Dems urge Rove to resign & Bush to apologize

scottyz · Oct 30, 2005

WASHINGTON - The Senate Democratic leader said Sunday that presidential adviser Karl Rove should resign because of his role in exposing an undercover
CIA officer, and a veteran Republican senator said
President Bush needs "new blood" in his White House.

Rove has not been charged, but he continues to be investigated in the CIA leaks case that brought the indictment and resignation Friday of I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, an adviser to Bush and the top aide to Vice President
Dick Cheney.

Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid said he is disappointed that Bush and Cheney responded to the indictment by lauding Libby and suggested they should apologize for the leak that revealed the identity of covert CIA officer Valerie Plame.

"First of all, the vice president issues this very terse statement praising Libby for all the great things he's done," Reid said. "Then we have the president come on camera a few minutes later calling him Scooter and what a great patriot he is. There has not been an apology to the American people for this obvious problem in the White House," Reid, D-Nev., told ABC's "This Week."

Meanwhile, Sen. Chris Dodd, D-Conn., said Cheney should "come clean" about his involvement and why he discussed Plame with Libby before Libby spoke to reporters about her.

"What did the vice president know? What were his intentions?" Dodd asked on "Fox News Sunday."

"Now, there's no suggestion the vice president is guilty of any crime here whatsoever. But if our standard is just criminality, then we're never going to get to the bottom of this," Dodd said.

Public opinion appears to be running against Bush. Almost half the public, 46 percent, say the level of ethics and honesty in the federal government has fallen with Bush as president, according to an ABC News-Washington Post poll. That's three times the number who say ethics and honesty have risen during that time.

Republican Sen. Trent Lott (news, bio, voting record) of Mississippi said Bush should be on the lookout for "new blood, new energy, qualified staff, new people in administration." He said poor advice may have even contributed to the failed nomination of Harriet Miers to the Supreme Court.

Reid said Rove should resign or be fired for even discussing Plame. He recalled that Bush once said he would fire anyone involved in the leak, although Bush later amended that standard to say he would fire anyone convicted of a crime.

"If he's a man of his word, Rove should be history," Reid said on CNN's "Late Edition."

Sen. Arlen Specter (news, bio, voting record), R-Pa., said Rove has not been charged with any crime and that any talk of him stepping down is politically motivated.

"Senator Reid is entitled to his opinion, but he's not the president of the United States, and he doesn't administer justice in this country," Specter said.

Republican Sen. Lindsey Graham (news, bio, voting record) of South Carolina said there "absolutely" should be an internal White House investigation. But he said allegations of illegal activity appeared to be focused only on Libby.

"I think the likelihood of Karl Rove being indicted in the future is virtually zero," Graham said on CBS' "Face the Nation."

Sen. Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y., urged an internal investigation and that Bush, "if need be, take the vice president to the wood shed."

"The real question for President Bush is going to be: is he going to be like Nixon — hunker down, get into the bunker, admit no mistakes," Schumer said, "or like Reagan, who actually admitted mistakes, did a midcourse correction and brought in new people, bipartisan people, people above ethical reproach, into the White House."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051031/ap_on_go_pr_wh/cia_leak_investigation;_ylt=Ah3016czeMTC.bP1XWTFbAyWwvIE;_ylu=X3oDMTA4NGRzMjRtBHNlYwMxNjk5

I know he would never think of apologizing or firing Rove, but if he has any sense at all he will bring some fresh blood into the Whitehouse. Hopefully he would choose real conservatives rather than neo-cons this time around.

python416 · Oct 31, 2005

Bush should applogize and clean house and start again, as other every other second term president has had to do since I don't know when: Regean with Iran contra, Clinton with Monica.

But the problem here is that Bush's mistake is not a little tube scrub in the oval, or a foreign policy sideshow gone bad, but his mistake is at the core of everything he has potrayed his "war" presidency to stand for.

Combine that with the trademark arrogance, ignorance, stubborness, and stupidity that has been coming out of the WH post Afghanistan with the rush to Iraq, and you have a situation that really has no way out.

Bush can't applogize for the war! It is beyond is ability, and if he did he would lose the one thing that people still like about him - his resolve to stay the course (which could also be called his unrelenting stupidity and his ability to ignore the truth and stick to a lie like a fly on ****).

I can't wait to see what happens next.

