How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199:2834]

[TurtleDude]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

Yeah, yeah. But what does it mean? We know from contemporary records that "militia" meant slave patrol -- white death squads used to suppress slave rebellions and kill and torture runaway slaves. So much for the gunlovers' brave narrative.

MOre oozing BS-you have one source of that idiocy and its from an idiot. try again. why would rich slaveowners need a guarantee when they ran things

 

[head of joaquin]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

MOre oozing BS-you have one source of that idiocy and its from an idiot. try again. why would rich slaveowners need a guarantee when they ran things

I bet you just keep posting like this.

 

[blackjack50]

How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

I bet you just keep posting like this.

Just like you will continue to use race baiting in an attempt to validate your haggard and ridiculous argument. And the sad part is you aren't even good at race baiting. You use it so often that people just accuse you of racism.

 

[head of joaquin]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

Just like you will continue to use race baiting in an attempt to validate your haggard and ridiculous argument. And the sad part is you aren't even good at race baiting. You use it so often that people just accuse you of racism.

BWHHAHAHHAHH!

It's race baiting to point out the purpose of the militia in the 18th century was to kill indians and suppress slaves. Only in gunloverbizarroworld.

No wonder nobody takes conservatives and gunlovers seriously!

PS: did you read the article or has knownothingism totally enveloped your mind, such as it is?

 

[JackFrost]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

Actually, there's a fourth: "arms". According to the dead president channelers (originalists), we have to use terms as the founders understood them. Which means "arms" don't include revolvers or semi-automatics, which hadn't been invented them.

The argument is stupid, of course, but it's theirs and they need their noses rubbed in its implication. The 2nd Amendment doesn't protect any modern firearms. It protects only muskets and some primitive breech loading pistols.

This is false.

 

[head of joaquin]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

This is false.

Whoosh, right over your head.

Of course it's false -- it's an originalist "argument." Orginalism is intellectual dreck, which is why conservatives and gunlovers promote it (except when the consequences are pointed out)

 

[blackjack50]

How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

BWHHAHAHHAHH!

It's race baiting to point out the purpose of the militia in the 18th century was to kill indians and suppress slaves. Only in gunloverbizarroworld.

No wonder nobody takes conservatives and gunlovers seriously!

PS: did you read the article or has knownothingism totally enveloped your mind, such as it is?

Your absolutist statement about the intent of the militia is all I need as proof. You are introducing racism into an argument that it does not fit into, and using racism to undermine the "face" of the gun issue, rather than you actually debating the issue at hand. Yes. You are race baiting. There is a reason nobody is else will stand on this topic with you. They see it as nothing more than racism from you.

Seriously. You have no more argument. Give it up. Multiple people even debunked the article you posted and the author of said article. We even went so far as to point out the problems in the actual citations in the footnotes of the author. I would call that thoroughly smashed and debunked.

You are now resorting to lies and racism. Get over it.

 

[head of joaquin]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

Your absolutist statement about the intent of the militia is all I need as proof. .

It wasn't absolutist. The research showed that in the south militia meant one thing, and the north it meant another.

So much for your originalists dreck and the NRA narrative about how militias were to protect the rights of citizens. Your position is intellectually bankrupt. But that won't stop you from repeating it ad nauseum.

But thanks for admitting you haven't read any of the peer review law articles I posted and are reduced to mumbling gun lover agitprop.

 

[blackjack50]

How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

It wasn't absolutist. The research showed that in the south militia meant one thing, and the north it meant another.

So much for your originalists dreck and the NRA narrative about how militias were to protect the rights of citizens. Your position is intellectually bankrupt. But that won't stop you from repeating it ad nauseum.

But thanks for admitting you haven't read any of the peer review law articles I posted and are reduced to mumbling gun lover agitprop.

It absolutely is absolutist. Anyone who believes that the militia in the North or South served 1 function is standing in a position that is indefensible, and now I am forced to ask you what relevance this has to the 2nd amendment?

I read enough of your crap articles to tell you that they are in fact that...crap. Race baiting attempts to undermine public support and link pro gun people with "racists." They are dishonest.

It has nothing to do with it. This is race baiting 101.

