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Examples of extreme right-wing atrocities

SonOfDaedalus

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Many conservatives argue that the atrocities of the Soviet Union, China and other "left-wing" governments prove that there is some association between left-wing policies and authoritarianism. They often claim there are no examples of right-wing authoritarianism but they are wrong.

Slavery and colonialism are examples of right-wing authoritarianism. Yes, there have been many examples of slavery throughout history but during the colonial period, slavery was used by businesses for profit. The motive was a purely capitalist. It was an attempt to reduce the cost of labor by buying people and enslaving them. Human beings were bought and sold on the free market. Prices were determined by the free market. And all of this was sanctioned by the government.

So you have a free-market government sanctioning the most extreme exploitation of workers.

The only solution to this problem was government. Government had to make this illegal. And a lot of business owners objected to government infringing on their freedom. We had a Civil War where ultimately government forced these laws upon an unwilling free market.

African Americans were saved from a horrific existence under a right-wing authoritarian government by leftist abolitionists who believed in regulating and restricting the free market.

The point is the extreme of right-wing free-market policies is extreme exploitation fo the poor by the wealthy. Extreme freedom for the free market doesn't naturally lead to more freedom for everybody. Slavery being an extreme example of this. But we also saw the horrors of worker exploitation during the early industrial era that led to government intervention.

Was slavery an example of atrocities caused by extreme right-wing policies?
 

Eriech

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Many conservatives argue that the atrocities of the Soviet Union, China and other "left-wing" governments prove that there is some association between left-wing policies and authoritarianism. They often claim there are no examples of right-wing authoritarianism but they are wrong.

Slavery and colonialism are examples of right-wing authoritarianism. Yes, there have been many examples of slavery throughout history but during the colonial period, slavery was used by businesses for profit. The motive was a purely capitalist. It was an attempt to reduce the cost of labor by buying people and enslaving them. Human beings were bought and sold on the free market. Prices were determined by the free market. And all of this was sanctioned by the government.

So you have a free-market government sanctioning the most extreme exploitation of workers.

The only solution to this problem was government. Government had to make this illegal. And a lot of business owners objected to government infringing on their freedom. We had a Civil War where ultimately government forced these laws upon an unwilling free market.

African Americans were saved from a horrific existence under a right-wing authoritarian government by leftist abolitionists who believed in regulating and restricting the free market.

The point is the extreme of right-wing free-market policies is extreme exploitation fo the poor by the wealthy. Extreme freedom for the free market doesn't naturally lead to more freedom for everybody. Slavery being an extreme example of this. But we also saw the horrors of worker exploitation during the early industrial era that led to government intervention.

Was slavery an example of atrocities caused by extreme right-wing policies?
No

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SonOfDaedalus

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No

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Are you saying that plantation owners weren't capitalists trying to maximize their profit by reducing their labor costs? Are you saying that slaves weren't bought and sold on the free market at prices determined by the free market?
 

vesper

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I believe some members of this forum are so far left that normal has now become far right wing to them. When folks put down the labels and start directing their discussions with the Constitution as a roadmap, things might become normal again.
 

Bullseye

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Many conservatives argue that the atrocities of the Soviet Union, China and other "left-wing" governments prove that there is some association between left-wing policies and authoritarianism. They often claim there are no examples of right-wing authoritarianism but they are wrong.

Slavery and colonialism are examples of right-wing authoritarianism. Yes, there have been many examples of slavery throughout history but during the colonial period, slavery was used by businesses for profit. The motive was a purely capitalist. It was an attempt to reduce the cost of labor by buying people and enslaving them. Human beings were bought and sold on the free market. Prices were determined by the free market. And all of this was sanctioned by the government.

So you have a free-market government sanctioning the most extreme exploitation of workers.

The only solution to this problem was government. Government had to make this illegal. And a lot of business owners objected to government infringing on their freedom. We had a Civil War where ultimately government forced these laws upon an unwilling free market.

African Americans were saved from a horrific existence under a right-wing authoritarian government by leftist abolitionists who believed in regulating and restricting the free market.

The point is the extreme of right-wing free-market policies is extreme exploitation fo the poor by the wealthy. Extreme freedom for the free market doesn't naturally lead to more freedom for everybody. Slavery being an extreme example of this. But we also saw the horrors of worker exploitation during the early industrial era that led to government intervention.

Was slavery an example of atrocities caused by extreme right-wing policies?
Not only NO, but **** NO. Study a little history. Almost since its founding this nation have been strongly anti-slavery; in the early days compromises had to be made to ensure the life of the nation but every effort was made to contain slavery to the South. There was a strong Abolitionist movement.
 

