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How do you feel about private education?

JoeyJoystick

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Hi All,


I am wondering how you guys feel about private education. I saw the below article on BBS and it made me wonder. And it made me wonder about private education in general. Not the fee increases discussed in the article.


I am a Dutch citizen living in Thailand, and we have 3 children of which one I am the father.

In The Netherlands, private education is considered for rich people only and few people in The Netherlands are able to afford private education. When I got older I started to look at things a little bit differently. The strange thing is, here in Thailand, it seems to be normal for kids to go to private schools, and this is a developing country! Something does not make sense, right? I struggled with this.

I first got confronted with education in Vietnam where a young boy I knew was in a public school and got hit by the teacher. I was shocked and I was so mad that I asked the police to come to my house and explain to me if this is acceptable or not and if anything can be done about this. This already shows that you are in a different culture, because you do not just call the police to your house in a normal country I think, but this is what happened. What can I say...

I now know that it is still common practice for teachers to correct kids in the class; with a ruler.... In Vietnam I was told that this was not legal, but that the kid would suffer in school if I resisted to the teachers doing this. This was in a public school.

Back to Thailand. Because of my experience in Vietnam, I started to look differently at education. I also saw my wife's children in public school, and I was not impressed. A lot of time is spend on teaching things that are not important I think. I mean how much time do you need to spend daily about the king, the fatherland, and the national anthem? I also saw with her kids that 'bribes' have to be paid for additional lessons so that they learn enough to pass the exam. It is my impression, but I fail to back this up with evidence, that they deliberately do not teach certain lessons at school to force the kids to take additional lessons, hence creating additional income.

After my son was born we started to talk about school for him as well. We have had to move a few times and had trouble with schools, which results in our son having been at 4 different schools in 3 years, and that is of course not good. I got the impression one time that he was hit by the teacher. My son was scared to go to school and only wanted to go if one teacher was not there. I spoke to the management, and explained very carefully that I was concerned, and that I expect them to not hit my child. I did not accuse them, but I made it very clear I was concerned about that. I got the impression that they acted on that, but that is more a feeling. But this was also a private school. We later moved him to an other school. Also a private school. He loves this place. He is looking forward every day to go to school and almost always comes back a happy boy. However, he did tell me that the teacher hits the kids. When I asked him if they hit him, he simply sad; No daddy, I'm a good boy. So I need to keep an eye on that.

But what also puzzles me is the cost of private schools. Yes sure, it would not be fair to compare Thailand with the Netherlands. But the difference is obvious and big. In the Netherlands it costs some serious money to send you kids to school. But here in Thailand it appears as if most parent put their kids in private schools. The reality is slightly different I know, but with 0.3% of the population in the Netherlands getting private education vs. 20-30% in Thailand, there is obviously something going on here. Education is cheap here. It is basically free for public schooling, but you still need to buy books and uniforms I think. Whatever the costs are, he is now in a private school and this costs about 100USD/months. I have recently struggled a lot and I even found the teacher giving us clothes for our son when we needed some help.

I am very curious as to your thoughts. Costs vs. quality of education. But also how acceptable this is in your home country. I understand most of us are westerners here, but if any of you live or have lived in developing countries, please respond. And if you live in the west and have gotten private education, please let us know as well your experience. Do you think it was worth it? And not just the money. Especially in the west many private schools also require you to live there internally. This has a huge impact on the development of the kids because they are separated from their parents. And the costs as well.

I struggle to form an opinion. Just genuinely looking forward to ideas, thoughts, and considerations.

Joey
 
I would love to ban private school entirely. You can't have a true meritocracy if from birth the children of wealthy people receive better instruction than everyone else and poor kids are excluded entirely from their social circle. If rich kids had to attend public school it would give their parents a greater interest in ensuring that those schools are appropriately funded and staffed.

But I know it's a pipe dream, especially with this SCOTUS. And probably impractical. Rich people will always find ways to rig the system, whether it be moving to insular suburbs where they can have their own "public" schools, or paying for outside private tutors and test prep.
 
No vouchers. Republicans use those to destroy public education. If the rich want to send their kids to exclusive schools, they're gonna do that anyway, and they can pay for it themselves.
 
Don't tempt me.

Well he's a good role model for you. The khmer rouge imposed the most pure and uncompromising version of marxism ever attempted.

No vouchers. Republicans use those to destroy public education. If the rich want to send their kids to exclusive schools, they're gonna do that anyway, and they can pay for it themselves.

Opposing vouchers is telling poor parents, "tough shit - your kid’s stuck". Vouchers don’t hurt public schools, they threaten the monopoly. That’s why parents love them and teacher's unions hate them.
 
My son did private preK and it was awful. His disability was much more prevalent then and they were not prepared to accommodate him.

