly earlier

yes i know, thank you for both your answers

 

[Bob Blaylock]

simple question

How does one ban abortion (make it murder) and not violate the woman's current freedoms, liberties, legal and human rights, including her right to life?

The same way that one bans robbery without violating the would-be robber's rights, including his “right to life”. (He does need to eat in order to survive, after all; who are you to say that stealing by force isn't a legitimate way to obtain the resources that he needs to obtain food?)

We recognize that the other human being who is the target of a particular aggressive act has rights as well, and that one doesn't get to commit a greater violation of that person's rights in order to fulfill some lesser idea of upholding one's own “rights”.

 

[AGENT J]

1.)The same way that one bans robbery without violating the would-be robber's rights, including his “right to life”. (He does need to eat in order to survive, after all; who are you to say that stealing by force isn't a legitimate way to obtain the resources that he needs to obtain food?)

wow this is beyond a failure, usualyl your dishonesty is a little better than this
remind me how robbery is equal to abortion? oh thats right its not but to further expose this nonsensical failed logic ill play along cause its fun destroying you

so in your failed scenario who is the woman and ZEF, which is the robber and which is being robbed? its your scenario so its your choice. I cant wait to read this.

 

[wbcoleman]

Like in what certain states?

Rape? When the unborn human has something severe like anercephaly?

California, up until viability.

 

[wbcoleman]

every time you post this lie im going to expose it. I gonna point out how uneducated you are about this topic and how dishonest you are about this topic ecah and everytime you make up this lie.


when i look up ZEF
Zygote Embryo Fetus - What does ZEF stand for? Acronyms and abbreviations by the Free Online Dictionary.

it says acronym for zygote, embryo fetus

no mention of slurs or bigotry or ignorance etc etc
just more dishonest, inane, visceral, hyperbolic dishonest lies, misinformation and biased rhetoric expressed that nobody honest and educated will ever buy. THis is why there isnt one respected and honest poster here that takes the info you post seriously, not one.

once again, as usual, your made up fantasy and lie polluted posts lose to facts again

as always if you disagree please factually prove otherwise

Checkmate.

 

[AGENT J]

Checkmate.

fail
still dodging the facts i see, still waiting
please give us that example where ONE person doing ONE thing means that ALL people do it for EVERYTHING, that was my favorite.
Seems you are very upset at getting your post destroyed by me and others.

lets us know when you can back up your false claim

 

[wbcoleman]

fail
still dodging the facts i see, still waiting
please give us that example where ONE person doing ONE thing means that ALL people do it for EVERYTHING, that was my favorite.
Seems you are very upset at getting your post destroyed by me and others.

lets us know when you can back up your false claim

Friendly suggestion: Consider not calling every statement with which you disagree a lie.

 

[AGENT J]

Friendly suggestion: Consider not calling every statement with which you disagree a lie.

thanks BUT i dont do that, i call LIES lies.
a person disagreeing with something doesnt make it a lie this is basic common sense

friendly suggestion back, when you make a mistake and are factually proven wrong by multiple posters simply man up, show integrity and admit it
let us know when you are ready

 

[wbcoleman]

thanks BUT i dont do that, i call LIES lies.
a person disagreeing with something doesnt make it a lie this is basic common sense

friendly suggestion back, when you make a mistake and are factually proven wrong by multiple posters simply man up, show integrity and admit it
let us know when you are ready

Will do!

 

[AGENT J]

Will do!

well you have an opportunity to do so now, we've been waiting.

 

[GEIxBattleRifle]

It may be nature, but that doesn't mean it isn't or can't be force. Force occurs in nature all the time.

Humans usually don't succumb to nature some would though in the case of abortion. Heck mosquitos always force their way onto you and we don't allow them to stay latched onto us and suck blood out of us for free either. We kill them right away because they could be carry deadly diseases with them for example.

Last time I checked, right to life is a philosophical concept as nature doesn't recognized what the concept of the right to life is. The only thing science/biology does in the case of abortion is identity what species the unborn belong to and that's it.

 

[wbcoleman]

well you have an opportunity to do so now, we've been waiting.

When I actually make a mistake and am factually proven wrong by multiple posters, I'll be the first to admit error.

 

[wbcoleman]

When I actually make a mistake and am factually proven wrong by multiple posters, I'll be the first to admit error.

Oh, and I ought to be clear: "Proof" by repeated, emphatic assertion is NOT a proof of anything.