Bullseye

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Are you saying that plantation owners weren't capitalists trying to maximize their profit by reducing their labor costs? Are you saying that slaves weren't bought and sold on the free market at prices determined by the free market?
There were capitalists in the North, as well, who strongly opposed slavery.
 

SDET

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CMPancake

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Almost since its founding this nation have been strongly anti-slavery;

Which is exactly why the United States ended up with slavery, and a bloody war to end slavery.
 

Bullseye

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Which is exactly why the United States ended up with slavery, and a bloody war to end slavery.
You did see the word "compromise", right? I'd didn't say antislavery was unanimous, did I?
 

SonOfDaedalus

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Not only NO, but **** NO. Study a little history. Almost since its founding this nation have been strongly anti-slavery; in the early days compromises had to be made to ensure the life of the nation but every effort was made to contain slavery to the South. There was a strong Abolitionist movement.

I don't see what any of that has to do with my OP.

My point is that slavery was done for profit by business owners. Slaves were bought and sold in a free market. A free market without government regulation leads to the exploitation of workers. So, slavery is indeed an example of extreme right-wing free-market policies.
 

Bullseye

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I don't see what any of that has to do with my OP.

My point is that slavery was done for profit by business owners. Slaves were bought and sold in a free market. A free market without government regulation leads to the exploitation of workers. So, slavery is indeed an example of extreme right-wing free-market policies.
Nonsense. Free Markets, for example, are Classic Liberal stances.
 

SonOfDaedalus

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Nonsense. Free Markets, for example, are Classic Liberal stances.

You're not making any sense.

Slaves were bought and sold in a free market unconstrained by government intervention. The motive was profit.

In a world without any government intervention, you would have slavery.

Why wouldn't an authoritarian right-wing government allow slavery? The colonialist monarchies did just that. They exploited the hell out of their own people and their colonies.

I think you don't have any counter arguments and that's why you have so little to say. It's just a fact. The extremes of the "left-wing" and "right-wing" both lead to less freedom and horrific conditions for some. On the right, yoiu have a ruling class of wealthy capitalists oppressing the poor and powerless and on the left you have a ruling political class oppressing the powerless.
 

Jesse Booth

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In a world without any government intervention, you would have slavery.

You're right, but only to a small degree. Technological innovation eventually makes slavery more expensive than simply underpaying your employees, who now rely on modern technology whose production probably shouldn't be entrusted to forced laborers. There's a reason you never see cultural revolutions replacing institutions like slavery or serfdom before any given society's industrial revolution. Of course, you can (and many do) argue that paying workers extremely low wages is a form of slavery in and of itself. In areas like China, I have to say that I partially agree with that premise.

Sex slavery, gruesomely enough, is the one form of slavery that never truly goes away.
 

SonOfDaedalus

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You're right, but only to a small degree. Technological innovation eventually makes slavery more expensive than simply underpaying your employees, who now rely on modern technology whose production probably shouldn't be entrusted to forced laborers. There's a reason you never see cultural revolutions replacing institutions like slavery or serfdom before any given society's industrial revolution. Of course, you can (and many do) argue that paying workers extremely low wages is a form of slavery in and of itself. In areas like China, I have to say that I partially agree with that premise.

Sex slavery, gruesomely enough, is the one form of slavery that never truly goes away.

I think the bottom line is that the free market is predicated upon the profit motive or greed. And greed does motivate and inspire invention and innovation. But it also leads to exploitation. Slavery and underpaying workers are just examples of greed motivated exploitation. You need government or society to impose restrictions on the free market that prevents exploitation.

And even sex slavery is motived by profit.
 

CMPancake

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You did see the word "compromise", right?

You don't get bonus points for "compromising" on slavery. You're either a piece of **** that condones it, or you're not.
 

SonOfDaedalus

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You don't get bonus points for "compromising" on slavery. You're either a piece of **** that condones it, or you're not.

I think everyone knew slavery was awful. The problem is that it was also profitable. It's greed that caused people to rationalize slavery.

Conservatives and libertarians always claim that the free market always produces more freedom but that's not true. The slavers gave African factions guns in exchange for slaves. So various factions fought each other with those guns and captured more slaves to finance their arms race. From beginning to end the evil of slavery existed purely because of greed, trade and capitalism.

And beyond slavery, there was also indentured servitude and other horrors that government had to step in and regulate away.

But socialism and capitalism can lead to horrors without proper government rules.
 
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