Epstein scandal broadens as trove of letters from famous figures published

[What if...?]

He probably did. That does not make all his associates guilty.

But it does call into question their character because I cannot believe folks who went to the island on the pimped out plane called the “Lolita express” didn’t know what was going on there.

Getting to enjoy things others do not is one of the perks of great wealth. Always has been.

 

[Lord of Planar]

But it does call into question their character because I cannot believe folks who went to the island on the pimped out plane called the “Lolita express” didn’t know what was going on there.

Getting to enjoy things others do not is one of the perks of great wealth. Always has been.

Here you are, just rationalizing a means to direct your hate.

 

[uptower]

 

[Sven Karma]

But it does call into question their character because I cannot believe folks who went to the island on the pimped out plane called the “Lolita express” didn’t know what was going on there.

Getting to enjoy things others do not is one of the perks of great wealth. Always has been.

Yeah, it's not exactly the size of Madagascar:

 

[What if...?]

Here you are, just rationalizing a means to direct your hate.

You don’t hate pedophiles and their enablers?

At no point have I singled anybody out by any metric except participation or tolerance of pedophilia.

 

[Lord of Planar]

You don’t hate pedophiles and their enablers?

Yes, but to assume others are and labeling them as such is just as perverted.

Facts are necessary. Not suspicions when accusing people of something, especially something that perverse.

At no point have I singled anybody out by any metric except participation or tolerance of pedophilia.

To make that claim, you are assuming they knew of his perversion.

I see the D-K Effect is in full swing.

 

[What if...?]

Yes, but to assume others are and labeling them as such is just as perverted.

Facts are necessary. Not suspicions when accusing people of something, especially something that perverse.

To make that claim, you are assuming they knew of his perversion.

I see the D-K Effect is in full swing.

Who’s perversion?

If you’re trying to run the line that folks who flew on the Lolita Express and hung out on the island were completely unaware of what was going on in both places so none of them deserve any scorn because they were somehow inhumanly oblivious to their surroundings, well I hope the view is great from the sand you decided to put your head in.

 

[bomberfox]

Cool. You're on record mansplaining why it's mean to ick Chomsky for fawning over a rapist 11 years after everyone knew he was a sex pest.

The first time i really disagreed with him was when he started defending Milosevic.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Who’s perversion?

If you’re trying to run the line that folks who flew on the Lolita Express and hung out on the island were completely unaware of what was going on in both places so none of them deserve any scorn because they were somehow inhumanly oblivious to their surroundings, well I hope the view is great from the sand you decided to put your head in.

Prove they knew it. Do you have any evidence that every time people visited such a large area, they were all aware of illegal activities?

My God man. "What Ifs" are not fact.

 

[HenryChinaski]

Clinton flew on Epstein's plane many times, and he is mentioned in court documents as many times as Trump is mentioned, according to the court documents that I have seen. Yet, even considering the documented information, below, it doesn't seem to me that Clinton (or Trump) would be attracted to little girls. However, I could believe it as to Joe Biden, considering what I have seen on C-span video, of Biden and congress member's children, and grandchildren.

"Billionaire paedophile Jeffrey Epstein once told one of his victims that Bill Clinton “likes them young”, according to dramatic testimony revealed in court documents unsealed for the very first time.

Dozens of Epstein associates were unmasked on Wednesday after a judge ordered the unsealing of court documents in a now-settled lawsuit brought by abuse victim Virginia Giuffre against Epstein’s accomplice Ghislaine Maxwell.

Among the hundreds of pages of filings, another victim Johanna Sjoberg spoke about what she knew about Mr Clinton’s ties to Epstein as part of a 2016 deposition that also made allegations against Prince Andrew."

Epstein told victim Bill Clinton ‘likes them young’, new ...​

Maxwell told a reporter in 2016 that Epstein filmed both Clinton and Trump having sex with underage girls..


Your turn.

 

[Sven Karma]

The first time i really disagreed with him was when he started defending Milosevic.

Can't say I'm altogether impressed by Chomsky's rationalization here, droll though it is that it's now the 'far right' championing his cause:

“Like all of those in Cambridge who met and knew him, we knew that he had been convicted and served his time, which means that he re-enters society under prevailing norms — which, it is true, are rejected by the far right in the US and sometimes by unscrupulous employers,” Chomsky wrote. “I’ve had no pause about close friends who spent many years in prison, and were released. That's quite normal in free societies.”

