Deported to a strange land

[ocean515]

If the US had a reasonable and well enforced immigration policy, they would not have come here illegally. If the Mexico gave them anything close to the opportunities that they enjoy in the USA, they wouldn't try to come here.

But, the sad fact of the matter is that the users of cheap labor who donate to both parties' election war chests don't want real immigration reform. Neither of the two major parties is willing to actually tackle the problem, preferring instead to rant about how it's the other guys' fault and proposing a preposterous boondoggle to build a "border fence", when all that is really needed is enforcement of the current laws along with a reasonable way that people from the impoverished hinterlands of Mexico could actually come here and work openly.

And now we want to punish the children of illegals who had no say in the matter of coming to the US, and that after having spent over a hundred grand each on their education. What a stupid policy, and what a waste. It's a matter of cutting off your nose to spite your face.

The parents made a decision to harm their children. The parents made a decision to forgo doing anything about their own country, and decided to harm their children by invading another country. It's absurd to blame immigration policy. Again, these children should be immediately deported. They should tell their parents to screw themselves, and they should get busy doing what is necessary to return to the US legally.

Illegals knew the consequences of their decision, and were too selfish to care about anyone but themselves. They knew this day could come, and now they are crying about it. Crying after exploiting and damaging the country they flipped the middle finger to long ago.

What we have now are failures demanding to be rewarded for the things they did to prove how empty they are as human beings. The only people who have cut off their nose are the illegal aliens who have harmed their own children.

 

[Dittohead not!]

The parents made a decision to harm their children. The parents made a decision to forgo doing anything about their own country, and decided to harm their children by invading another country. It's absurd to blame immigration policy. Again, these children should be immediately deported. They should tell their parents to screw themselves, and they should get busy doing what is necessary to return to the US legally.

Illegals knew the consequences of their decision, and were too selfish to care about anyone but themselves. They knew this day could come, and now they are crying about it. Crying after exploiting and damaging the country they flipped the middle finger to long ago.

What we have now are failures demanding to be rewarded for the things they did to prove how empty they are as human beings. The only people who have cut off their nose are the illegal aliens who have harmed their own children.

They are people who gave up what little they had and risked their lives to come to a country where they did not speak the language and did not understand the customs so that their children would have enough to eat and an opportunity to go to school. There was no legal way for them to enter the country, so they took the only route available. They worked hard, mostly in the fields harvesting crops in order to have money to live.

and you said they "harmed their children". How is that again?

 

[PoS]

What about me ? I was born in America, a 5th generation American and I find myself today living in "a strange land" that looks and sounds more like Mexico.

Illegally immigrating to Canada would be your best bet...

 

[ocean515]

They are people who gave up what little they had and risked their lives to come to a country where they did not speak the language and did not understand the customs so that their children would have enough to eat and an opportunity to go to school. There was no legal way for them to enter the country, so they took the only route available. They worked hard, mostly in the fields harvesting crops in order to have money to live.

and you said they "harmed their children". How is that again?

Who cares?

They aren't hero's. They are parasites who harmed their children, took jobs away from legal residents, harmed our schools, damaged our cities, threatened our highways, and caused billions to be spent on their care and support. In return, many of them fly the flags of the countries they abandoned, and demand their culture be rewarded.

These people knew exactly what they were doing. They knew they could be caught and deported at any time, and decided to take the gamble. Rather than do what their ancestors did, and come to the United States as legal migrant workers, leaving their families behind for parts of the year, they decided to exploit our hospitality and tell everyone who came here legally to go F themselves.

There is nothing heroic whatsoever about these people. They need to be removed.

BTW, as to the employers. First, E-Verify must be recognized as a legitimate method of checking legality. Next, any employer caught knowingly hiring illegal aliens should be jailed for a minimum of 1 year for each violation. The penalty should be a minimum of $10,000 per individual illegal alien hired. If necessary, their business should be confiscated, and all assets, including homes, etc. sold to settle the resulting debt. It doesn't matter if their families end up homeless, the penalty for hiring illegal aliens must be so painful it's not worth the risk

 

[Gathomas88]

What do we do about people like Angel who were brought to the US illegally as small children?



link

I've known people in the same position. Their English is American, their Spanish is limited, their knowledge of Mexico about the same as that of their American peers. Angel found work in Mexico, at a call center that had been outsourced from the US to Mexico.

