Guns must be protected at all costs- why?

[braindrain]

Do you think the Afghan people are free because they scared us away with their logos? LOL. We just left because we were finished doing what we needed to do there.

If we had a reason, and were not worried about international reputation, it would actually be pretty easy to exterminate them all- their little guns notwithstanding.

Who said anything about logos. Oh that right that’s just more nonsense you are making. But tell me is your experience in Afghanistan as vast as your experience in self defense and firearms use.

Lol. No we did not finish doing what we needed to. That is just idiotic.

And how would we exterminate them all. Be specific. And what tactics could we use over their that the government would be able to use here in this country.

I notice that you keep ignoring all the issues I brought up with your supposed expert. Hmm wonder why that is.

 

[Toggle Almendro]

Guns have become the leading cause of death and injury in American kids. It has surpassed cancer.

The leading cause of murders is murderers. The tool used by the murderer is irrelevant.

 

[ataraxia]

Who said anything about logos.

Sorry, that was one of those Siri problems. What I meant to say was "Do you think the Afghan people are free because they scared us away with their toy guns?"

Oh that right that’s just more nonsense you are making. But tell me is your experience in Afghanistan as vast as your experience in self defense and firearms use.

Lol. No we did not finish doing what we needed to. That is just idiotic.

Our primary goal in Afghanistan was to get Bin Laden. Once there, we thought we could throw in some nation-building, but they clearly weren't interested. That's no reason to exterminate them all. But that's just because we didn't want to. Clearly our millitary has numerous resources to do that if absolutely necessary. AR15s are not a consideration. Not even a little bit, LOL.

And how would we exterminate them all. Be specific. And what tactics could we use over their that the government would be able to use here in this country.

None really. That's why it's good to have a democratic government with an extensive system of checks and balances. I promise you if government today really wants to get tyrannical on you, your AR15 is worthless. Just ask the folks at Waco.

 

[ataraxia]

I notice that you keep ignoring all the issues I brought up with your supposed expert. Hmm wonder why that is.

Which one? I have quoted law enforcement officers, sheriffs, military generals, trauma surgeons, emergency room doctors, forensic pathologists, coroners, and public health specialists.

 

[RF667799]

What in the world are you talking about? Do you even live in this country?

Guns have become the leading cause of death and injury in American kids. It has surpassed cancer.

Guns have become the top injury-related cause of death for U.S. kids

In 2020, more kids were killed by guns than motor vehicle crashes. for the first time in recent history

www.axios.com

Gun Violence: A Public Health Problem

Efforts to prevent firearm injuries and deaths warrant dedicated funding and federal and state support, just as it is for other public health crises.

www.apa.org

That's true of all potentially hazardous equipment. Are you really saying there should be no regulations on any hazardous equipment? We will just wait until someone uses them to hurt someone and then we will do something about it, right?


Banning you from nuclear arms them is a flagrant infringement on your right to arms. It's the first slippery step to taking away all your arms. Right?

None of the anti gun zealots have ever been able to show that guns cause murders.

So what regulations should be on baseball bats? Should we require a license to own one? A psychological assessment? Waiting period? Limit the quantity to be possessed? Nobody under 21 allowed to purchase?

Let's take a look at the law that bans me from possessing nuclear arms.

 

[ataraxia]

The leading cause of murders is murderers. The tool used by the murderer is irrelevant.

So are you saying you want all regulations on all hazardous equipment lifted because the tools don't matter, only the people?

 

[ataraxia]

None of the anti gun zealots have ever been able to show that guns cause murders.

So what regulations should be on baseball bats?

"Sports equipment that can be used as a bludgeon (such as bats and clubs) is prohibited in the cabin of the plane and must be transported in your checked baggage."

Baseball Bats | Transportation Security Administration

Sports equipment that can be used as a bludgeon (such as bats and clubs) is prohibited in the cabin of the plane and must be transported in your checked baggage.

www.tsa.gov

 

[Toggle Almendro]

So are you saying you want all regulations on all hazardous equipment lifted because the tools don't matter, only the people?

No. Some tools are clearly a great danger and people should be prohibited from having them. Nuclear weapons for example.

But statistics are clear that gun availability has little impact on homicide rates. There is no justification for preventing people from having guns.

Everybody's Lying About the Link Between Gun Ownership and Homicide

Revealing how the media lies with graphs to further an anti-gun agenda.

hwfo.substack.com

 

[DebateChallenge]

So you think government should be able to tell Walmart they can’t put nuclear arms or chemical weapons on sale for the freedom loving, law abiding American public?

Walmart should be able to sell such weapons under the same circumstances that the police and military are able to use such weapons. Since neither the police or military can use chemical weapons Im fine with Walmart not being able to sell them. As for nuclear weapons, the police can't use those either and even the military can only use them under certain circumstances, the circumstances under which the military can use them should be the same circumstances in which Walmart should be allowed to sell them

 

[DebateChallenge]

Russia Per-Capita GDP: $12,172
South Africa Per-Capita GDP: $6,994

United States Per-Capita GDP: $69,285

It's not even a comparison.

So you're saying that how well developed a country is is based entirely on GDP.

 

[RF667799]

"Sports equipment that can be used as a bludgeon (such as bats and clubs) is prohibited in the cabin of the plane and must be transported in your checked baggage."

Baseball Bats | Transportation Security Administration

Sports equipment that can be used as a bludgeon (such as bats and clubs) is prohibited in the cabin of the plane and must be transported in your checked baggage.

www.tsa.gov

That's it? That's the only regulation you support? Do you think children should be allowed to use these bludgeons unsupervised? Should they be allowed to carry them in schools?

 

[ataraxia]

No. Some tools are clearly a great danger and people should be prohibited from having them. Nuclear weapons for example.

