Hillary Clinton pledges half a billion solar panels for US if she wins office

[Montecresto]

Lol !!

The " educated foreword " people ? You sound like a MSNBC promo.

More like the useful idiots and the blind ideologues who equate opinions and propaganda to " evidence " and " progress.".

Yea, its the " intelligent " thing to do to allow the people who have no technical prowess whatsoever, the people whose knowledge of power generation stops at their wall receptacles to shape the Nations energy policy.

Sorry, thats what happened in Germany. They let the idiot Green energy agenda dictate their energy policy.

Now their citizens are paying for it.

If Solar had any potential it would have been evolved as a comparable alternative to fossil fuel derived power decades ago.

The photovoltaic cell was patented in 1908, and it still takes massive subsidies to keep renewables afloat.

Real technology doesn't need constant and perpetual Federal and consumer subsidies to exist.

For example, we can create microprocessors that are the size of a Saltine cracker that have tens of millions of complex microscopic circuits etched into them.

Those processors can process binary data up to 256 bits wide at 3.5 Ghz accurately for years on end before failing.

That technology derived out of the vacuum tubes of the 40s and 50s and evolved into something thats almost incomprehensible.

It doesn't take massive Federal grants or subsidies to keep that technology going, because its a legitimate and viable concept and its market driven.

Solar would have taken off decades ago if it had any potential.

You can't suck on that straw forever without finding alternatives, a fact you have no answer for. That's fine, you apparently make a living on them, know they'll outlast your usefulness and don't care. But there are people born every day that will, and humanity will provide an alternative to this dirty, finite source that we all depend on in varying degrees!

 

[Fenton]

I suggest you read the references, then comment.

No I read your silly Think Progress links and generating 78 percent of your power from " Renewables " isn't the least bit impressive when your only able to do it for a few hours.

Its definitely not worth the huge investment the German people have made into building solar power and wind Farms.

 

[Fenton]

You can't suck on that straw forever without finding alternatives, a fact you have no answer for. That's fine, you apparently make a living on them, know they'll outlast your usefulness and don't care. But there are people born every day that will, and humanity will provide an alternative to this dirty, finite source that we all depend on in varying degrees!

You mean Nuclear ? That alternative ? Thats a answer.... that you seem intent on ignoring for some reason.

Hell, I would bet they get ITER generating net power before Solar is a viable alternative to fossil fuels.

 

[Gimmesometruth]

Lol !!

The " educated foreword " people ? You sound like a MSNBC promo.

More like the useful idiots and the blind ideologues who equate opinions and propaganda to " evidence " and " progress.".

Yea, its the " intelligent " thing to do to allow the people who have no technical prowess whatsoever, the people whose knowledge of power generation stops at their wall receptacles to shape the Nations energy policy.

Sorry, thats what happened in Germany. They let the idiot Green energy agenda dictate their energy policy.

Now their citizens are paying for it.

If Solar had any potential it would have been evolved as a comparable alternative to fossil fuel derived power decades ago.

The photovoltaic cell was patented in 1908, and it still takes massive subsidies to keep renewables afloat.

Real technology doesn't need constant and perpetual Federal and consumer subsidies to exist.

For example, we can create microprocessors that are the size of a Saltine cracker that have tens of millions of complex microscopic circuits etched into them.

Those processors can process binary data up to 256 bits wide at 3.5 Ghz accurately for years on end before failing.

That technology derived out of the vacuum tubes of the 40s and 50s and evolved into something thats almost incomprehensible.

It doesn't take massive Federal grants or subsidies to keep that technology going, because its a legitimate and viable concept and its market driven.

Solar would have taken off decades ago if it had any potential.

FFS Fenton, we already crushed your contention that the development of IC chips was not the product of govt funding, and govt subsidies were essential for US oil.....and we STILL subsidize oil. The same gawd damn tech to create IC's is used to create PV's, and the efficiency of PV cells has dramatically jumped in the last 2 decades while the cost/kwh has plummeted. Your whole world view is so locked into this Texas/Petro/Banking mindset that it makes me believe you are on someones payroll, but as Kobie says....they are not getting their monies worth.

 

[Threegoofs]

No I read your silly Think Progress links and generating 78 percent of your power from " Renewables " isn't the least bit impressive when your only able to do it for a few hours.

Its definitely not worth the huge investment the German people have made into building solar power and wind Farms.

Its actually quite impressive if you think about it, which apparently you havent.

Again, over a quarter of Germany's energy comes from renewables (this was in the article that you didnt read, and the point I was making in the post, which you didnt get because you were peeing your pants over trying to claim that getting 3/4 of energy from renewables at peak was somehow.... misleading) and thats the primary point.