Angel was featured on an episode of "This American Life" podcast. I listened to it while at the gym. Angel sounds just like most other Texans I've known.

This American Life episode.

What do you say, deport them anyway? Amnesty? Ignore them and hope they go away? send them to jobs in call centers in Mexico?

If he has children here, he should be allowed to stay.

 

[Dittohead not!]

Who cares?

They aren't hero's. They are parasites who harmed their children, took jobs away from legal residents, harmed our schools, damaged our cities, threatened our highways, and caused billions to be spent on their care and support. In return, many of them fly the flags of the countries they abandoned, and demand their culture be rewarded.

These people knew exactly what they were doing. They knew they could be caught and deported at any time, and decided to take the gamble. Rather than do what their ancestors did, and come to the United States as legal migrant workers, leaving their families behind for parts of the year, they decided to exploit our hospitality and tell everyone who came here legally to go F themselves.

There is nothing heroic whatsoever about these people. They need to be removed.

BTW, as to the employers. First, E-Verify must be recognized as a legitimate method of checking legality. Next, any employer caught knowingly hiring illegal aliens should be jailed for a minimum of 1 year for each violation. The penalty should be a minimum of $10,000 per individual illegal alien hired. If necessary, their business should be confiscated, and all assets, including homes, etc. sold to settle the resulting debt. It doesn't matter if their families end up homeless, the penalty for hiring illegal aliens must be so painful it's not worth the risk

If we did what your last paragraph suggests, then there would be very little illegal immigration, but it won't happen. If we were to deny illegals government services, there would be little illegal immigration, but that won't happen either.

If the people who have come here and succeeded against all of the odds could be allowed to return home and obtain legal status by passing a background check and showing that they have jobs in the US, then nearly all of the illegals would do so. If they were allowed to do that, then they wouldn't have to be living in the shadows and fearful of deportation.

But, that won't happen either.

The fact of the matter is that the employers like having a workforce willing to accept low wages and terrible conditions, and the only way they can do that is to hire illegals.
Since it is the employers, and not the workers, who have a voice$$ in Washington, nothing is likely to change.

So, do we blame the illegals, or do we blame the government? I say the latter.

 

[ocean515]

If we did what your last paragraph suggests, then there would be very little illegal immigration, but it won't happen. If we were to deny illegals government services, there would be little illegal immigration, but that won't happen either.

If the people who have come here and succeeded against all of the odds could be allowed to return home and obtain legal status by passing a background check and showing that they have jobs in the US, then nearly all of the illegals would do so. If they were allowed to do that, then they wouldn't have to be living in the shadows and fearful of deportation.

But, that won't happen either.

The fact of the matter is that the employers like having a workforce willing to accept low wages and terrible conditions, and the only way they can do that is to hire illegals.
Since it is the employers, and not the workers, who have a voice$$ in Washington, nothing is likely to change.

So, do we blame the illegals, or do we blame the government? I say the latter.

We blame the illegals, first and last.

The vision you are painting of the low wages and terrible conditions illegal aliens face is a fallacy. There are certainly jobs they take that most people wouldn't consider, but this darkened room, task master story is the extreme rare example. The norm is a typical labor oriented business, with pay scales well above minimum wage.

The vast majority of these business have become staffed by a workforce that exclusively speaks Spanish, and where nepotism is the norm. In these cases, non-Spanish speaking employees don't have a chance of being hired, because they can't communicate with anyone.