 

[JackFrost]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

Whoosh, right over your head.

Of course it's false -- it's an originalist "argument." Orginalism is intellectual dreck, which is why conservatives and gunlovers promote it (except when the consequences are pointed out)

This is also false.

 

[head of joaquin]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

This is also false.

I love the fact that if you argue with conservatives long enough, they will eventually deny their own arguments, as the only escape route from their own intellectual bankruptcy.

 

[head of joaquin]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

It absolutely is absolutist. Anyone who believes that the militia in the North or South served 1 function is standing in a position that is indefensible, and now I am forced to ask you what relevance this has to the 2nd amendment?

I read enough of your crap articles to tell you that they are in fact that...crap. Race baiting attempts to undermine public support and link pro gun people with "racists." They are dishonest.

It has nothing to do with it. This is race baiting 101.

I bet you think Lincoln was a race baiter for opposing slavery. It's one absurd position to the next with conservatives.

Meanwhile the scholarship is in: militia meant "slave patrol" in the Constitution. So much for your fictive narrative about NRA members defending against tyranny.

By the way, did the NRA fight segregation in the south? Did it support the anti-war movement against Nixon's criminal acts? Did it support environmental against government action?

Nope.

 

[blackjack50]

How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

I bet you think Lincoln was a race baiter for opposing slavery. It's one absurd position to the next with conservatives.

Meanwhile the scholarship is in: militia meant "slave patrol" in the Constitution. So much for your fictive narrative about NRA members defending against tyranny.

By the way, did the NRA fight segregation in the south? Did it support the anti-war movement against Nixon's criminal acts? Did it support environmental against government action?

Nope.

What does this have to do with the 2nd amendment?

 

[Ikari]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Because a well regulated militia is a necessity to the security of a free State, both to secure and to proliferate, the right of the individual to keep and bear arms cannot and shan't be infringed upon.

 

[head of joaquin]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

What does this have to do with the 2nd amendment?

Yeah, I mean it's not like the word "militia" occurs in the 2nd amendment or that gun nuts don't give some lamo definition of it based on misquoting George Mason.

 

[head of joaquin]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

Because a well regulated militia is a necessity to the security of a free State, both to secure and to proliferate, the right of the individual to keep and bear arms cannot and shan't be infringed upon.

And to suppress slave revolts. That's what it meant to George Mason, and he wrote the language!

University of California at Davis Law Review

So much for your macho NRA narrative.

 

[Ikari]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

And to suppress slave revolts. That's what it meant to George Mason, and he wrote the language!

University of California at Davis Law Review

So much for your macho NRA narrative.

Nope, still doesn't change how I interpret the 2nd amendment.

 

[head of joaquin]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

Nope, still doesn't change how I interpret the 2nd amendment.

Translated: you don't care what the founders meant by the language of the 2nd Amendment.

So much for another NRA fiction.

 

[Ikari]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

Translated: you don't care what the founders meant by the language of the 2nd Amendment.

So much for another NRA fiction.

I care for the rights and liberties of the individual and continually moving to increase our freedom. I don't know what the NRA really has to do with this except that perhaps that's all you're left with instead of coherent arguments.

 

[head of joaquin]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

I care for the rights and liberties of the individual and continually moving to increase our freedom. I don't know what the NRA really has to do with this except that perhaps that's all you're left with instead of coherent arguments.

But you don't care what the 2nd Amendment means. Got it.

 

[Ikari]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

But you don't care what the 2nd Amendment means. Got it.

I know what it means, and the purpose for keeping an armed population.

Is this all you got? I'm open to discuss if you're open to being intellectually honest. But if it's just going to be retarded quips, then there's no point.

 

[AlabamaPaul]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

I know what it means, and the purpose for keeping an armed population.

Is this all you got? I'm open to discuss if you're open to being intellectually honest. But if it's just going to be retarded quips, then there's no point.

I wouldn't hold out hopes for much more...

 

[mbrad]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

I care for the rights and liberties of the individual and continually moving to increase our freedom. I don't know what the NRA really has to do with this except that perhaps that's all you're left with instead of coherent arguments.