 

[Fenton]

FFS Fenton, we already crushed your contention that the development of IC chips was not the product of govt funding, and govt subsidies were essential for US oil.....and we STILL subsidize oil. The same gawd damn tech to create IC's is used to create PV's, and the efficiency of PV cells has dramatically jumped in the last 2 decades while the cost/kwh has plummeted. Your whole world view is so locked into this Texas/Petro/Banking mindset that it makes me believe you are on someones payroll, but as Kobie says....they are not getting their monies worth.

Who Invented the IC? | Computer History Museum

Bell Labs and Jack Kirby among others are responsiblebfor the invention and development of the IC.

The Free market did the rest.

And PV has been around allot LONGER than Integrated circuits, for some reason ICs have evolved and Solar is still dependant on massive subsidies.

And if PV are so " efficient ", then why is Germany bailing on Solar power and building new lignite plants ?

Apparently these " dramatic " jumps in efficiencies still mean that Solar is a substandard technology.

 

[Fenton]

Its actually quite impressive if you think about it, which apparently you havent.

Again, over a quarter of Germany's energy comes from renewables (this was in the article that you didnt read, and the point I was making in the post, which you didnt get because you were peeing your pants over trying to claim that getting 3/4 of energy from renewables at peak was somehow.... misleading) and thats the primary point.

Its impressive that a bunch of zealots managed to hi-jack Germany's energy policy and scammed a Nation of people who are known for their innovation.

 

[Threegoofs]

Its impressive that a bunch of zealots managed to hi-jack Germany's energy policy and scammed a Nation of people who are known for their innovation.

Its actually quite impressive if you think about it, which apparently you havent.

 

[Gimmesometruth]

Who Invented the IC? | Computer History Museum

Bell Labs and Jack Kirby among others are responsiblebfor the invention and development of the IC.

we already went over this, you have forgotten:
http://www.debatepolitics.com/gover...r-play-win-post1064787697.html#post1064787697

The Free market did the rest.

You still have not enlightened me on yer lern'n Capitalization.

And PV has been around allot LONGER than Integrated circuits, for some reason ICs have evolved and Solar is still dependant on massive subsidies.

Uh, PV's have dramatically "evolved", oil, gas and coal are still massively subsidized not only from a supply standpoint, but from externalities too.

And if PV are so " efficient ", then why is Germany bailing on Solar power and building new lignite plants ? Apparently these " dramatic " jumps in efficiencies still mean that Solar is a substandard technology.

I have a good idea why you continue to spread misinformation, how much are you paid by Texas oil interests to sit here on this forum everyday, for hours on end?

 

[Fenton]

Its actually quite impressive if you think about it, which apparently you havent.

Getting ITER producing net power, that would be impressive

Quantum processing....that would be impressive.

True Holographic imaging....that would be impressive.

Blowing billions of the Germa citizens hard earned money on a publicity stunt ? Not impressive

 

[Fenton]

we already went over this, you have forgotten:
http://www.debatepolitics.com/gover...r-play-win-post1064787697.html#post1064787697

You still have not enlightened me on yer lern'n Capitalization.

Uh, PV's have dramatically "evolved", oil, gas and coal are still massively subsidized not only from a supply standpoint, but from externalities too.

I have a good idea why you continue to spread misinformation, how much are you paid by Texas oil interests to sit here on this forum everyday, for hours on end?

Oil and Gas and Coal are subsidized ?

Then why is Germany switching over to brown coal power plants ? Why are they backing away from Solar investment ?

 

[Montecresto]

Oil and Gas and Coal are subsidized ?

Then why is Germany switching over to brown coal power plants ? Why are they backing away from Solar investment ?

Solar energy on the rise!

Global investment in solar energy is on the rise. In 2014, sales of solar panels increased by 20 percent. Although German solar producers are struggling with Asian competitors, they remain optimistic.

As the cost of solar energy production continues to fall, the market is experiencing something of a boom. In many parts of the world, it has become cheaper to produce solar power than diesel oil, gas, coal or nuclear energy.

Solar energy on the rise | Environment | DW.COM | 19.01.2015

 

[Montecresto]

You mean Nuclear ? That alternative ? Thats a answer.... that you seem intent on ignoring for some reason.

Hell, I would bet they get ITER generating net power before Solar is a viable alternative to fossil fuels.

