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Do You Want Higher Taxes?


Also, I don't want people to pay according to their ability ... I just don't see the point in taxing those who have no money to be taxed ... how is that going to help anything? I am looking at the big picture, taxing those who have nothing will only keep them in poverty ... what is your reasoning to taxing those who have nothing? what do we gain from it? what utility does it have?
 
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evanescence said:
The overwhelming majority of average people in both of these countries lives in poverty with a small percentage of people living in luxury. Ultimately, capitalism ends in some type of feudalism.
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I would have said UNBRIDLED capitalism, but I agree with you...
As long as the capitalists run the politicians and the politicians run the country, we are in trouble...

Our kids are grown, ages 38 and 40. I tell them to invest where they live, in their homes. Pay off ALL debt as soon as possible, don't incur any other debt. If you have debt other than a mortgage, you should not be investing in the stock market...
Like they say, gamble only with money you can afford to lose...
 

Please TurtleDude, don't assume you know what I am thinking unless I have said it .. that is very rude. If you want to know what I am thinking and why I see things the way I do, just ask me.

Secondly, as I posted above, please help me understand the utility in taxing those who have nothing? i.e. what good does it do?
 
I know a fellow like TD, his kids are parasites....they live off him. That is fine for now, but eventually he will pass and his kids will have to fend for themselves, or live on the public dole. Guess which is more likely....
 
Who is debating "true free market capitalism"? I'm not. And why did you mix "true" in with free market? And why then tack on capitalism too? Clearly I wrote about economic capitalism.

Similar to this:
Originally Posted by sangha
Private enterprise alone does not make a system capitalism
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Are you guys really arguing about "true free markets" not existing? The same is done with "True marxist states", or "true socialist regimes". It's absurd to argue about that sort of thing. Forgive me if I assumed that just couldn't be what you're debating.
 

Rightwingers just don't get it. They are blind to philosophies that reject their belief that the main issue is cost imposed on a person. What is really selfish is saying those who can afford more taxes (based on their belief that they are entitled to all that "extra money") have no duty to pay their fair share and stop stealing from others. They are far more selfish than anyone else because they want to impose massive costs on the middle class merely because they are more industrious than the rich are. They reject the entire concept of paying their fair share, so they claim that people should pay for what they use even though they can't even explain how that works
 
UtahBill said:
As long as the capitalists run the politicians and the politicians run the country, we are in trouble...
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OK. Let me ask you this Utah. If politicians had less power over us, i.e. were less able to "run our lives", would that not be a reasonable solution to your proposed problem?
Capitalist run politicians, but politicans can't effectively run our lives...problem solved? For that matter, why would they invest so much time and energy into controlling politicians if it didn't get them results anyway.

Consider the federal budget, can we cut that by 50% and still keep strong corporate regulation and enforcement, considering the largest budget items are not related to regulation and enforcement?
 
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Mach said:
Who is debating "true free market capitalism"? I'm not. And why did you mix "true" in with free market? And why then tack on capitalism too? Clearly I wrote about economic capitalism.
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The rightwingers in this thread. Their free market ideology is what they base their objections to a progressive tax on



The only ones who claim that these "true marxist" and "true socialist" states exist are the rightwingers who are pushing for a "true free market". And yes, their arguments are absurd

The most absurd was claiming that China and India were examples of a free market economy
 

Exactly, and the word "true" had to be added because these people arguing that China and India were free markets couldn't understand that while these were examples of economies that had qualities of the theory of a free market, these were indeed not examples of free markets in the truest sense of the theory.
 


So is your point that free markets operating under Communism work better than free markets operating under a Democracy?
 


The blood from a turnip plan. Balance the budget on the backs of the poor! Just the kind of plan we have come to expect from you! :sun
 
TurtleDude said:
yeah-the sad part is that some of them keep pretending they want it for the good of the nation rather than out of envy or to pander to the losers
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Again with this crap?

It's honestly hard for me to imagine that someone can survive living off of such stereotypical views. But I guess that's because I don't stereotype people.

I envy you nor anyone wealthy their wealth.

If these so-called "job creators" are creating jobs and doing good for America, why does the economy suck so much? If these current tax rates are so good for us, why does everything stink so much?

Cutting taxes didn't create jobs in 2001 or 2003, just as raising taxes in 1993 didn't kill jobs as we were told.