 

[Paxaeon]

Who cares? They aren't hero's. They are parasites who harmed their children, took jobs away from legal residents, harmed our schools, damaged our cities, threatened our highways, and caused billions to be spent on their care and support. In return, many of them fly the flags of the countries they abandoned, and demand their culture be rewarded. These people knew exactly what they were doing. They knew they could be caught and deported at any time, and decided to take the gamble. Rather than do what their ancestors did, and come to the United States as legal migrant workers, leaving their families behind for parts of the year, they decided to exploit our hospitality and tell everyone who came here legally to go F themselves. There is nothing heroic whatsoever about these people. They need to be removed. BTW, as to the employers. First, E-Verify must be recognized as a legitimate method of checking legality. Next, any employer caught knowingly hiring illegal aliens should be jailed for a minimum of 1 year for each violation. The penalty should be a minimum of $10,000 per individual illegal alien hired. If necessary, their business should be confiscated, and all assets, including homes, etc. sold to settle the resulting debt. It doesn't matter if their families end up homeless, the penalty for hiring illegal aliens must be so painful it's not worth the risk

A rather extremist narrative. Very chilling. To harbor that much animosity takes a toll on a person.

Consider this;

In law, offenses are separated by two basic principles; Malum in se (wrong or evil in itself) or Malum prohibitum (wrong because a law prohibits it).

Personally, while I may not like or agree with the status quo on this issue, I would defend the rights of any illegal to be treated in a lawful humane manner. Count me in as a person who would risk herself and family, by giving any illegal sanctuary whom will not be treated as prescribed and proscribed, by the US Constitution.

 

[Dittohead not!]

We blame the illegals, first and last.

The vision you are painting of the low wages and terrible conditions illegal aliens face is a fallacy. There are certainly jobs they take that most people wouldn't consider, but this darkened room, task master story is the extreme rare example. The norm is a typical labor oriented business, with pay scales well above minimum wage.

The vast majority of these business have become staffed by a workforce that exclusively speaks Spanish, and where nepotism is the norm. In these cases, non-Spanish speaking employees don't have a chance of being hired, because they can't communicate with anyone.

I'm not sure just where you live, but here you see them working in the fields under a hot sun. Yes, sometimes they make more than minimum wage, sometimes not. No one has to speak Spanish to get hired, as the boss speaks English. Oh, and Spanish speaking is not the same as illegal alien. Some of the illegals speak more English than Spanish, as noted back in the OP.

Further, if we had a Congress that was functional and was actually interested in doing what is best for the country, they would have put an end to illegal immigration a long time ago.

 

[Davo The Mavo]

They are people who gave up what little they had and risked their lives to come to a country where they did not speak the language and did not understand the customs so that their children would have enough to eat and an opportunity to go to school. There was no legal way for them to enter the country, so they took the only route available. They worked hard, mostly in the fields harvesting crops in order to have money to live.

and you said they "harmed their children". How is that again?

When I read the OP, I followed the links provided, but I could not find the reason why he was deported. The stories focused on the English speaking outsourced Call Centers in Mexico. In most case, aren't the majority of those being deported also involved in the criminal justice system? I live in Illinois, where they voted to give illegals drivers licenses. I don't see much deporting going on in my hometown unless these folks are criminals.

I'm not saying, I'm just saying, maybe he hurt his family by doing something illegal. And if so, does that change anything?

 

[ocean515]

A rather extremist narrative. Very chilling. To harbor that much animosity takes a toll on a person.

Consider this;

In law, offenses are separated by two basic principles; Malum in se (wrong or evil in itself) or Malum prohibitum (wrong because a law prohibits it).

Personally, while I may not like or agree with the status quo on this issue, I would defend the rights of any illegal to be treated in a lawful humane manner. Count me in as a person who would risk herself and family, by giving any illegal sanctuary whom will not be treated as prescribed and proscribed, by the US Constitution.

Good for you. What a saint to encumber others with a demand your conscious be cleansed with their money. As to laws, one would hope harboring criminals would lead to the proper fines and imprisonment.

As to animosity, my soul is clean. At no time have I suggested illegal aliens be treated unlawfully, or inhumanely.