Did public preK until Covid.

During Covid years (2020-2021 school year) we homeschooled and engaged a private tutor.

After Covid, he’s been in a private school for K-3 and the tuition is around 20K annually. It’s a pretty exclusive school.

He’s flourishing there.

The local public elementary school system is very highly rated - many of our friends kids go there. I’m also personal friends with about 1/2 the school board. I just don’t want to deal with the drama of the Klanned Karenhood and politics of public school and worrying about my kid’s school and funding, politics, etc 🤷‍♀️

For high school, my son will likely go to public. He - in fact - wants to go to the public tech school because they have an engineering program and currently, he wants to be an engineer.

The quality of education - be it public or
private - depends on how actively involved parents are in their children’s education. And being involved doesn’t mean just bitching and complaining about school rules, etc. it means hands on involvement and attention to what they are learning and assisting them.

My son struggles with reading - so all summer, he attends private reading tutoring to help catch him up.
 
Well he's a good role model for you. The khmer rouge imposed the most pure and uncompromising version of marxism ever attempted.



Opposing vouchers is telling poor parents, "tough shit - your kid’s stuck". Vouchers don’t hurt public schools, they threaten the monopoly. That’s why parents love them and teacher's unions hate them.

Voucher amounts alone typically don’t cover the full cost(s) of a private school education, thus they don’t really offer the advertised ‘alternative’ for parents who are financially unable to cover the difference.
 
Well he's a good role model for you. The khmer rouge imposed the most pure and uncompromising version of marxism ever attempted.



Opposing vouchers is telling poor parents, "tough shit - your kid’s stuck". Vouchers don’t hurt public schools, they threaten the monopoly. That’s why parents love them and teacher's unions hate them.
Save it for the tourists. Turn off the faux for three years if you want any chance of escaping from it.
 
Voucher amounts alone typically don’t cover the full cost(s) of a private school education, thus they don’t really offer the advertised ‘alternative’ for parents who are financially unable to cover the difference.

That’s like saying food stamps are useless because they don’t cover the cost of steak. Vouchers don’t have to pay 100% of private tuition to give parents more options. They make alternatives more accessible, especially for lower-income families who otherwise wouldn’t have any choice at all. And many private schools, especially religious ones, cost less than public school per pupil.
 
I went to private schools and will likely privately educate my daughter.
 
Education is certainly a mixed bag. You certainly sound both concerned and confused. I don't have a problem with public or private as far as what you choose for you kids, that's pretty much a matter of preference and for many finances as well. My experience is there are plenty of good schools in the U.S. both private and public. Seems to differ by area though and even within a state as local school boards have a lot of control over how the school is run. Schools are like companies, it starts at the top. Success is accelerated if the school is set up on strong educational, behavioural, and in my opinion moral principal. There are different calibers of schools and different calibers of teachers. The teachers are key in any school as they are the ones who have the minute by minute contact with your kids and the ones imparting both information and setting the tone for behavior and social interaction. I'm only going to mention parental guidance a little because it's certainly key and if parents are not extremely involved in the childrens schooling and develoment then the battle is much harder for most kids.
Parents need to let kids know how important an education is and show it by staying tuned in to what is going on at school and in their childs daily lives.
I've seen the school systems in several states, both public and private and as I said, good and bad in both. You have the power to place you child in the best environment for their learning and should do so if at all possible. However, I've seen great teachers in shitty schools and shitty teachers in great schools, unfortunately the same, sadly, goes for students. Not all kids come to school with education on their mind, thats obstacle #1.
Remember that for the most part teachers are underpaid, overworked and constantly blamed for your childs failures. Usually teachers are not the problem. When they are the good schools take actions to remedy the problems, the bad schools cover it up if they can. The teachers unions are also a mixed bag. Sometimes doing great things for the teachers and the kids, sometimes only concentrating on taking care of the teachers but remember it's the teachers union.
I've seen great students, great kids come out of some struggling schools and seen some not very good students come out of great schools. If it were up to me every school would pay more, reward teacher excellence, back up a strong discipline system, (not with hitting kids), and require kids to participate in at least one extracurricular activity that is at least a semester long. Kids find purpose, friends, goals, and sometimes find their future from these groups be it athletics, band, drama, art, chess club, 4H, or whatever.
So your journey through the educational system is not always easy but stay engaged with your child and the child's school. Keep in touch with teachers, administrators, coaches, and anyone who is involved with your kid. Also remember they are just people, not gods, and most are doing their best but sometimes our best isn't quite enough. In the end you child determines his/her own outcome. With help and guidance and engagement you can help them navigate their educational years. Don't just leave it on the doorstep of the school when you drop them off and make sure you know the problem before you accuse teachers of being the problem.
Good luck, God bless.
 
