FBI: No evidence the Orlando killer was gay or used gay apps (3 Viewers)

[Tanngrisnir]

Why are you so quick to dismiss the killer's own words?

I'm not. I'm open to where the evidence leads, wherever that may be. Why aren't you?

Perhaps you are so desperate in your attempt to push a particular narrative that you would rather make something up/navigate away from what the man actually said before committing his act of terror.

Only in your imagination, but not in reality.

It seems to me, that you are so worried about there being another Islamic terrorist that you would make things up to push false stories so that it doesn't "look bad" on Islam.

Seems to me you're terrified of the fact that it may not simply have been another purely Islamic terrorist attack, and now you're lashing out in raw emotion because of that fear.

Its rather pathetic, and in fact it shows a very disturbing trend that attempts to subvert reality and paint a picture of people that are clearly motivated by religious extremism into nothing more than self hating confused people.

Sorry you can't accept that reality isn't black and white, but it's simply not my problem.

 

[bubbabgone]

Good of you to keep proving my point. Thanks!

No, I don't project all. You made a claim. You got called on it. You're now running from it.

Same old, same old.

I'm not. I'm open to where the evidence leads, wherever that may be. Why aren't you?

Only in your imagination, but not in reality.

Seems to me you're terrified of the fact that it may not simply have been another purely Islamic terrorist attack, and now you're lashing out in raw emotion because of that fear.

Sorry you can't accept that reality isn't black and white, but it's simply not my problem.

Well that pretty much settles it.
This thread and others have shown that you not only have absolutely nothing to offer but you also run from people who do.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

Well that pretty much settles it.
This thread and others have shown that you not only have absolutely nothing to offer but you also run from people who do.

Yawn. Still assumes facts not in evidence.

Good luck w/your magical thinking. We're done here and you'll need it.

 

[Taylor]

I'm sorry, but you made a specific claim. Why are you afraid of backing it up?

Orlando Shooter Was a Democrat? : snopes.com

Umm... Your link supports exactly what was claimed, that Mateen was a registered Democrat.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

Umm... Your link supports exactly what was claimed, that Mateen was a registered Democrat.

The claim was that he was a 'card-carrying' Democrat. There's a difference.

 

[ajn678]

I'm not. I'm open to where the evidence leads, wherever that may be. Why aren't you?

Only in your imagination, but not in reality.

Seems to me you're terrified of the fact that it may not simply have been another purely Islamic terrorist attack, and now you're lashing out in raw emotion because of that fear.

Sorry you can't accept that reality isn't black and white, but it's simply not my problem.

Its obvious you only have one objective in this case. Which is to distance the Islamic influences when its clearly screaming in your face. You don't want to listen to the truth so its better to just leave it at that.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

Its obvious you only have one objective in this case. Which is to distance the Islamic influences when its clearly screaming in your face. You don't want to listen to the truth so its better to just leave it at that.

In your over-active imagination, perhaps, but not in reality.

Sorry that reality seems to really upset you.

 

[ajn678]

In your over-active imagination, perhaps, but not in reality.

Sorry that reality seems to really upset you.

Nothing about reality upsets me. It is the fact that you want to create your own reality, because that suits your agenda better.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

Nothing about reality upsets me. It is the fact that you want to create your own reality, because that suits your agenda better.

LOL! I, unlike you, am open to whatever rational conclusions the data leads to. You aren't.

My 'agenda' is reality-based. That seems to frighten you.

Oh, well.

 

[VanceMack]

Its obvious you only have one objective in this case. Which is to distance the Islamic influences when its clearly screaming in your face. You don't want to listen to the truth so its better to just leave it at that.

Its rather comical. Dood says "Im doing this in the name of Islam!". Fundamentlaist Islamists cel;ebrate "He did it in the name of Islam!" Muslims say, yeah...thats an extremist fundamnetalist position and probably done in the name of Islam." Islamist apologists say..."thats not the REAL Islam, its because he was gay...and...the Christians! Don't forget the Christians! And the NRA!!! It was the NRA!!!!"

Somewhere at the end of the day, it was probably all Bush's fault.

 

[Cephus]

The claim was that he was a 'card-carrying' Democrat. There's a difference.

