England gets serious...

[TU Curmudgeon]

If they are lying about where they came from that is one thing. But the OP mentioned lying about "covid status" which is different than lying about travel or point of origin. The latter is required apart from the epidemic. People for example traveling to the UK from Yemen or Somalia---- well, if they are lying about that, there is probably a reason other than a virus.

So then back to "lying about covid status". How does the state prove someone lied about exposure to a virus that half the people don't even know they have been exposed to or have had and then threaten a 10 year prison sentence on top of that? Where does the burden of proof then lay; with the state or the incidental traveler to the UK to guarantee they aren't infected? Because it says, 10 years in prison--- a harsh sentence, usually reserved for serious felonies and not such vagaries as some slippery health "status".

Because if you want to create an atmosphere where visitors to your country are less than honest and truthful for fear of being denied entry especially to work or immigrate to, then keep drumming up the idea that if they are being honest, then they will be flatly denied anyway, so why not chance lying?

Since the requirement is the production of a record of recent test, the lying would involve the production of a false record of recent test.

Obviously, the ONLY answers to the question "Have you been exposed to COVID-19 within the past _[fill in the blank]_ days?" are

1. "Yes."​

​

and​

​

2. "I don't know."​

​

and that is because the most common means of contracting COVID-19 is through the inhalation of airborne droplets and, unless you know for a fact that you were in contact with a person who had COVID-19 you have absolutely no idea whose expired air you were breathing and whether or not those people had COVID-19.

The "burden of proof" is satisfied by the production of an ACCEPTABLE certificate of recent testing. If there is no such acceptable certificate of recent testing, then the "burden of proof" is satisfied by being tested and having a negative result showing that you were not exposed to COVID-19.

Hey, it ain't rocket science.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Not to mention that the NHS did not set the UK's Covid 19 response, as that was done by the government. The NHS is responsible for vaccine distribution and providing it, something it has done well at

Yep

(More charts and graphs at Daily Statistical Summary of COVID-19)​

By the way, statistically the US has now tested 100.782% of its population while the UK has only tested 118.994% of its population, so you had better hurry up or else the US will stay ahead of the UK on testing just like it stays ahead of the UK on all metrics.

 

[Peter]

Another good reason not to visit Europe. That was prudent even prior Covid.

Considering how varied Europe is in both standard of living and culture this is a pretty stupid statement.
Europe has pretty much every lifestyle imaginable so I'm unsure how you could dislike an entire continent.
Saying you don't like the UK is fine but Germany or The Netherlands are completely different.

 

[Court Jester]

Since the requirement is the production of a record of recent test, the lying would involve the production of a false record of recent test.

Obviously, the ONLY answers to the question "Have you been exposed to COVID-19 within the past _[fill in the blank]_ days?" are

1. "Yes."​

​

and​

​

2. "I don't know."​

​

and that is because the most common means of contracting COVID-19 is through the inhalation of airborne droplets and, unless you know for a fact that you were in contact with a person who had COVID-19 you have absolutely no idea whose expired air you were breathing and whether or not those people had COVID-19.


Hey, it ain't rocket science.

The "I don't know" represents the vast majority of the global population. Not only in science, but effectively when answering any question about, "have you been in contact.... " etc. Therefore in order to satisfy a state mandated requirement for disclosure, 'I don't know' would be the default and preferred answer even if one does know. Works the same way that not talking to the police works in the USA, and of course I realize the UK is NOT the USA and is therefore not constrained by the same legal protections afforded to it's citizens or others within it's jurisdiction.

The "burden of proof" is satisfied by the production of an ACCEPTABLE certificate of recent testing. If there is no such acceptable certificate of recent testing, then the "burden of proof" is satisfied by being tested and having a negative result showing that you were not exposed to COVID-19.