On the other hand, I can't imagine the damage caused to ones soul by encouraging others to break the law, and harm their children.

 

[Dittohead not!]

When I read the OP, I followed the links provided, but I could not find the reason why he was deported. The stories focused on the English speaking outsourced Call Centers in Mexico. In most case, aren't the majority of those being deported also involved in the criminal justice system? I live in Illinois, where they voted to give illegals drivers licenses. I don't see much deporting going on in my hometown unless these folks are criminals.

I'm not saying, I'm just saying, maybe he hurt his family by doing something illegal. And if so, does that change anything?

It does not say why he was deported, other than that he was here illegally. That's all it takes to be deported. If he brought attention to himself by breaking another law, then one would think he would have been in a Mexican jail.

 

[Paxaeon]

Good for you. What a saint to encumber others with a demand your conscious be cleansed with their money. As to laws, one would hope harboring criminals would lead to the proper fines and imprisonment. As to animosity, my soul is clean. At no time have I suggested illegal aliens be treated unlawfully, or inhumanely. On the other hand, I can't imagine the damage caused to ones soul by encouraging others to break the law, and harm their children.

Whatever you say, my son.

 

[Davo The Mavo]

It does not say why he was deported, other than that he was here illegally. That's all it takes to be deported. If he brought attention to himself by breaking another law, then one would think he would have been in a Mexican jail.

Again, I can only go by what I see personally here in my sanctuary town. Illegals have licenses, they live among us, and seemingly, only get deported after being caught doing something illegal . . . usually more than one time. I'm not sure the Mexican authorities are going to throw someone in jail for shoplifting in Northern Illinois.

So again, I have to ask, does it change anything if he was deported for breaking the law?

 

[ocean515]

I'm not sure just where you live, but here you see them working in the fields under a hot sun. Yes, sometimes they make more than minimum wage, sometimes not. No one has to speak Spanish to get hired, as the boss speaks English. Oh, and Spanish speaking is not the same as illegal alien. Some of the illegals speak more English than Spanish, as noted back in the OP.

Further, if we had a Congress that was functional and was actually interested in doing what is best for the country, they would have put an end to illegal immigration a long time ago.

I live in Southern California, as indicated.

My experience is based on spending most of my adult lifetime in and around manufacturing and processing facilities throughout the United States and abroad.

Here in my own business it's a struggle to maintain English as the primary language on the shop floor. For example, when our Health Insurance carrier conducted meetings to explain new expanded coverage I put through, they wanted to do the whole meeting in Spanish. Now, what does that have to do with illegal aliens?

I have spent a mountain of money over the years to deal with legal vs. illegal employees. I know for a fact a percentage of the employees I have are illegal, although I can't prove it. It's just a numbers game.

I would rather create new products we could sell, or open up new markets everyone could benefit from, rather than spend so much money in my HR department chasing down people who lie and cheat their way into a job.

 

[ocean515]

Whatever you say, my son.

And to you little one.

 

[sawyerloggingon]

What do we do about people like Angel who were brought to the US illegally as small children?



link

I've known people in the same position. Their English is American, their Spanish is limited, their knowledge of Mexico about the same as that of their American peers. Angel found work in Mexico, at a call center that had been outsourced from the US to Mexico.

Angel was featured on an episode of "This American Life" podcast. I listened to it while at the gym. Angel sounds just like most other Texans I've known.

This American Life episode.

What do you say, deport them anyway? Amnesty? Ignore them and hope they go away? send them to jobs in call centers in Mexico?

This is what happens when you don't control your borders, things just mushroom. All we can do now is stop future problems like this by securing our border with Mexico.

 

[APACHERAT]

At this point amnesty is the only practical alternative. Consider that there are close to 20 millions illegals here. To handle this problem, according to the US constitution, they'd have to be arrested, housed, clothed, fed, transported and fairly adjudicated via the constitution. This would cost well over a trillion dollars and tax this country's infrastructure to it's limits. The heartache, pain and suffering for those involved, mainly Mexicans, would be tantamount to the "Trail of Tears" suffered by the native Americans.