Seriously, are there cards for that? I mean, I've been a registered Republican for more than 30 years and I have never once been issued a card. Who the hell is handing out these cards anyhow?

 

[Absentglare]

Its obvious you only have one objective in this case. Which is to distance the Islamic influences when its clearly screaming in your face. You don't want to listen to the truth so its better to just leave it at that.

Presuming another's objectives is a poor substitute for an actual argument.

Further, accusing one who reserves judgement of being driven by a desired conclusion is ironic. Do you not acknowledge how eager many are to close the book on this as Islamic terrorism ?

 

[Absentglare]

Seriously, are there cards for that? I mean, I've been a registered Republican for more than 30 years and I have never once been issued a card. Who the hell is handing out these cards anyhow?

You're right, it was a fairly ridiculous expression to use in that case without proof that the guy was actually carrying said card.

 

[Absentglare]

Its rather comical. Dood says "Im doing this in the name of Islam!". Fundamentlaist Islamists cel;ebrate "He did it in the name of Islam!" Muslims say, yeah...thats an extremist fundamnetalist position and probably done in the name of Islam." Islamist apologists say..."thats not the REAL Islam, its because he was gay...and...the Christians! Don't forget the Christians! And the NRA!!! It was the NRA!!!!"

Somewhere at the end of the day, it was probably all Bush's fault.

If some Christian guy were to bomb some place in Ireland and then he claimed that he did it because he pledges allegiance to Protestants and Catholics, we would more accurately describe him as simply insane rather than a religious fundamentalist.

He pledged allegiance to incompatible interpretations of Islam, no amount of ignorance of Islamic sects can wish that fact away.

 

[VanceMack]

If some Christian guy were to bomb some place in Ireland and then he claimed that he did it because he pledges allegiance to Protestants and Catholics, we would more accurately describe him as simply insane rather than a religious fundamentalist.

He pledged allegiance to incompatible interpretations of Islam, no amount of ignorance of Islamic sects can wish that fact away.

Are you ****ing kidding me? The IRA has forever been known and associated with their Catholic faith. The roots and origins go back to a time when the countries and invading forces were literally defined as Cotholic or Protestant. OF COURSE they identify with their religious faith.

I'll go you one better. The Westboro Baptist Church is people by extremist religious ****heads. They ARE fundamentalist extremists. Everything they DO is in the name of their fundamentalist extremist beliefs and NO ONE has any problem admitting that.

Religion is an issue when religion IS an issue.

Nigeria: Federal law classifies homosexual behavior as a felony punishable by imprisonment, but several states have adopted sharia law and imposed a death penalty for men. A law signed in early January makes it illegal for gay people countrywide to hold a meeting or form clubs.
Qatar: Sharia law in Qatar applies only to Muslims, who can be put to death for extramarital sex, regardless of sexual orientation.
Saudi Arabia: Under the country’s interpretation of sharia law, a married man engaging in sodomy or any non-Muslim who commits sodomy with a Muslim can be stoned to death. All sex outside of marriage is illegal.
Afghanistan: The Afghan Penal Code does not refer to homosexual acts, but Article 130 of the Constitution allows recourse to be made to sharia law, which prohibits same-sex sexual activity in general. Afghanistan’s sharia law criminalizes same-sex sexual acts with a maximum of the death penalty. No known cases of death sentences have been meted out since the end of Taliban rule in 2001.
Somalia: The penal code stipulates prison, but in some southern regions, Islamic courts have imposed sharia law and the death penalty.
Sudan: Three-time offenders under the sodomy law can be put to death; first and second convictions result in flogging and imprisonment. Southern parts of the country have adopted more lenient laws.
United Arab Emirates: Lawyers in the country and other experts disagree on whether federal law prescribes the death penalty for consensual homosexual sex or only for rape. In a recent Amnesty International report, the organization said it was not aware of any death sentences for homosexual acts. All sexual acts outside of marriage are banned.

Add to that list Iran, Turkey, and anywhere fundamentalists operate. Its not some minor isolated minority of the Muslim belief.

 

[ajn678]

Presuming another's objectives is a poor substitute for an actual argument.

Further, accusing one who reserves judgement of being driven by a desired conclusion is ironic. Do you not acknowledge how eager many are to close the book on this as Islamic terrorism ?

