God created everything that exists

[ModernDiogenes]

Regarding faith, I'm pretty sure the sun will rise tomorrow but I still have reservations about that fact.

That the sun resides as the hub of our galaxy, the planets revolve around it, that the earth rotates on its axis and each part will face the sun in its turn as it does do us scientific law being proved daily.

That you have doubt us not germane to it.

What the “nature” of what was transpiring moments before something came out of nothing that begat all the above us not a matter of scientific law. We can’t explain it.

As it stands it is open to all human imagination and conjecture has to offer. Including the presence of a higher power capable of making something come out if nothing. What might be true of it is TBD.

 

[JacksinPA]

That the sun resides as the hub of our galaxy, the planets revolve around it, that the earth rotates on its axis and each part will face the sun in its turn as it does do us scientific law being proved daily.

That you have doubt us not germane to it.

What the “nature” of what was transpiring moments before something came out of nothing that begat all the above us not a matter of scientific law. We can’t explain it.

As it stands it is open to all human imagination and conjecture has to offer. Including the presence of a higher power capable of making something come out if nothing. What might be true of it is TBD.

Making things out of nothing? I doubt that.

 

[ModernDiogenes]

Making things out of nothing? I doubt that.

That one counts it as such, unless that one can explain how it’s not the case and what happened instead, is just someone else expressing their belief. Not fact.

Which was my whole bloody initial point!.

 

[JacksinPA]

That one counts it as such, unless that one can explain how it’s not the case and what happened instead, is just someone else expressing their belief. Not fact.

Which was my whole bloody initial point!.

It's not my job to prove that your lies are false. Your job seems to be preaching lies that you cannot prove.

 

[watsup]

Please grasp the concept I’m putting forth. I’m NOT advocating “religion” over “science”. (In fact, if anything, I am suggesting that if one believes in science based only on faith as is the situation when one tries to explain pre-“Big Bang” goings on using natural law to define it, then science is religion at that point.)

I’m stating that as things exist today, at the point you are trying to explain what took place pre-”‘Big Bang”, it’s not just the Universe receding to its point of origin. It’s science and religion as well, back to their common root, where neither has the answer and there intrinsic value, or lack of it, is identical.

Again, it so. As regards pre-Big Bang:
-science basically says that “we don’t know, but we will keep looking based on evidence and present knowledge of the universe.”
-religion: we DO know how the Big Bang came about, and it was due to the Creator!
Again, HUGE difference. Science: we don’t know. Religion: we DO know. Science waiting for more evidence, religion done, knows for sure what happened based on faith that it is so.

 

[Quag]

Wow Quag. I didn’t state it was logical. Though I believe it to be.

My position was misstated. I said purple, it was quoted back to me as green. I rephrased. You just left the premise entirely. No counterpoint. Just a review of how I said it, not what was said.

Debate:

Someone: I think it’s purple. This is why I think so.

Someone else: Actually I think it’s green, and this is why.

Not: Saying it’s purple doesn’t make it so.

The latter isn’t debate. What are we, sixth graders?

Wow you complain about my reading comprehension
Did I state you claimed your position was logical? No I made a general statement about the entire subject being discussed.
Not everything is all about you

 

[JacksinPA]

Again, it so. As regards pre-Big Bang:
-science basically says that “we don’t know, but we will keep looking based on evidence and present knowledge of the universe.”
-religion: we DO know how the Big Bang came about, and it was due to the Creator!
Again, HUGE difference. Science: we don’t know. Religion: we DO know. Science waiting for more evidence, religion done, knows for sure what happened based on faith that it is so.

It's much too easy to attribute the unknown to an unknowable.

 

[JacksinPA]

That one counts it as such, unless that one can explain how it’s not the case and what happened instead, is just someone else expressing their belief. Not fact.

Which was my whole bloody initial point!.

We are all getting tired of your preaching.

 

[AConcernedCitizen]

What the “nature” of what was transpiring moments before something came out of nothing that begat all the above us not a matter of scientific law. We can’t explain it.

As it stands it is open to all human imagination and conjecture has to offer. Including the presence of a higher power capable of making something come out if nothing. What might be true of it is TBD.

You aren't entirely wrong. There is no more evidence that the universe hatched from a giant polka-dotted easter egg than there is that it was birthed by Tiamat nine months after a wild night of lovemaking with Kevin Bacon, or that it was intentionally created by some higher power. Since we don't know for sure, any of those could theoretically be true.

There are some people, not that I'm accusing you of this in particular, but some people think the idea that the universe was birthed by Tiamat nine months after a wild night of lovemaking with Kevin Bacon is a bunch of contrived nonsense. But those people don't know the answer either, so who are they to say that the idea that the universe was birthed by Tiamat nine months after a wild night of lovemaking with Kevin Bacon is a bunch of contrived nonsense? The hubris.

 

[ModernDiogenes]

You aren't entirely wrong. There is no more evidence that the universe hatched from a giant polka-dotted easter egg than there is that it was birthed by Tiamat nine months after a wild night of lovemaking with Kevin Bacon, or that it was intentionally created by some higher power. Since we don't know for sure, any of those could theoretically be true.

