Erik Prince on Colonialism and Africa (1 Viewer)

[ralfy]

Full video:

 

[Infinite Chaos]

Where does the moron think most of the current problems in Africa came from?

 

[Gozaburo]

Where does the moron think most of the current problems in Africa came from?

It's true that European colonialism left Africa a forsaken backwater full of ethnic and tribal conflict.

It's also true that before a European ever set foot in the interior of Africa, it was a forsaken backwater full of ethnic and tribal conflict.

 

[ralfy]

The heart of darkness meets the heart of darkness.

 

[venice_ca]

Once again Erik Prince demonstrates his lack of a moral compass.

 

[Airyaman]

Full video:

Do you ever comment in threads you start? This is a discussion forum after all.

 

[Rexedgar]

The US hasn’t worked out the self-governance thingy yet. Best not to export a non-working version!

 

[Tigerace117]

Where does the moron think most of the current problems in Africa came from?

Presumably....the US and Europe not controlling those countries

 

[Infinite Chaos]

It's also true that before a European ever set foot in the interior of Africa, it was a forsaken backwater full of ethnic and tribal conflict.

While there is plenty of evidence of the former claim - where is your evidence that "Africa" was a backwater of ethnic and tribal conflict?

 

[Gozaburo]

While there is plenty of evidence of the former claim - where is your evidence that "Africa" was a backwater of ethnic and tribal conflict?

Well, there isn't a ton of evidence because much of interior of the continent hadn't developed written language or historical documentation by the time the Europeans arrived.

But we can also observe the absolutely massive divide in technological superiority between Sub-Saharan and Southern Africa compared to Europe and see that much of the continent was at least 2,000 years behind Europe (far less sophisticated than even the Romans in antiquity). There are reasons for this, but to blame Africa's current state solely on European conquests and war is hilariously reductive. A casual look at history will show you that Europeans, more than anything, excel at slaughtering and enslaving other Europeans. The damage Europeans have inflicted on rival European nations via war and conquest FAR outweighs any conquest on the African continent.

 

[Infinite Chaos]

Well, there isn't a ton of evidence because much of interior of the continent hadn't developed written language or historical documentation by the time the Europeans arrived.

Never heard of Nsibidi, the Ishango bone or other examples like the Wonderwerk cave paintings?

But we can also observe the absolutely massive divide in technological superiority between Sub-Saharan and Southern Africa compared to Europe and see that much of the continent was at least 2,000 years behind Europe

If the Portuguese hadn't brought gunpowder back from China, there would still be some of the towns and settlements that they blew "back to the stone age" when they first arrived.

to blame Africa's current state solely on European conquests and war is hilariously reductive. A casual look at history will show you that Europeans, more than anything, excel at slaughtering and enslaving other Europeans. The damage Europeans have inflicted on rival European nations via war and conquest FAR outweighs any conquest on the African continent.

Ah... I see colonialism and the cold war were self imposed by Africans eh?

 

[watsup]

full of ethnic and tribal conflict.

full of ethnic and tribal conflict.

And perhaps you can name a continent or area that has not been full of ethnic and tribal conflict? Africa still has a long way to go to produce as many dead people through conflict as was done by European and Asian nations dueling WWII.

 

[samiam5211]

Where does the moron think most of the current problems in Africa came from?

he doesn't care about Africa other than how much money he can make invading Africa.

 

[Gozaburo]

Never heard of Nsibidi, the Ishango bone or other examples like the Wonderwerk cave paintings?

Lol. None of these are proofs for a robust written language, but in any case my claim was "much of the interior".

the Portuguese hadn't brought gunpowder back from China, there would still be some of the towns and settlements that they blew "back to the stone age" when they first arrived.

Not really sure what your claim is here.

Ah... I see colonialism and the cold war were self imposed by Africans eh?

Strawman

 

[Gozaburo]

And perhaps you can name a continent or area that has not been full of ethnic and tribal conflict? Africa still has a long way to go to produce as many dead people through conflict as was done by European and Asian nations dueling WWII.

Well yeah because Asia and Europe have produced technologies which make killing people super easy.

 

[watsup]

Well yeah because Asia and Europe have produced technologies which make killing people super easy.

The point remains that ethnic and “tribal” conflict is a HUMAN condition and singling out one continent is not appropriate.

 

[Infinite Chaos]

Lol. None of these are proofs for a robust written language

Some of them like Nsibidi have only been used for 7000 years but yeah, tell yourself that they are not "robust written language..."

Not really sure what your claim is here.

Not surprised if you can look at a written language that is 7000 years old and pretend it doesn't count. 7000 years isn't "robust?"

to blame Africa's current state solely on European conquests and war is hilariously reductive

Strawman

Exactly.

 

[Gozaburo]

Some of them like Nsibidi have only been used for 7000 years but yeah, tell yourself that they are not "robust written language..."

It isn't. It's a hyper-specific and localized series of written symbols (lacking the complexity and vocabulary of modern languages) that are specific to a geo-cultural subset of Africa.

Not surprised if you can look at a written language that is 7000 years old and pretend it doesn't count. 7000 years isn't "robust?"

Because it isn't. Tolkien's fantasy elf language of Quenya is far more robust and it was written over the course of a single lifetime by some guy in his basememt.

Where does the moron think most of the current problems in Africa came from?

I'll be fair - you said "most". I think even claiming "most" is reductive and lacking nuance, but I digress.