Nuclear power is a reluctant alternative to fossil, yes. But it has inherent risks. You continue to ignore that the smart people working on the problem, yeah, it's a problem that must be solved, see energy future as a wheel with spokes. Tidal, hydro, wind, solar etc are spokes. No one energy source could or should be exclusive for a host of reasons.

 

[Gimmesometruth]

Oil and Gas and Coal are subsidized ?

Yes, they are, both directly and via external costs.....but your handlers haven't given you the talking points to counter this, so like a bad lawyer, you ask a question you don't know the answer to.....and it gets worse since you have been informed on this point previously.

Then why is Germany switching over to brown coal power plants ? Why are they backing away from Solar investment ?

 

[natsb]

What's dishonest about using fossil fuels (which there are no present alternatives for in areas like chain saws and wood splitters) while decrying them and advocating an alternative?????? And no, my propane is auxiliary to my solar system.

Nope. Auxiliary is the one we could get along without if given the choice.

Dishonest would be the suggestion that you are not one of the "fossil dependent internet dude" you decry.

 

[natsb]

Sure, PV, which keeps dropping in price as production is increased, by 2025 it will be cheaper than NG with much lower externalities.

Sorry, I don't know what you mean by PV.

So, there are no cheap renewables now. Just a promise that some day...

 

[Threegoofs]

Oil and Gas and Coal are subsidized ?

Then why is Germany switching over to brown coal power plants ? Why are they backing away from Solar investment ?

Again, maybe reading the references may help.

 

[Montecresto]

Nope. Auxiliary is the one we could get along without if given the choice.

Dishonest would be the suggestion that you are not one of the "fossil dependent internet dude" you decry.

I could get along without both. Fossil dependent was a reference to his being employed in the industry. Humanity got along without the use of fossil fuels for ever, until the last century or so. Now, the dependence is damaging the planet. Alternatives must, and will btw, be developed. But even those working on the development of alternatives are no doubt using fossils.

 

[natsb]

No. Germany gets 28% of its power from renewables. Overall. Dont know where you get your figures.... I'm guessing you just made them up, eh?

They are not dismantling their solar program due to failure, they are just reducing subsidies due to the demand since the subsidies are generous.

Actually, I was using your numbers. If they are made up, I am guilty. There you go with the cherry picking again. In your link, you will find that the 28.5 number, which is never backed up by data, is derived from a two quarter period in one year; 2014. Just like the 78% number, it does not come close to representing a constant.

So without the Government teat, the solar program is not feasible. Sounds like failure to me. You have displayed much better spin skills than that. We'll call that a mulligan. Could you please try again?

 

[Montecresto]

Sorry, I don't know what you mean by PV.

So, there are no cheap renewables now. Just a promise that some day...

You don't know what PV is and your in this discussion!!!!!?????

 

[earthworm]

Solar energy on the rise!

Global investment in solar energy is on the rise. In 2014, sales of solar panels increased by 20 percent. Although German solar producers are struggling with Asian competitors, they remain optimistic.

As the cost of solar energy production continues to fall, the market is experiencing something of a boom. In many parts of the world, it has become cheaper to produce solar power than diesel oil, gas, coal or nuclear energy.

Solar energy on the rise | Environment | DW.COM | 19.01.2015

Good to read some truth .. the conservatives are so damned negative ..of courses, solar power cannot be everywhere, nor can it be 100%, even 50% , BUT, it is economically feasible !

 

[natsb]

You don't know what PV is and your in this discussion!!!!!?????

I might. I don't know what the letters PV are referencing. It looks like you find honesty shocking.

 

[Fenton]

Solar energy on the rise!

Global investment in solar energy is on the rise. In 2014, sales of solar panels increased by 20 percent. Although German solar producers are struggling with Asian competitors, they remain optimistic.

As the cost of solar energy production continues to fall, the market is experiencing something of a boom. In many parts of the world, it has become cheaper to produce solar power than diesel oil, gas, coal or nuclear energy.

Solar energy on the rise | Environment | DW.COM | 19.01.2015

In many parts of the world ?

What parts ? Not here. Not in Germany, not in any developed Nation that depends on reliable and continuous power.

Where ?

 

[Fenton]

Good to read some truth .. the conservatives are so damned negative ..of courses, solar power cannot be everywhere, nor can it be 100%, even 50% , BUT, it is economically feasible !

Not negative, just honesty and objective.

What " parts " of the world is power from Solar cheaper to obtain than power from Fossil fuels .

 

[Montecresto]

In many parts of the world ?

What parts ? Not here. Not in Germany, not in any developed Nation that depends on reliable and continuous power.

Where ?

No one expected you to open a link and educate yourself.