Jeffrey Epstein Met With Harvard Professor Martin Nowak and Noam Chomsky in 2015 in Harvard Office | News | The Harvard Crimson

Financier and sex trafficker Jeffrey E. Epstein met with Harvard professor Martin A. Nowak, linguist Noam Chomsky, and other unidentified academics in March 2015, the Wall Street Journal reported Sunday.

www.thecrimson.com

 

[bomberfox]

Can't say I'm altogether impressed by Chomsky's rationalization here:

“Like all of those in Cambridge who met and knew him, we knew that he had been convicted and served his time, which means that he re-enters society under prevailing norms — which, it is true, are rejected by the far right in the US and sometimes by unscrupulous employers,” Chomsky wrote. “I’ve had no pause about close friends who spent many years in prison, and were released. That's quite normal in free societies.”

Jeffrey Epstein Met With Harvard Professor Martin Nowak and Noam Chomsky in 2015 in Harvard Office | News | The Harvard Crimson

Financier and sex trafficker Jeffrey E. Epstein met with Harvard professor Martin A. Nowak, linguist Noam Chomsky, and other unidentified academics in March 2015, the Wall Street Journal reported Sunday.

www.thecrimson.com

Me either. Epstein was incredibly unrepentant.

 

[What if...?]

Prove they knew it. Do you have any evidence that every time people visited such a large area, they were all aware of illegal activities?

My God man. "What Ifs" are not fact.

I know people. And I am male.

There are lots of photos of people with those underage girls. Never have seen any claims that it was in a secret spot no one knew about. Multiple claims that they were abused on the plane, which was obviously tiny.

I also know that men brag and there was a lot of alcohol involved.

It’s possible people went and were completely oblivious. But I doubt they were more than a small minority. Especially those who went multiple times.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Maxwell told a reporter in 2016 that Epstein filmed both Clinton and Trump having sex with underage girls..


Your turn.

Unproven allegation. May or may not be true. Might just be starting a nasty rumor.

 

[Lord of Planar]

I know people. And I am male.

There are lots of photos of people with those underage girls. Never have seen any claims that it was in a secret spot no one knew about. Multiple claims that they were abused on the plane, which was obviously tiny.

I also know that men brag and there was a lot of alcohol involved.

It’s possible people went and were completely oblivious. But I doubt they were more than a small minority. Especially those who went multiple times.

We can imagine all types of scenarios. That does not make any of them fact.

I suggest you do not discount the idea that Epstein invited powerful people to a nice resort getaway that improved his chances to find something he could use for blackmail and extortion. It doesn't mean he entrapped everyone who was a regular in this "what if" scenario.

 

[HenryChinaski]

Unproven allegation. May or may not be true. Might just be starting a nasty rumor.

Right.
Everyone's lying except Trump.
His Sister is lying when she called Trump a cruel liar that can't be trusted.
His ex cabinet is lying when they call him a dangerous liar.
His CFO and ex employees were lying in court when they said Trump
signed every check and knew every aspect of his businesses.
The numerous women who have accused him of sexual assault are all lying.
His ex wife is lying when she said that Trump beat and raped her.
Maxwell was lying when she said that Trump ****ed underage women.

Everyone is lying except Trump. Only Trump can be believed.
Believe in Trump.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Right.
Everyone's lying except Trump.
His Sister is lying when she called Trump a cruel liar that can't be trusted.
His ex cabinet is lying when they call him a dangerous liar.
His CFO and ex employees were lying in court when they said Trump
signed every check and knew every aspect of his businesses.
The numerous women who have accused him of sexual assault are all lying.
His ex wife is lying when she said that Trump beat and raped her.
Maxwell was lying when she said that Trump ****ed underage women.

Everyone is lying except Trump. Only Trump can be believed.
Believe in Trump.

Each topic stands on its own. you have no case trying to lump them all together as one.

 

[What if...?]

We can imagine all types of scenarios. That does not make any of them fact.

I suggest you do not discount the idea that Epstein invited powerful people to a nice resort getaway that improved his chances to find something he could use for blackmail and extortion. It doesn't mean he entrapped everyone who was a regular in this "what if" scenario.

No it doesn’t.

But I think it would be naive to decide that nobody ever bragged to anybody, let anything slip. Got caught in the act.

It was a bunch of rich privileged people. And exclusive experiences reserved just for those that have their status are in their minds their right.