But doesn't any lying in that regard, when you are talking talking about producing fraudulent documents (assuming a copy of a negative test result) just fall under the laws of document fraud, and therefore entirely different than trying to make it about "covid status" which is hard to determine anyway? The UK and the USA were testing members of government daily and the British PM as well as the POTUS came down with covid. So, please satisfy me that this new law in the UK can really do much more than make some people feel good--- or play to the politics around this pandemic.

Pretty much EVERYONE on the planet is or is likely to be exposed to covid; trying to screen it out by locking down travel only works in nations and societies which are able and willing to do that outside of this health crisis. Open international societies like the UK, France, US, and Canada are always going to have a harder go at this than other places----and still it gets in.

I just don't see trying to criminalize covid will work anymore than trying to criminalize AIDS worked. I'm all for enhanced border security and airport screening, but it only takes less than a dozen people with the infection to enter in to spread this disease in a community. And even with criminalizing covid, any error in testing (which happens all the time) will let in more infected people than those trying to game the travel restrictions.

Hey, it ain't rocket science.

Open democratic societies like ours have enough difficulty screening out terrorists and criminals, so not seeing how we can screen out all of the potentially infected people who may enter out nations. If I were prone to buying into conspiracy theories, I might just think there is some other motivation behind enhanced tracking and screening which has nothing to do with health related concerns, but that would be for another topic thread.

 

[Schrott]

Yes, conspiracy theories; just like your buddy 'Monica' and her lunatic theories about 'bio-engineered weapons' which those of us with rational brains recognise as a 'vaccine', financed by the evil George Soros in his quest for world domination.

You forgot Bill Gates and his micro chip.

 

[Schrott]

Considering how varied Europe is in both standard of living and culture this is a pretty stupid statement.
Europe has pretty much every lifestyle imaginable so I'm unsure how you could dislike an entire continent.
Saying you don't like the UK is fine but Germany or The Netherlands are completely different.

For that he has first to make the big step, leave his country.
Very scary, indeed

 

[ElChupacabra]

I'd love to see another confrontation between the heroic farmer, Michael Forbes, and his nemesis, Trump over the golf course in Scotland.
'I sussed him out from the start; my only regret is I didn't knock him on his arse when I met him'.
Scots have zero respect for Trump. I like Scots.

I still remember watching portions of Trump's appearance before the Scottish committee on wind farms and the laughter when he claimed "I am the evidence" when asked about how wind farms were going to impact the Scottish tourism industry.

 

[snakestretcher]

You forgot Bill Gates and his micro chip.

It looks even more sinister disguised as that 'badge'.

 

[Luther]

Hey Snake?

I'm reading in the papers that your economy is in shambles over there?

 

[Paradoxical]

Yes, conspiracy theories; just like your buddy 'Monica' and her lunatic theories about 'bio-engineered weapons' which those of us with rational brains recognise as a 'vaccine', financed by the evil George Soros in his quest for world domination.

How is Europe doing with their lock downs and masks? Economy doing well?

 

[snakestretcher]

How is Europe doing with their lock downs and masks? Economy doing well?

Economy? About as well as yours. As far as Covid is concerned, very well. Over one quarter of all adults now vaccinated, infection rates are tumbling and the R0 number (which you won't understand), has fallen below 1. Anything else you want to add?
Here, enjoy...

UKHSA data dashboard

Showing public health data across England

coronavirus.data.gov.uk

 

[Paradoxical]

Economy? About as well as yours. As far as Covid is concerned, very well. Over one quarter of all adults now vaccinated, infection rates are tumbling and the R0 number (which you won't understand), has fallen below 1. Anything else you want to add?
Here, enjoy...

UKHSA data dashboard

Showing public health data across England

coronavirus.data.gov.uk

I guess when everyone was already infected, your numbers have to go down right. As for deaths, it's like saying "We started out with a million old people and we now have 50,000 left but the number of daily deaths has gone way down now thanks to our leadership.

blob:https://mewe.com/6217b920-0e55-4ecf-9212-19403dfb3a7d

 

[bongsaway]

Imagine if we instituted that lifesaving measure here. We'd eventually have some fascist lunatic go on a rampage screaming about his FREEDUMBZ!