There are some people, not that I'm accusing you of this in particular, but some people think the idea that the universe was birthed by Tiamat nine months after a wild night of lovemaking with Kevin Bacon is a bunch of contrived nonsense. But those people don't know the answer either, so who are they to say that the idea that the universe was birthed by Tiamat nine months after a wild night of lovemaking with Kevin Bacon is a bunch of contrived nonsense? The hubris.

George Carlin: “My shit is stuff. Your stuff is shit.”

I’m all for folks believing what ever they want when circumstances allow, due to lack of availability for actual knowing. Just call it that though: their religion/faith/belief. It’s all “stuff” at the point we are at.

 

[ModernDiogenes]

It's not my job to prove that your lies are false. Your job seems to be preaching lies that you cannot prove.

What?

I’m stating my beliefs as beliefs. I do state why I believe them but I’m not calling them facts. I am questioning why others are calling their opinion/belief fact. They aren’t lying either. Opinion can’t be a lie. It’s OPINION.

All I’ve stated is others are stating opinion as well, since NO ONE knows how the universe, pre-Big Bang, went from nothing into something. Again, NO ONE. Not even theory. It’s all conjecture. ALL OF IT.

What’s so hard to grasp if that? {LOL}.

This is pointless

 

[ModernDiogenes]

We are all getting tired of your preaching.

Then stop misrepresenting what I’ve stated and I’ll stop restating it.

Not claiming it know anything. Only that I, like others, have a belief. Not claiming that belief is fact. Only asking why others are claiming there brokers are facts.

Only pointing out that in the absence of facts everything is belief. Religious being no better, or worse, than “scientific”. Any scientist worth their salt would freely admit they haven’t the first idea of what’s taking place.

A valid, but rather obvious, point some of you have turned into a major debate. Though I’ll acknowledge not without my letting you. Which I’m ceasing.

What’s obvious is just that; obvious. It stands on its own merit and needs no more explaining.

Best wishes. Move the meeting.

 

[AConcernedCitizen]

George Carlin: “My shit is stuff. Your stuff is shit.”

I’m all for folks believing what ever they want when circumstances allow, due to lack of availability for actual knowing. Just call it that though: their religion/faith/belief. It’s all “stuff” at the point we are at.

I was totally agreeing with you. You can call the idea that the universe was birthed by Tiamat nine months after a wild night of lovemaking with Kevin Bacon religion/faith/belief. Some people prefer to call it contrived nonsense. It's all "stuff" at the point we are at.

 

[ModernDiogenes]

I was totally agreeing with you. You can call the idea that the universe was birthed by Tiamat nine months after a wild night of lovemaking with Kevin Bacon religion/faith/belief. Some people prefer to call it contrived nonsense. It's all "stuff" at the point we are at.

I was agreeing with you as well and redirecting it as a question to those who think I’m somehow calling their “stuff” shit. Im not. Im only asking why they don’t realize that, in the absence of knowledge, everyone else’s stuff isn’t shit. {lol}. It’s all stuff.

 

[AConcernedCitizen]

I was agreeing with you as well and redirecting it as a question to those who think I’m somehow calling their “stuff” shit. Im not. Im only asking why they don’t realize that, in the absence of knowledge, everyone else’s stuff isn’t shit. {lol}. It’s all stuff.

Being stuff doesn't prevent it from also being contrived nonsense.

 

[ModernDiogenes]

Being stuff doesn't prevent it from also being contrived nonsense.

Totally agreed.

 

[ModernDiogenes]

Again, it so. As regards pre-Big Bang:
-science basically says that “we don’t know, but we will keep looking based on evidence and present knowledge of the universe.”
-religion: we DO know how the Big Bang came about, and it was due to the Creator!
Again, HUGE difference. Science: we don’t know. Religion: we DO know. Science waiting for more evidence, religion done, knows for sure what happened based on faith that it is so.

That’s not what I’m addressing though. Which I’m not going to restate yet again.

 

[JacksinPA]

Then stop misrepresenting what I’ve stated and I’ll stop restating it.

Not claiming it know anything. Only that I, like others, have a belief. Not claiming that belief is fact. Only asking why others are claiming there brokers are facts.

Only pointing out that in the absence of facts everything is belief. Religious being no better, or worse, than “scientific”. Any scientist worth their salt would freely admit they haven’t the first idea of what’s taking place.

A valid, but rather obvious, point some of you have turned into a major debate. Though I’ll acknowledge not without my letting you. Which I’m ceasing.

What’s obvious is just that; obvious. It stands on its own merit and needs no more explaining.

Best wishes. Move the meeting.

Give it up.

 

[JacksinPA]

That’s not what I’m addressing though. Which I’m not going to restate yet again.

Thank you.

 

[watsup]

Any scientist worth their salt would freely admit they haven’t the first idea of what’s taking place.

Expand. What exactly is it that the scientists apparently admit that they "haven't the first idea of what's taking place".
I have answered this a couple of times most recently in post #155. It's a total nonsense statement as it stands.

 

[JacksinPA]

He is preaching Creationist nonsense. This list is not for preachers.