The guy praised and dedicated his act to ISIS. But I guess we should just ignore that.

 

[ajn678]

If some Christian guy were to bomb some place in Ireland and then he claimed that he did it because he pledges allegiance to Protestants and Catholics, we would more accurately describe him as simply insane rather than a religious fundamentalist.

He pledged allegiance to incompatible interpretations of Islam, no amount of ignorance of Islamic sects can wish that fact away.

Can you show any official statements of this? I have seen this quoted places but there were no actual reports that he did this. I read his 911 transcripts and it didn't seem to mention that.

 

[VanceMack]

The guy praised and dedicated his act to ISIS. But I guess we should just ignore that.

But its only a few people...

 

[Absentglare]

Are you ****ing kidding me? The IRA has forever been known and associated with their Catholic faith. The roots and origins go back to a time when the countries and invading forces were literally defined as Cotholic or Protestant. OF COURSE they identify with their religious faith.

I'll go you one better. The Westboro Baptist Church is people by extremist religious ****heads. They ARE fundamentalist extremists. Everything they DO is in the name of their fundamentalist extremist beliefs and NO ONE has any problem admitting that.

Religion is an issue when religion IS an issue.

Nigeria: Federal law classifies homosexual behavior as a felony punishable by imprisonment, but several states have adopted sharia law and imposed a death penalty for men. A law signed in early January makes it illegal for gay people countrywide to hold a meeting or form clubs.
Qatar: Sharia law in Qatar applies only to Muslims, who can be put to death for extramarital sex, regardless of sexual orientation.
Saudi Arabia: Under the country’s interpretation of sharia law, a married man engaging in sodomy or any non-Muslim who commits sodomy with a Muslim can be stoned to death. All sex outside of marriage is illegal.
Afghanistan: The Afghan Penal Code does not refer to homosexual acts, but Article 130 of the Constitution allows recourse to be made to sharia law, which prohibits same-sex sexual activity in general. Afghanistan’s sharia law criminalizes same-sex sexual acts with a maximum of the death penalty. No known cases of death sentences have been meted out since the end of Taliban rule in 2001.
Somalia: The penal code stipulates prison, but in some southern regions, Islamic courts have imposed sharia law and the death penalty.
Sudan: Three-time offenders under the sodomy law can be put to death; first and second convictions result in flogging and imprisonment. Southern parts of the country have adopted more lenient laws.
United Arab Emirates: Lawyers in the country and other experts disagree on whether federal law prescribes the death penalty for consensual homosexual sex or only for rape. In a recent Amnesty International report, the organization said it was not aware of any death sentences for homosexual acts. All sexual acts outside of marriage are banned.

Add to that list Iran, Turkey, and anywhere fundamentalists operate. Its not some minor isolated minority of the Muslim belief.

The point is that Catholicism and Protestantism are mutually exclusive. If someone claims to be both Catholic and Protestant, they clearly don't understand either one very well (or, alternatively, are lying).

I won't claim his religion played no role, but we do not have good reason to believe that religion played the primary role. This guy was born and raised in America. I suspect mental illness also played a role, or some other deep, internal conflict.

 

[VanceMack]

The point is that Catholicism and Protestantism are mutually exclusive. If someone claims to be both Catholic and Protestant, they clearly don't understand either one very well (or, alternatively, are lying).

I won't claim his religion played no role, but we do not have good reason to believe that religion played the primary role. This guy was born and raised in America. I suspect mental illness also played a role, or some other deep, internal conflict.

So was the San Berndardino shooter.

Allahu Akbar, baby.

 

[Absentglare]

The guy praised and dedicated his act to ISIS. But I guess we should just ignore that.

And Hezbollah. And Al-Nusra.

Can you show any official statements of this? I have seen this quoted places but there were no actual reports that he did this. I read his 911 transcripts and it didn't seem to mention that.

"As details of the worst mass shooting in US history emerged, FBI Director James Comey said on Monday that the suspect, identified as 29-year-old Omar Mateen, had not only pledged loyalty to the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL, also known as ISIS), but also expressed solidarity with the Tsarnaev brothers who carried out the Boston Marathon bombing and a suicide bomber who died on behalf of the al-Nusra Front, a group at odds with ISIL."