And as with any stimulating experience eventually it gets boring. We see this arc in pro athletes and entertainers all the time. As well as with the regular wealthy folks. They’ve been to all the exclusive resorts. Eaten at all the best restaurants. Been to all the fancy parties. Killed all the rare animals. You get the idea.

And eventually many get to the illegal or socially unacceptable. But really really don’t want people to find out. Adds to the excitement of forbidden fruit.

It seems disingenuous to wave away the idea that people knew but kept their mouths shut. Who would invite them to exclusive experiences if they blabbed about what went on there that people might not approve of?

The right has no problem ascribing depravity to the poor. But resist doing the same to the rich and powerful.

But both can be depraved and the rich can afford more extreme versions if depravity.

 

[What if...?]

Each topic stands on its own. you have no case trying to lump them all together as one.

Establishment of a pattern of behavior by listing examples of the behavior is perfectly reasonable.

Hell I’ve seen the fat sack lie a whole bunch of times with my own senses. Live.

 

[Lord of Planar]

No it doesn’t.

But I think it would be naive to decide that nobody ever bragged to anybody, let anything slip. Got caught in the act.

It was a bunch of rich privileged people. And exclusive experiences reserved just for those that have their status are in their minds their right.

And as with any stimulating experience eventually it gets boring. We see this arc in pro athletes and entertainers all the time. As well as with the regular wealthy folks. They’ve been to all the exclusive resorts. Eaten at all the best restaurants. Been to all the fancy parties. Killed all the rare animals. You get the idea.

And eventually many get to the illegal or socially unacceptable. But really really don’t want people to find out. Adds to the excitement of forbidden fruit.

It seems disingenuous to wave away the idea that people knew but kept their mouths shut. Who would invite them to exclusive experiences if they blabbed about what went on there that people might not approve of?

The right has no problem ascribing depravity to the poor. But resist doing the same to the rich and powerful.

But both can be depraved and the rich can afford more extreme versions if depravity.

I do not assume suspicions to be fact. That is all there is to it. Why can't you accept such logic?

 

[Lord of Planar]

Establishment of a pattern of behavior by listing examples of the behavior is perfectly reasonable.

Hell I’ve seen the fat sack lie a whole bunch of times with my own senses. Live.

Yes, president Trump is a liar. I have stated that myself several times.

So?

 

[What if...?]

I do not assume suspicions to be fact. That is all there is to it. Why can't you accept such logic?

I wouldn’t expect you to.

But failure to consider the validity of suspicions would lead to never investigating anything.

If a guy moves next door to you and paints all the windows black and gets a van with “Free Candy” spray painted on the side he may just be starting a new candy promotion company and doesn’t want the chocolate to melt in the sun.

But I think it might be prudent to keep an eye on him, don’t you?

 

[Lord of Planar]

I wouldn’t expect you to.

But failure to consider the validity of suspicions would lead to never investigating anything.

I consider the suspicions may be real. I am just not evil enough to propagate an allegation that could be invalid. Such aggregations can destroy innocent people's livelihood. Why do you want to be part of that evil?

If a guy moves next door to you and paints all the windows black and gets a van with “Free Candy” spray painted on the side he may just be starting a new candy promotion company and doesn’t want the chocolate to melt in the sun.

I would say this is a reasonable concern to watch for illegal activity. It is no reason however to ruin a person's life.

But I think it might be prudent to keep an eye on him, don’t you?

Yes. But to make allegations just from suspicions is the mark of a terrible person.

 

[HenryChinaski]

Each topic stands on its own. you have no case trying to lump them all together as one.

If a laundry list of people including family members, financial lenders, ex-spouses, work colleagues and highest ranking military generals have been saying the same things about one man for decades. it is wise to listen. Because it is not likely that it’s all for nothing.
It’s a warning that Donald Trump is a dangerous sociopath.

 

[What if...?]

I consider the suspicions may be real. I am just not evil enough to propagate an allegation that could be invalid. Such aggregations can destroy innocent people's livelihood. Why do you want to be part of that evil?

I would say this is a reasonable concern to watch for illegal activity. It is no reason however to ruin a person's life.

Yes. But to make allegations just from suspicions is the mark of a terrible person.

Well, I wouldn’t want to destroy innocent lives. But I would like to make those whose silence was acceptance suffer a bit.

There has to be a middle ground.

Letting it go without examination and outing of whoever did commit crimes, or complicity by silence seems like choosing the feelings of the perpetrators over the suffering of the victims. Maybe harming a couple who were oblivious would serve as a deterrent to those who were just silent when they knew damn well.