Knuckle draggers every single one of them. If their normal state of mind wasn't outrage maybe an actual fact or two might penetrate?

 

[Paradoxical]

Knuckle draggers every single one of them. If their normal state of mind wasn't outrage maybe an actual fact or two might penetrate?

As I told snake, when most of the population has already gotten and beaten COVID and/or died from it, the numbers will go down.

Librals are very bad at math and logic.

 

[Schrott]

How is Europe doing with their lock downs and masks? Economy doing well?

Better than the US

 

[snakestretcher]

I guess when everyone was already infected, your numbers have to go down right. As for deaths, it's like saying "We started out with a million old people and we now have 50,000 left but the number of daily deaths has gone way down now thanks to our leadership.

blob:https://mewe.com/6217b920-0e55-4ecf-9212-19403dfb3a7d

Well, seeing as not everyone was "already infected" you don't have a leg to stand on with that simplistic argument.

 

[it's just me]

If you lie about your Covid status when entering England from abroad you could face 10 year's jail. New arrivals must isolate in an approved hotel adjacent to the port of entry for 10 days and take two tests during that time, and pay £1750 per person for the cost of their accommodation and testing. This is good news and should have been done months ago; if only to deter those who don't actually need to travel here for the duration. Taking vacations abroad is already illegal.

Covid-19: 10-year jail term for travel lies defended

The British public expects "strong action", Grant Shapps says, amid criticism of the new penalty.

www.bbc.co.uk

Nobody wants yo go to England anyway.

 

[snakestretcher]

Nobody wants yo go to England anyway.

Nobody except the four million American tourists who spent $3.4 billion here in 2018?

UK Tourism Statistics 2025 - Latest Data

Everything you need to know about UK Tourism Statistics including inbound arrivals, spending, how much it contributes to the UK economy, jobs & more!

www.condorferries.co.uk

 

[it's just me]

Nobody except the four million American tourists who spent $3.4 billion here in 2018?

UK Tourism Statistics 2025 - Latest Data

Everything you need to know about UK Tourism Statistics including inbound arrivals, spending, how much it contributes to the UK economy, jobs & more!

www.condorferries.co.uk

There's no accounting for taste.

 

[Manc Skipper]

Nobody except the four million American tourists who spent $3.4 billion here in 2018?

UK Tourism Statistics 2025 - Latest Data

Everything you need to know about UK Tourism Statistics including inbound arrivals, spending, how much it contributes to the UK economy, jobs & more!

www.condorferries.co.uk

I think he meant nobody like him. Which is excellent.

 

[it's just me]

I think he meant nobody like him. Which is excellent.

I meant nobody with a brain.

 

[Paradoxical]

Better than the US

Prove it.

 

[Phys251]

The IJM Playbook

Step 1: Lie. For bonus points, make an easily correctable typo.

Nobody wants yo go to England anyway.

Step 2: Get called out on the lie.

Nobody except the four million American tourists who spent $3.4 billion here in 2018?

UK Tourism Statistics 2025 - Latest Data

Everything you need to know about UK Tourism Statistics including inbound arrivals, spending, how much it contributes to the UK economy, jobs & more!

www.condorferries.co.uk

Step 3: Instead of admitting the lie, throw out a childish insult.

There's no accounting for taste.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

 

[Paradoxical]

Well, seeing as not everyone was "already infected" you don't have a leg to stand on with that simplistic argument.

Uh huh, sure, right. Gotcha.

By the way, when do we call it a depression in your neck of the woods? When the economy is the worst it;s been in 400 years? As it is, it is "only" the worst in 300 years. You folks in soup lines there yet? GREAT lock down.

 

[Paradoxical]

The IJM Playbook

Step 1: Lie. For bonus points, make an easily correctable typo.



Step 2: Get called out on the lie.



Step 3: Instead of admitting the lie, throw out a childish insult.



Lather, rinse, repeat.

This poster is a master at catching typos and little else.