• Please read the Announcement concerning missing posts from 10/8/25-10/15/25.
  • This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Did the Hamas break the truce?

Are the Hamas the ones who took over Gaza by force?
Are they not the controlling government in Gaza? (if you can call it that).

Since it took over it became responsible for everything that takes place within its area. Period.

They won the majority of seats in the election. Democratically (the views we all uphold so vigorously), they are the elected political power of the government of Gaza.

Imposing a blockade on Gaza for Hamas coming into power IS collective punishment. It IS an act of war. Israel instigated the current problem.

And those who do things independently, without recognition from the State (Hamas in this case), should be tried as criminals. Israel has a right to investigate and extradite such said criminals.
 
They won the majority of seats in the election. Democratically (the views we all uphold so vigorously), they are the elected political power of the government of Gaza.

Imposing a blockade on Gaza for Hamas coming into power IS collective punishment. It IS an act of war. Israel instigated the current problem.

And those who do things independently, without recognition from the State (Hamas in this case), should be tried as criminals. Israel has a right to investigate and extradite such said criminals.

Yes they did win seats which they lost after their violent take over in Gaza.
And whey did Israel start the blockade?
Maybe it had something to do with the Hamas rolling into Gaza after Israel turned the area over to Abbas, declaring an Islamic victory against the Jewish and started firing rockets into Israel.
 
Yes they did win seats which they lost after their violent take over in Gaza.
And whey did Israel start the blockade?
Maybe it had something to do with the Hamas rolling into Gaza after Israel turned the area over to Abbas, declaring an Islamic victory against the Jewish and started firing rockets into Israel.

Where did they lose?
Abbas didn't have the power to dissolve the unity between Hamas and Fatah that formed in 07. He did stage a coup though.

What right does Israel have to blockade a land that it 'formally withdrew' from?

Self-defense is not collective punishment.
 
Where did they lose?
Abbas didn't have the power to dissolve the unity between Hamas and Fatah that formed in 07. He did stage a coup though.

What right does Israel have to blockade a land that it 'formally withdrew' from?

Self-defense is not collective punishment.

Abbas is the president of the palastaine government.
He had the right and the power to take the seats away from the Hamas after they stormed into Gaza.
Remember he tried his to negotiate with hamas, they wanted nothing to do with peace.

They have the right to build a blockade when people fire on its citizens from the area.

This seems to be the new catch phrase now "collective punishment".
 
Israel cannot invoke the powers of Article 51 if it is in violation of that same Article.

Furthermore...




Any nation that says its protecting itself from violent aggression that it instigates, SHOULD be seen guilty from the international viewpoint. It places its own country at threat for its hostile actions.

The United States is falling off the world power position. The US is so in debt to the PRC that it's mildly disgusting. Not to mention the country shunned itself with its impeding position that it's the world police power. The country's lifestyle and thirst for a useless 'War on Terror' drove it to the state of depression they are facing now.

Wow.... are you Jimmy Carter in disguise?
 
Last edited:
Here's a good read from someone to has extensively covered the events in the Middle East for awhile.

Robert Fisk - Why do they hate the West so much, we will ask

So once again, Israel has opened the gates of hell to the Palestinians. Forty civilian refugees dead in a United Nations school, three more in another. Not bad for a night's work in Gaza by the army that believes in "purity of arms". But why should we be surprised?

Have we forgotten the 17,500 dead – almost all civilians, most of them children and women – in Israel's 1982 invasion of Lebanon; the 1,700 Palestinian civilian dead in the Sabra-Chatila massacre; the 1996 Qana massacre of 106 Lebanese civilian refugees, more than half of them children, at a UN base; the massacre of the Marwahin refugees who were ordered from their homes by the Israelis in 2006 then slaughtered by an Israeli helicopter crew; the 1,000 dead of that same 2006 bombardment and Lebanese invasion, almost all of them civilians?

What is amazing is that so many Western leaders, so many presidents and prime ministers and, I fear, so many editors and journalists, bought the old lie; that Israelis take such great care to avoid civilian casualties. "Israel makes every possible effort to avoid civilian casualties," yet another Israeli ambassador said only hours before the Gaza massacre. And every president and prime minister who repeated this mendacity as an excuse to avoid a ceasefire has the blood of last night's butchery on their hands. Had George Bush had the courage to demand an immediate ceasefire 48 hours earlier, those 40 civilians, the old and the women and children, would be alive.

What happened was not just shameful. It was a disgrace. Would war crime be too strong a description? For that is what we would call this atrocity if it had been committed by Hamas. So a war crime, I'm afraid, it was. After covering so many mass murders by the armies of the Middle East – by Syrian troops, by Iraqi troops, by Iranian troops, by Israeli troops – I suppose cynicism should be my reaction. But Israel claims it is fighting our war against "international terror". The Israelis claim they are fighting in Gaza for us, for our Western ideals, for our security, for our safety, by our standards. And so we are also complicit in the savagery now being visited upon Gaza.

I've reported the excuses the Israeli army has served up in the past for these outrages. Since they may well be reheated in the coming hours, here are some of them: that the Palestinians killed their own refugees, that the Palestinians dug up bodies from cemeteries and planted them in the ruins, that ultimately the Palestinians are to blame because they supported an armed faction, or because armed Palestinians deliberately used the innocent refugees as cover.