That’s like saying food stamps are useless because they don’t cover the cost of steak. Vouchers don’t have to pay 100% of private tuition to give parents more options. They make alternatives more accessible, especially for lower-income families who otherwise wouldn’t have any choice at all. And many private schools, especially religious ones, cost less than public school per pupil.
I think vouchers can be good for kids, if they are in a bad school. The problem with vouchers is they rob the public education system of badly needed money. I realize many families cannot afford private school tuition but I've seen parents make some huge sacrifices to get their kids into the right schools. Drive a 33 year old vehicle, eat lots of peanut butter and jelly, visit the Goodwill Store for clothing, and of course work an extra job.
I think vouchers can hurt as much as help in the overall system. Politicians campaign on school choice but that doesn't have to mean vouchers, just letting parents move children to a nearby district that offers more. Of course that presents the problem of transportation. Maybe providing some funding for those who fall below some economic baseline. The opinions will differ on Public/Private and how to best finance the two. I think teachers should be paid much more and local districts need to raise taxes to do so. President Barrack OBama wrote in his book, Audacity of Hope, that every school teacher ought to be making $100,000 per year at the height of their careers. That was 2005, so now it would be more. I think he's correct, and I rarely agreed with him on much of anything.
Remember this, free public schools are a blessing and a gift that can certainly determine a child's future success. Not taking the utmost advantage is morally criminal. There are also scholarships and grants in our schools and in our colleges. BTW, I'm not a believer that everyone needs a college education, I'm big on trade schools and making a career out of what you love.
Good luck.
 
Opposing vouchers is telling poor parents, "tough shit - your kid’s stuck". Vouchers don’t hurt public schools, they threaten the monopoly. That’s why parents love them and teacher's unions hate them.
Sorry, but no. “Vouchers” take money away from public schools - which are often already chronically underfunded. Why should taxpayer dollars ever be used for private schools?
 
No vouchers. Republicans use those to destroy public education. If the rich want to send their kids to exclusive schools, they're gonna do that anyway, and they can pay for it themselves.
Public schools are not destroyed by vouchers. Certainly they take badly need funding out of public schools, but public schools have hurt themselves with poor policy, lack of discipline, unmotivated adn poorly trained teachers, and not addressing the #1 goal, learning. I'm an old guy. I grew up with freinds that went to private schools, dated a few girls from private schools, I alway attended public. Back in those days private was usually for religious reasons, lots of Catholic schools, or because mom or dad went to private schools and ultimately white flight during desegregation. Schools harm themselves, parents also often fail to provide guidance and don't stay engaged with the student and the school.
The problems are many, the solution is not always about more money.
 
Sorry, but no. “Vouchers” take money away from public schools - which are often already chronically underfunded. Why should taxpayer dollars ever be used for private schools?
Public schools are financed with tax dollars and whether you use the public system or not, your dollars should stay in the public schools just as you don't get to withdrawn money to pay to pave your own road, it's funding the public good. That said, I'm not opposed to some compromise for underprivileged kids, but the problem is not always the school. Too many kids aren't doing their part.
 
That’s like saying food stamps are useless because they don’t cover the cost of steak. Vouchers don’t have to pay 100% of private tuition to give parents more options. They make alternatives more accessible, especially for lower-income families who otherwise wouldn’t have any choice at all. And many private schools, especially religious ones, cost less than public school per pupil.

Your use of “food stamps” (SNAP) as the analogy to “K-12 vouchers” is interesting, since SNAP subsidies aren’t given to anyone except “the poor”, in fact the amount of SNAP benefits varies based on need. Does it make any sense to give those more able to afford private school costs the same voucher (subsidy) amount as those less able to afford those costs?
 
Public schools are not destroyed by vouchers. Certainly they take badly need funding out of public schools, but public schools have hurt themselves with poor policy, lack of discipline, unmotivated adn poorly trained teachers, and not addressing the #1 goal, learning. I'm an old guy. I grew up with freinds that went to private schools, dated a few girls from private schools, I alway attended public. Back in those days private was usually for religious reasons, lots of Catholic schools, or because mom or dad went to private schools and ultimately white flight during desegregation. Schools harm themselves, parents also often fail to provide guidance and don't stay engaged with the student and the school.
The problems are many, the solution is not always about more money.
A central goal of vouchers is to weaken and destroy public schools.
 
We need to concentrate on fixing the public schools, although there are plenty of good ones. Money is not always the answer as I've seen it wasted on what's commonly called, Professional Development but was really a 3-5 day vacation away from the classroom or in some nice city where you get housed and fed while attending a few "educational" development classes. Then party, party, party. When the hotel is $300 and night and the buffet breakfast is $30, and you take a guided tour of the city, well I'm not sure that helps the school a lot.
At the same time parents need to actively be engaged and students need to be even more engaged. Ever wonder why Johnny or Suzy never bring home a book?
 