 

[watsup]

It isn't. It's a hyper-specific and localized series of written symbols (lacking the complexity and vocabulary of modern languages) that are specific to a geo-cultural subset of Africa.



Because it isn't. Tolkien's fantasy elf language of Quenya is far more robust and it was written over the course of a single lifetime by some guy in his basememt.



I'll be fair - you said "most". I think even claiming "most" is reductive and lacking nuance, but I digress.

Can you read Nsibidi? Didn’t think so.

 

[Infinite Chaos]

It isn't. It's a hyper-specific and localized series of written symbols (lacking the complexity and vocabulary of modern languages) that are specific to a geo-cultural subset of Africa.

Utter bollocks. Nsibidi is a written language that allows people who speak completely different languages to communicate with each other. Last time that was tried - it was Esperanto in 1887.

Because it isn't. Tolkien's fantasy elf language of Quenya is far more robust and it was written over the course of a single lifetime by some guy in his basememt.

OK, how many peoples of the world communicate with each other using Tolkien's language? And I don't mean nerds - I mean peoples as in differing cultures and behaviours.

I'll be fair - you said "most". I think even claiming "most" is reductive and lacking nuance, but I digress.

You've been on dodgy ground since your first foray into this thread. You know nothing about the history of Africa beyond some crap that the OP video pushes and it shows.

 

[joluoto]

Erik Prince at one point worked with Wagner in Libya. Erik Prince is one of the most evil men alive. I do not say thalt lightly. Erik Prince is up there with Vladimir Putin on the list of the worst human beings alive.

 

[ralfy]

Erik Prince at one point worked with Wagner in Libya. Erik Prince is one of the most evil men alive. I do not say thalt lightly. Erik Prince is up there with Vladimir Putin on the list of the worst human beings alive.

The Dark Truth about Blackwater | Brookings

Outsourcing the war to private military contractors such as Blackwater has shattered the United States' moral authority and its ability to win wars like that in Iraq.

www.brookings.edu

On Sept. 16, 2007, a convoy of Blackwater contractors guarding State Department employees entered a crowded square near the Mansour district in Baghdad, Iraq. But versions of what caused the ensuing bloodshed diverge. Employees from the firm claim they were attacked by gunmen and responded within the rules of engagement, fighting their way out of the square after one of their vehicles was disabled. Iraqi police and witnesses instead report that the contractors opened fire first, shooting at a small car driven by a couple with their child that did not get out of the convoy’s way as traffic slowed. At some point in the 20-minute gunfight, Iraqi police and army forces stationed in watchtowers above the square also began firing. Other Iraqi security forces and Blackwater quick-reaction forces soon reportedly joined the battle. There are also reports that one Blackwater employee may even have pointed his weapon at his fellow contractors, in an effort to get them to cease firing.

It's similar to the U.S. using other countries for proxy wars.

 

[lwf]

While there is plenty of evidence of the former claim - where is your evidence that "Africa" was a backwater of ethnic and tribal conflict?

There is plenty of evidence that pre-colonial Africa was full of ethnic and tribal conflict. Slavery was practiced by indigenous Africans long before Europeans arrived, and there is evidence of a long history of tribes wiping each other out.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_Africa

There tends to be a myth that indigenous peoples were living idyllic, peaceful existences before violent Europeans colonized, murdered, and enslaved them. The reality is: All human populations are historically violent. The difference between European violence and the violence of indigenous populations is not one of temperament, it is one of technology. Europeans did more damage worldwide solely because they had the technology to do so.

 

[Juin]

Well, there isn't a ton of evidence because much of interior of the continent hadn't developed written language or historical documentation by the time the Europeans arrived.

In which case we have to withold judgement

But we can also observe the absolutely massive divide in technological superiority between Sub-Saharan and Southern Africa compared to Europe and see that much of the continent was at least 2,000 years behind Europe (far less sophisticated than even the Romans in antiquity).

Antique Rome was awesome. But does that translate to all of Europe? I dont recall from my readings that the Gauls, Germanic tribes were anywhere close to the Romans, even though inside Europe.

There are reasons for this, but to blame Africa's current state solely on European conquests and war is hilariously reductive. A casual look at history will show you that Europeans, more than anything, excel at slaughtering and enslaving other Europeans. The damage Europeans have inflicted on rival European nations via war and conquest FAR outweighs any conquest on the African continent.

I agree with the proviso that it is just humans being humans. Invasions can cause big havoc. The fall of Rome was followed by the Dark Ages from which Europe did not recover for a long time. And in southern Africa the rise of the Zulus under Shaka also caused immediate damages to tribes in their path; and sent shockwaves far beyond actual Zulu armies as defeated tribes escaped and fell on other tribes far away from the Zulus. The Mongols destroyed a lot in their path; and Europe managed just barely escaped the Mongols

 

[Juin]

There is plenty of evidence that pre-colonial Africa was full of ethnic and tribal conflict. Slavery was practiced by indigenous Africans long before Europeans arrived, and there is evidence of a long history of tribes wiping each other out.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_Africa

There tends to be a myth that indigenous peoples were living an idyllic, peaceful existences before violent Europeans colonized, murdered, and enslaved them. The reality is: All human populations are historically violent. The difference between European violence and the violence of indigenous populations is not one of temperament, it is one of technology. Europeans did more damage worldwide solely because they had the technology to do so.

Agree, Its primarily a human thing.