The Sabra and Chatila massacre was committed by Israel's right-wing Lebanese Phalangist allies while Israeli troops, as Israel's own commission of inquiry revealed, watched for 48 hours and did nothing. When Israel was blamed, Menachem Begin's government accused the world of a blood libel. After Israeli artillery had fired shells into the UN base at Qana in 1996, the Israelis claimed that Hizbollah gunmen were also sheltering in the base. It was a lie. The more than 1,000 dead of 2006 – a war started when Hizbollah captured two Israeli soldiers on the border – were simply dismissed as the responsibility of the Hizbollah. Israel claimed the bodies of children killed in a second Qana massacre may have been taken from a graveyard. It was another lie. The Marwahin massacre was never excused. The people of the village were ordered to flee, obeyed Israeli orders and were then attacked by an Israeli gunship. The refugees took their children and stood them around the truck in which they were travelling so that Israeli pilots would see they were innocents. Then the Israeli helicopter mowed them down at close range. Only two survived, by playing dead. Israel didn't even apologise.

Twelve years earlier, another Israeli helicopter attacked an ambulance carrying civilians from a neighbouring village – again after they were ordered to leave by Israel – and killed three children and two women. The Israelis claimed that a Hizbollah fighter was in the ambulance. It was untrue. I covered all these atrocities, I investigated them all, talked to the survivors. So did a number of my colleagues. Our fate, of course, was that most slanderous of libels: we were accused of being anti-Semitic.

And I write the following without the slightest doubt: we'll hear all these scandalous fabrications again. We'll have the Hamas-to-blame lie – heaven knows, there is enough to blame them for without adding this crime – and we may well have the bodies-from-the-cemetery lie and we'll almost certainly have the Hamas-was-in-the-UN-school lie and we will very definitely have the anti-Semitism lie. And our leaders will huff and puff and remind the world that Hamas originally broke the ceasefire. It didn't. Israel broke it, first on 4 November when its bombardment killed six Palestinians in Gaza and again on 17 November when another bombardment killed four more Palestinians.

Yes, Israelis deserve security. Twenty Israelis dead in 10 years around Gaza is a grim figure indeed. But 600 Palestinians dead in just over a week, thousands over the years since 1948 – when the Israeli massacre at Deir Yassin helped to kick-start the flight of Palestinians from that part of Palestine that was to become Israel – is on a quite different scale. This recalls not a normal Middle East bloodletting but an atrocity on the level of the Balkan wars of the 1990s. And of course, when an Arab bestirs himself with unrestrained fury and takes out his incendiary, blind anger on the West, we will say it has nothing to do with us. Why do they hate us, we will ask? But let us not say we do not know the answer.


pg-04-main-left-AP_110022t.jpg

A little girl Israel obviously thought was a Hamas militant.


1.) Palestinian children are in the line of fire because their parents and their terrorist government put them there.

2.) In war, the unforseeable occurs. This is part of war.... a war started by Hamas.

3.) I wish the Palestinians would pull their heads out of their asses and realize that Hamas is a paracite that needs to be removed.

4.) Propaganda pictures do not do anything but make people think you're a propagandist.

5.) Civilian casualties are sicking... especially when they turn out to be children. Ask yourself.... would there be any casualties if Hamas terrorists stopped attacking Isreal?
 
Last edited:
Yes, how'd you figure?

So does that make you Anaki...- wait, you seem more like a Cpt. Panaka :roll:

OT: Here's Israeli Spokesman Mark Regev admitting Israel broke the cease-fire:
YouTube - Israel admits No Hamas rockets were fired during ceasefire

That sounds more like an Australian journalist reporting what he thinks is the news.

Moreover, if there was a ceasefire and peace was in progress, why would Hamas be tunneling into Israel?

Doesn't it seem odd to you that Hamas would be digging tunnels?

The tunnels are a violation of the ceasefire agreement. Of course, you fail to mention that.

Hamas and Hezballah need to be destroyed. Egypt needs to be banned from arming Islamic militant groups.
 
That sounds more like an Australian journalist reporting what he thinks is the news.

Moreover, if there was a ceasefire and peace was in progress, why would Hamas be tunneling into Israel?

Doesn't it seem odd to you that Hamas would be digging tunnels?

The tunnels are a violation of the ceasefire agreement. Of course, you fail to mention that.

Hamas and Hezballah need to be destroyed. Egypt needs to be banned from arming Islamic militant groups.

Show me where any part of tunnels were even discussed in the cease-fire agreement. Links from 2006 mean crap.

The blockade was supposed to be eased by 20 percent in the first month and 30 percent in the second. There was only a 20 percent increase in supplies on the third month.

The fact that you think Egypt is arming Hamas and Hizbollah instead of Iran shows you know very little about that. Egypt and Israel have had a peace agreement for the last few years.
 
Show me where any part of tunnels were even discussed in the cease-fire agreement. Links from 2006 mean crap.

The blockade was supposed to be eased by 20 percent in the first month and 30 percent in the second. There was only a 20 percent increase in supplies on the third month.

The fact that you think Egypt is arming Hamas and Hizbollah instead of Iran shows you know very little about that. Egypt and Israel have had a peace agreement for the last few years.

:roll: Tunnels meant to kidnap Israeli soldiers/civilians is an aggressive act. Surely you don't intend to argue that it wasn't an aggressive act?
 
:roll: Tunnels meant to kidnap Israeli soldiers/civilians is an aggressive act. Surely you don't intend to argue that it wasn't an aggressive act?

You stated tunneling into Israel during the ceasefire, which never happened. It happened before the ceasefire.

During the ceasefire Israel went after tunnels used to smuggle arms through Egypt.

You mixed the two and claimed the first event happened twice.
 
Back
Top Bottom