A central goal of vouchers is to weaken and destroy public schools.
That's not the intent of everyone. Yes, it is the intent of some with political aspirations. The public school system is a great thing. We haven't taken good care of it. Some of the biggest problems rest with poor parenting and completely unmotivated kids. No, it's not the teachers fault that you kid doesn't want to be there, it's yours. Motivation is one of the hardest things for teachers to achieve when they are the only one trying.
The left screams about destroying the schools with vouchers but doesn't seem to really want to get to the core problems. Politics as George Washington warned will ruin a lot of good things. One being this country, another the schools.
 
I would love to ban private school entirely. You can't have a true meritocracy if from birth the children of wealthy people receive better instruction than everyone else and poor kids are excluded entirely from their social circle. If rich kids had to attend public school it would give their parents a greater interest in ensuring that those schools are appropriately funded and staffed.

But I know it's a pipe dream, especially with this SCOTUS. And probably impractical. Rich people will always find ways to rig the system, whether it be moving to insular suburbs where they can have their own "public" schools, or paying for outside private tutors and test prep.
Taking advantage of having financial means to better your family is not "rigging the system". Not everyone with money puts their kids in private schools and many move to the burbs because it's generally safer, and yes often the schools are better performing. Fix the inner cities, fix the schools, and you will see everyone lifted. Raise the bridge, don't lower the water.
 
That's not the intent of everyone. Yes, it is the intent of some with political aspirations. The public school system is a great thing. We haven't taken good care of it. Some of the biggest problems rest with poor parenting and completely unmotivated kids. No, it's not the teachers fault that you kid doesn't want to be there, it's yours. Motivation is one of the hardest things for teachers to achieve when they are the only one trying.
The left screams about destroying the schools with vouchers but doesn't seem to really want to get to the core problems. Politics as George Washington warned will ruin a lot of good things. One being this country, another the schools.
I'm not screaming. I'm pointing out that destroying public schools using vouchers is a central goal of Republicans. That's not an opinion.
 
Are you going to ban homeschooling too? Why don't you just take the kids away from their parents by force the way pol pot did so the state has total control.
The Spartans took kids at about 7 yrs of age and started their training. They lived in barracks and trained to be warriors.
Boys' Education:
  • The Agoge: Spartan boys entered the Agoge at age 7. This rigorous, state-sponsored training program aimed to make them disciplined soldiers.
  • Military Training: The Agoge focused on physical training, obedience, and military skills such as warfare, stealth, hunting, and athletics.
  • Reading and Writing: Reading and writing were part of the curriculum, but less emphasized than military and survival skills.
  • Physical Hardship: Boys endured hardship to toughen them up, including underfeeding and minimal clothing.
  • Loyalty: The Agoge aimed to foster loyalty to Sparta above all else.
Girls' Education:
  • Physical Training: Spartan girls participated in physical training and sports, including running, wrestling, and throwing the javelin and discus.
  • Training Purpose: This training was meant to make them strong and healthy, preparing them to bear strong offspring who would become Spartan warriors.
  • Basic Education: Spartan girls received education in subjects such as reading, writing, and music.
  • No Combat Training: Unlike boys, Spartan girls were not trained for combat.
The Spartan education system, the Agoge, aimed to produce strong, disciplined individuals dedicated to the state and its military power. While the methods were harsh by today's standards, they were effective in creating a highly trained and disciplined society.
 
I'm not screaming. I'm pointing out that destroying public schools using vouchers is a central goal of Republicans. That's not an opinion.
Did I say you were screaming?
It's not totally opinion as the use of vouchers is popular with some republicans, but not all by any means. It's also true that vouchers are popular among some democrats as well both those who send their kids to private schools and some underprivileged who would like to do so.
You are exaggerating somewhat. Our schools are a mixed bag of good and bad and each local district needs to concentrate on the primary function, getting kids and education. We've gone off the rails with social agenda's that create far more problems than they solve. The old 3 R's seem to be abandoned in many cases as the reason our kids are at school.
 
Did I say you were screaming?
It's not totally opinion as the use of vouchers is popular with some republicans, but not all by any means. It's also true that vouchers are popular among some democrats as well both those who send their kids to private schools and some underprivileged who would like to do so.
You are exaggerating somewhat. Our schools are a mixed bag of good and bad and each local district needs to concentrate on the primary function, getting kids and education. We've gone off the rails with social agenda's that create far more problems than they solve. The old 3 R's seem to be abandoned in many cases as the reason our kids are at school.
I'm fine with improving public education. I'm not convinced at all that this is a Republican goal.
 
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