The only thing that can create jobs is demand for products and services. The rich clearly aren't spending enough of their money right now - and there's a reason for that. There is only so much a person CAN spend.

A hedge fund manager making $1 Billion a year has a much smaller stimulative impact on our economy than the 200 families making $50,000 a year do.

This whole argument is about making this nation work its best for the most people - instead of simply looking out for approximately 1% of the country.
 

So whenever a politician suggests government should create jobs, call bull****. Government doesn't create jobs.

This whole argument is about making this nation work its best for the most people - instead of simply looking out for approximately 1% of the country.
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Consumers look out for the 1% by buying from their corporations and electing the puppet-type leaders.
 
Catawba said:
The blood from a turnip plan. Balance the budget on the backs of the poor! Just the kind of plan we have come to expect from you! :sun
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some gaping stupidity in that post. You fail to grasp two concepts

1) many of those not paying any federal income taxes are not poor

2) allowing people to continue to demand more and more government without making them pay anything for that only leads to more and more government and more and more spending
 
TurtleDude said:
some gaping stupidity in that post.
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From your perspective that the working class are parasites, I can see how you reach that delusion.

You fail to grasp two concepts

1) many of those not paying any federal income taxes are not poor
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That is being looked at by both sides in the tax reform discussions.

2) allowing people to continue to demand more and more government without making them pay anything for that only leads to more and more government and more and more spending
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We are in agreement there, if the rich had not received tax breaks for the last 3 decades we would not have spent near as much. Our unfunded ME wars are the biggest examples of that wasteful spending. Who ever heard of cutting peoples taxes with 2 decade long wars?
 

that last comment is really stupid. you cannot prove it and your constant rants about the rich are pathetic

the "war on poverty" has cost billions more than any real war since that nonsense started and all it has done is created millions of dependent addicts
 

1) many of those not paying any FIT are Fortune 500 corporations
2) allowing the rich to demand more and more government without making them pay anything for that only leads to increased deficits and debt, and lower job creation
 

that last comment is really stupid. you cannot prove it and your constant rants about the middle class are pathetic

the "war on poverty" has cost trillions less than real war since that nonsense started and all it has lifted millions out of poverty
 
during the hubub over the possible Federal govt. shutdown, ABC News pointed out that the Tea-Party plan to reduce the deficit did NOT include any cuts in farm-subsidies, much of which goes to wealthy agro-businesses, and even wealthy GOP farmers in Congress.

lovely how that works, right?

these Conservatives want to cut Medicaid and Medicare, but don't you DARE touch their farm subsidies!!!!!

 

Your post is either the product of ignorance or willful blindness. This board teems with people who are whining about the rich and whether you want to call it envy, class hatred or just butt hurt boo hoo whining because they are mad others are rich and they are not, its the same thing

here are some recent examples (in addition to Haymarket's malignant hatred of the rich contained in the signature quote)


The Ebenezer Scrooge depiction


Here we have the paranoid populist rant


Blame the rich for millions losing jobs

sangha said:
Rightwingers believe that the economy is doing fine, even if millions have lost their jobs. Just as long as the rich keeping making money.
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whining about the rich making money

Paschendale said:
What you call "wealth redistribution", we call "undoing the systematic abuse and oppression." Wealth is redistributed in a pure capitalist society, too. It's just only redistributed to the rich from the poor.
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the if You are rich you exploited someone nonsense


here is a good one-an implied threat of violent looting of the wealthy



some populist ranting at the financial sector


UtahBill said:
success? like Bernie Madoff? and all the other criminals/leeches on Wall Street?
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TurtleDude said:
..This board teems with people who are whining about the rich and whether you want to call it envy, class hatred or just butt hurt boo hoo whining because they are mad others are rich and they are not, its the same thing..
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what about the supposed rich-folks who whine about paying an additional.....OMG....3% in income taxes?
 

You didn't include me in your listing of patriots above, I'm hurt. :sun
 
Thunder said:
what about the supposed rich-folks who whine about paying an additional.....OMG....3% in income taxes?
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If the rich have to pay a little more, the earth will stop turning on its axis, half the world population will die off, and the GOP will blame the democrats for all of it.
Funny how we have the LOWEST tax rates ever and the unemployment rate is still too high...
But cutting taxes creates jobs, right? Seems like some oxymorons are at work here...
 

Well, that's pretty understandable

Anti-socialist Bachmann got $250K in federal farm subsidies - On Congress - POLITICO.com
 
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