The end does not justify the means.

If Obama was able to throw almost a trillion dollars down a rat hole with his stimulus package, what's another trillion dollars going to matter except this time we'll see some results. But it wouldn't cost a trillion dollars to enforce our immigration laws. Those numbers are probably the PLS (Party for Socialism and Liberation) numbers.

Our nation immigration policies aren't broken, it's just that we as a nation we refuse to enforce the immigration laws that are already are on the books.

Enforce the laws that already exist and the vast majority of the 20 million illegal aliens will deport themselves.

The Supreme Court has already ruled that illegal aliens don't have the same protections under the Constitution as citizens and legal immigrants.

President Eisenhower under "Operation Wetback" was able to deport one million illegal aliens. So it can be done.

America's immigration policies should be what's best for America. Not what's best for the immigrant.

 

[APACHERAT]

Illegally immigrating to Canada would be your best bet...

I don't like Canadian bacon. I prefer American style of bacon.

Canada is also flawed, no In n Out burgers and they don't have a Second Amendment and there are too many frogs :blah: living in Canada who refuse to speak English.

 

[Unitedwestand13]

I don't like Canadian bacon. I prefer American style of bacon.

Canada is also flawed, no In n Out burgers and they don't have a Second Amendment and there are too many frogs :blah: living in Canada who refuse to speak English.

Part of Canada, mainly quebec, used to be a French colonial possession. And without the French Acadians moving down to Louisiana we would not be blessed with Cajun cuisine.

 

[clownboy]

They are people who gave up what little they had and risked their lives to come to a country where they did not speak the language and did not understand the customs so that their children would have enough to eat and an opportunity to go to school. There was no legal way for them to enter the country, so they took the only route available. They worked hard, mostly in the fields harvesting crops in order to have money to live.

and you said they "harmed their children". How is that again?

Because they knew the day would come when they and the children would face deportation. They put their children through all that you listed knowing that they'd just be faced with it all again down the road.

 

[clownboy]

So, do we blame the illegals, or do we blame the government? I say the latter.

How about both? And the nonsense about employers is growing thin as an excuse for illegals. The government does indeed go after employers. The fines are not small and some have lost their businesses.

 

[clownboy]

A rather extremist narrative. Very chilling. To harbor that much animosity takes a toll on a person.

Consider this;

In law, offenses are separated by two basic principles; Malum in se (wrong or evil in itself) or Malum prohibitum (wrong because a law prohibits it).

Personally, while I may not like or agree with the status quo on this issue, I would defend the rights of any illegal to be treated in a lawful humane manner. Count me in as a person who would risk herself and family, by giving any illegal sanctuary whom will not be treated as prescribed and proscribed, by the US Constitution.

In this case the act of coming or staying here illegally is both Malum in se and Malum prohibitum. Giving sanctuary to an illegal is also breaking the law and should be prosecuted. I am not arguing for ill treatment of illegals, but rather their immediate deportation. We can't mistreat them if they're not here.

 

[APACHERAT]

Part of Canada, mainly quebec, used to be a French colonial possession. And without the French Acadians moving down to Louisiana we would not be blessed with Cajun cuisine.

I don't know about you Unitedwestand up there in northern Cali, but down here I have to venture into the "hood" to be blessed with Cajun cuisine. But the trip is worth it.

 

[1750Texan]

Deport them. They are not American citizens.

My bigger question is how did an individual who has no legitimate status in the US even get into a school system, graduate, get a driver's license, a marraige license, and a job to begin with?

You want them deported yet do not know that the US and many states afford them the right to do so. The US Supreme court ruled that all children have a right to attend school regardless of their immigration status.

The state of Texas [Rick Perry] allows illegal aliens that attended Texas high school to attend college.

The is no law restricting anyone to marry based on immigration status. In Texas, 7 years cohabitation and a couple is common law.

Many states allow illegal aliens to apply of drivers licences.


You want them gone..and milions have voted them benefits.