But statistics are clear that gun availability has little impact on homicide rates. There is no justification for preventing people from having guns.

Everybody's Lying About the Link Between Gun Ownership and Homicide

Revealing how the media lies with graphs to further an anti-gun agenda.

hwfo.substack.com

This is completely false information.

Effect of Gun Availability on Violent Crime Patterns | Office of Justice Programs

www.ojp.gov

 

[ataraxia]

That's it? That's the only regulation you support? Do you think children should be allowed to use these bludgeons unsupervised? Should they be allowed to carry them in schools?

Different hazardous equipment require different regulations. You know that, I am sure. I think you are just trying hard to be difficult. Like I said, you can be free to have firearms without rear view mirrors and turn signals on them. I'm OK with that. See how much I love freedom?

 

[jaeger19]

Why do you as a law abiding citizen have to pay licensing costs to drive?

Because as a citizen you have some obligations to public safety. There are coats and obligations to living in civil society.

Exactly. Registration of vehicles is simply a tax scheme.
As far as driving?
I can drive on my own property or others with permission without a license.

 

[ataraxia]

Walmart should be able to sell such weapons under the same circumstances that the police and military are able to use such weapons.

The only reason police have had to get these weapons is because the civilians have them more nowadays. If you make full autos available to the public, then the police are going to have to have that too. The point is to de-escalate the level of weaponry both sides have, not increase them. There is no end to that crazy arms race.

Countries Where Police Do Not Carry Guns

There are in 18 nations and one US territory that maintain a police force of patrolling officers who do not carry firearms. Learn about them in this article.

www.worldatlas.com

Now with that being said, for law enforcement to truly be able to do its job, they always need to have a little better weapons than the public. Otherwise, they can't do their job: enforce the law. They become just one more armed gang competing with and trying to impose its freedom on others.

 

[ataraxia]

Exactly. Registration of vehicles is simply a tax scheme.
As far as driving?
I can drive on my own property or others with permission without a license.

This may come as a revelation to you, but there are countless regulations on the manufacture, sales, and use of your vehicle, as well as all other potentially hazardous equipment. Why don't you go fight that tyranny first?

 

[Toggle Almendro]

This is completely false information.

No it isn't.

All of his data is accurately cited.

 

[RF667799]

This is completely false information.

Effect of Gun Availability on Violent Crime Patterns | Office of Justice Programs

www.ojp.gov

That study concluded over 40 years ago, that if those disposed to criminal violence were not allowed to have guns, criminal violence would be less severe. Yet, you guys are still droning on and on about taking guns away from those not disposed to criminal violence.

Guns give assailants the power to succeed in killing or robbing relatively invulnerable victims who would have a good chance of fending off attack with a less lethal weapon. Thus, if potential killers were deprived of guns, the criminal homicide rate would be reduced, particularly for the least vulnerable types of victims (law enforcement officers, people with bodyguards, youthful men, etc.)

Interesting that they assume the more vulnerable wouldn't have their chances increased. They would still be vulnerable to murder.

 

[RF667799]

Different hazardous equipment require different regulations. You know that, I am sure. I think you are just trying hard to be difficult. Like I said, you can be free to have firearms without rear view mirrors and turn signals on them. I'm OK with that. See how much I love freedom?

Yes, and I am free to have motor vehicles without rear view mirrors and turn signals.

Interesting that you have shifted gears again, back to "Guns should be regulated differently than motor vehicles."

 

[DebateChallenge]

The only reason police have had to get these weapons is because the civilians have them more nowadays. If you make full autos available to the public, then the police are going to have to have that too. The point is to de-escalate the level of weaponry both sides have, not increase them. There is no end to that crazy arms race.

Police already do have access to full autos when you take into account special decisions such as SWAT.

Now with that being said, for law enforcement to truly be able to do its job, they always need to have a little better weapons than the public. Otherwise, they can't do their job: enforce the law. They become just one more armed gang competing with and trying to impose its freedom on others.

That's what happens when the police are able to have better weapons then the public. They become a gang able to impose the freedom of others. That's why the citizens should have access to the same weapons of the police and military. If you want to restrict the weapons citizens have access to, apply those same restrictions to the police and military.

 

[RF667799]

This may come as a revelation to you, but there are countless regulations on the manufacture, sales, and use of your vehicle, as well as all other potentially hazardous equipment. Why don't you go fight that tyranny first?

There are regulations on the manufacture, sale, and use of guns. How many times must you be told?

 

[RF667799]

Police already to have access to full autos when you take into account special decisions such as SWAT.

That's what happens when the police are able to have better weapons then the public. They become a gang able to impose the freedom of others. That's why the citizens should have access to the same weapons of the police and military. If you want to restrict the weapons citizens have access to, apply those same restrictions to the police and military.

Yeah, I thought it was funny when he claimed the government forces were nothing but another armed gang, like the most radical An-Cap that ever was.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

So you're saying that how well developed a country is is based entirely on GDP.

It's largely based on per-capita GDP yes. If you had 10% of your income, would be able to live the same lifestyle you can now?

 

[DebateChallenge]

Yeah, I thought it was funny when he claimed the government forces were nothing but another armed gang, like the most radical An-Cap that ever was.

That's what they become when they're allowed to be more heavily armed then the citizens, just like the Redcoats, they were an armed gang who pushed around the colonists.

 

[Eurotrash]

With respect:

That's the bottom line for the GOP and other gun proliferation proponents: Guns must be protected at all costs.

WHY? Why must guns be protected at all costs?

Because of all the money both Dems and Cons have poured into the NRA. It's a very powerful wedge issue. The powers that be cannot have the working folk peeking behind the curtain, where they would see what's really fracking important to the power brokers. And it ain't guns, abortions, or gender issues.