"But Comey - who believed Mateen had "strong signs of radicalisation" - said that in the past few years, the gunman also expressed support for both al-Qaeda and Hezbollah."

Orlando: Omar Mateen 'pledged loyalty to ISIL, others' - News from Al Jazeera

"JAMES COMEY: First, he claimed family connections to al-Qaida. He also said that he was a member of Hezbollah, which is a Shia terrorist organization that is a bitter enemy of the so-called Islamic State.

WESTERVELT: So it seems the shooter had trouble distinguishing between Sunni and Shia extremists, showing perhaps he was less a committed jihadist, Kelly, and just unstable."

Orlando Gunman Omar Mateen Pledged Allegiance To ISIS : NPR

"To be clear, these groups named by Mateen are not allies. The Islamic State and al-Qaeda both derive their theology from an extreme view of Sunni Islamism, but in practical terms the pair split in 2014, with the more established al-Qaeda publicly disavowing the actions of the more extreme Islamic State. Jabhat al-Nusra, al-Qaeda's affiliate in Syria, often fights the Islamic State in the Syrian conflict. Meanwhile, Hezbollah is a Shiite Islamist group. In Syria, it supports the government of Bashar al-Assad, effectively meaning it fights both the Islamic State and al-Qaeda."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...fference-between-isis-al-qaeda-and-hezbollah/

 

[ajn678]

So was the San Berndardino shooter.

Allahu Akbar, baby.

I wonder if the same people would say the same thing about Timothy McVeigh. Both are obviously terrorists. Both born in America. Yet because one is Muslim the Left is quick to blame anything except for what the guy actually said.

 

[ajn678]

And Hezbollah. And Al-Nusra.



"As details of the worst mass shooting in US history emerged, FBI Director James Comey said on Monday that the suspect, identified as 29-year-old Omar Mateen, had not only pledged loyalty to the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL, also known as ISIS), but also expressed solidarity with the Tsarnaev brothers who carried out the Boston Marathon bombing and a suicide bomber who died on behalf of the al-Nusra Front, a group at odds with ISIL."

"But Comey - who believed Mateen had "strong signs of radicalisation" - said that in the past few years, the gunman also expressed support for both al-Qaeda and Hezbollah."

Orlando: Omar Mateen 'pledged loyalty to ISIL, others' - News from Al Jazeera

"JAMES COMEY: First, he claimed family connections to al-Qaida. He also said that he was a member of Hezbollah, which is a Shia terrorist organization that is a bitter enemy of the so-called Islamic State.

WESTERVELT: So it seems the shooter had trouble distinguishing between Sunni and Shia extremists, showing perhaps he was less a committed jihadist, Kelly, and just unstable."

Orlando Gunman Omar Mateen Pledged Allegiance To ISIS : NPR

"To be clear, these groups named by Mateen are not allies. The Islamic State and al-Qaeda both derive their theology from an extreme view of Sunni Islamism, but in practical terms the pair split in 2014, with the more established al-Qaeda publicly disavowing the actions of the more extreme Islamic State. Jabhat al-Nusra, al-Qaeda's affiliate in Syria, often fights the Islamic State in the Syrian conflict. Meanwhile, Hezbollah is a Shiite Islamist group. In Syria, it supports the government of Bashar al-Assad, effectively meaning it fights both the Islamic State and al-Qaeda."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...fference-between-isis-al-qaeda-and-hezbollah/

I am talking about his 911 call. Not something he might have said to coworkers years ago. He only gave credit to one group in his 911 call. Nothing else.

 

[Top Cat]

They should have just asked him directly if he was gay before they killed him. If he had to spit a dick out of his mouth before he could answer the question, then he was probably gay. :mrgreen:

Now there's a litmus test. :lamo

 

[Top Cat]

The guy praised and dedicated his act to ISIS. But I guess we should just ignore that.

Should the FBI have ignored all the other evidence regarding potential gay activities, websites, testimony of eye witnesses etc?

It's called due process. I, for one, appreciate that it takes time. Lots of rocks to uncover.

The truth will surface. Although some answers probably died with him.

Once again, you seem hellbent on suggesting all liberals think alike. I am thankful that not all conservative think like you.