How does "owning guns" and "freedom" equate? a MAJORITY of the sovereign countries in the world have "freedom" and some with more then us and they have very stringent gun laws. Look at Western Europe...the LGBT community can get married, for christ sake they can walk around drunk and naked at the same time in public and not be thrown in jail.

this idea that you can only have freedom if you own guns is retarded, and we are the only country in the world that looks at it like that. PLEASE stop bringing in a false dystopia about our government to justify having any and every weapon of mass destruction you want.

 

[Ikari]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

How does "owning guns" and "freedom" equate? a MAJORITY of the sovereign countries in the world have "freedom" and some with more then us and they have very stringent gun laws. Look at Western Europe...the LGBT community can get married, for christ sake they can walk around drunk and naked at the same time in public and not be thrown in jail.

this idea that you can only have freedom if you own guns is retarded, and we are the only country in the world that looks at it like that. PLEASE stop bringing in a false dystopia about our government to justify having any and every weapon of mass destruction you want.

having guns does not ensure freedom, nor have I ever made that case. Thanks for paying attention. Oh wait...you didn't. Just hackery on hack level by hacks. Guns are a tool through which freedom and liberty may be defended. The course of governments has been well plotted throughout history, and there is nothing that is infinitely stable. Ergo, everything degrades and there may come a point in time when you need the tools necessary to throw off the yoke of government oppression. Does having guns mean you are guaranteed to succeed? Nope, not in the least. And no one made that claim. PLEASE stop bringing in false dystopia. What it does allow is for the People to have a chance should the necessity ever arise in which they must fight for their freedom.

So stop with the stupid, we've had enough.

 

[Kal'Stang]

Re: How Do YOU Interpret The 2nd Amendment? [W:199]

Hell, why wonder? Let's ask the guys who wrote it...


"I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."
George Mason
Co-author of the Second Amendment
during Virginia's Convention to Ratify the Constitution, 1788


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"A militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves …"
Richard Henry Lee
writing in Letters from the Federal Farmer to the Republic, Letter XVIII, May, 1788.


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"The people are not to be disarmed of their weapons. They are left in full posession of them."
Zachariah Johnson
Elliot's Debates, vol. 3 "The Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution."


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"… the people are confirmed by the next article in their right to keep and bear their private arms"
Philadelphia Federal Gazette
June 18, 1789, Pg. 2, Col. 2
Article on the Bill of Rights


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"And that the said Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the Press, or the rights of Conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms; …"
Samuel Adams
quoted in the Philadelphia Independent Gazetteer, August 20, 1789, "Propositions submitted to the Convention of this State"

"Firearms stand next in importance to the constitution itself. They are the American people's liberty teeth and keystone under independence … from the hour the Pilgrims landed to the present day, events, occurences and tendencies prove that to ensure peace security and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable … the very atmosphere of firearms anywhere restrains evil interference — they deserve a place of honor with all that's good."
George Washington
First President of the United States


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"The supposed quietude of a good man allures the ruffian; while on the other hand arms, like laws, discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as property. The same balance would be preserved were all the world destitute of arms, for all would be alike; but since some will not, others dare not lay them aside … Horrid mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of the use of them."
Thomas Paine


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"To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them."
Richard Henry Lee
American Statesman, 1788


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"The great object is that every man be armed." and "Everyone who is able may have a gun."
Patrick Henry
American Patriot


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"Are we at last brought to such humiliating and debasing degradation, that we cannot be trusted with arms for our defense? Where is the difference between having our arms in possession and under our direction and having them under the management of Congress? If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands?"
Patrick Henry
American Patriot


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"Those who hammer their guns into plowshares will plow for those who do not."
Thomas Jefferson
Third President of the United States


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"The constitutions of most of our States assert that all power is inherent in the people; that … it is their right and duty to be at all times armed; … "
Thomas Jefferson
letter to Justice John Cartwright, June 5, 1824. ME 16:45.

What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance. Let them take arms."
Thomas Jefferson
to James Madison


The Founding Fathers on the Second Amendment

Of course anti-gun nuts want to ignore all of this evidence that the 2nd was originally meant to allow each and every citizen to carry any weapon that they can carry.