Even though the Dems have been useless in the past 5 years, I think they have been playing things smart by letting Miers implode on her own and whatnot. But I don't like the current voices for the Dems in today's press. The Dems need strong spokes people now, and Pelosi and Ried are not it. Even though he talks too much, lets get at least a Joe Biden out there when it is time to have the message really resonate, of better if we got it. Obama would be good, even if he is a junior.

Stinger · Oct 31, 2005

scottyz said:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051031/ap_on_go_pr_wh/cia_leak_investigation;_ylt=Ah3016czeMTC.bP1XWTFbAyWwvIE;_ylu=X3oDMTA4NGRzMjRtBHNlYwMxNjk5

I know he would never think of apologizing or firing Rove, but if he has any sense at all he will bring some fresh blood into the Whitehouse. Hopefully he would choose real conservatives rather than neo-cons this time around.

:rofl I tell you what, when every Democrat who ever accused Rove of outting a covert agent appologizes, when Joe Wilson and his wife appologize for trying to feed the American people a phoney story about his trip and undermining American foriegn policy, when Chris Matthews and a host of other leftest commentators who had Rove in jail appoligize then maybe they may have the standing to demand someone else appologize. But then Rove has nothing to appologize for and Libby should be thanked for exposing the Wilson's and their little plot to feed the public false propaganda.

jamesrage · Oct 31, 2005

If the story was "republicans urge Rove to resign and Bush to apologize", the story would be something.So right now it looks like whine democrats having another partisan fit.It is like all the "Bush should resign" thread or the impeach Bush" thread,They are always done by liberals who despise republicans and conservatives.

Stinger · Nov 1, 2005

jamesrage said:
If the story was "republicans urge Rove to resign and Bush to apologize", the story would be something.

Which if course would be absurd. The only people would should be appologizing are the Wilson's a some news agencies who have misrepresented and out right lied during this whole minor affair.

So right now it looks like whine democrats having another partisan fit.It is like all the "Bush should resign" thread or the impeach Bush" thread,They are always done by liberals who despise republicans and conservatives.

Oh yea, Dean is playing his "little spoiled can't have my way child" role to a tee and people are simply going to shrug them off.

Let's not forget Wilson was spreading lies, Libby was spreading the truth.

jamesrage · Nov 1, 2005

Which if course would be absurd.

Absurd as it sounds, it would seem more credible of a concern if the republicans
urge Rove to resign and Bush to apologize.Right now it just sounds like the usual democrats hate republicans and republicans hate democrats nonsense.

aquapub · Nov 1, 2005

In WWII, the U.S. urged Japan that if they did not immediately and unconditionally surrender, they would face utter annihilation.

Japan did nothing. We nuked them.

Much like the Dems in THIS topic, it will not shock anyone that the enemy of those barking out requests for capitulation do not cooperate.

The only significant difference here is that Democrats have demonstrated how lacking public support is for their impotent hysteria, and how lacking it has been for years, election after election, and how they have nothing to nuke anyone with.

Stinger · Nov 1, 2005

jamesrage said:
Absurd as it sounds, it would seem more credible of a concern if the republicans
urge Rove to resign and Bush to apologize.Right now it just sounds like the usual democrats hate republicans and republicans hate democrats nonsense.

What on earth should they appologize for especially at the behest of other Republicans. As I said before the people who should be applogizing are those who accused Rove of breaking the law and those who lied to the American people about the Niger trip, the Wilson's.

FinnMacCool · Nov 1, 2005

What on earth should they appologize for especially at the behest of other Republicans. As I said before the people who should be applogizing are those who accused Rove of breaking the law and those who lied to the American people about the Niger trip, the Wilson's.

Haha yeah sure. Democrats apologize when Republicans are running scared?

scottyz · Nov 1, 2005

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Breaking with the White House and fellow conservatives, Republican Sen. Trent Lott (news, bio, voting record) and the head of the Cato Institute questioned on Tuesday whether top White House adviser Karl Rove, who remains in legal jeopardy in a
CIA-leak probe, should keep his policy-making job.

Lott of Mississippi and William Niskanen of the libertarian Cato Institute both echoed Democratic calls for a White House shake-up.

"He (Rove) has been very successful, very effective in the political arena. The question is, should he be the deputy chief of staff for policy under the current circumstances?" Lott told MSNBC's "Hardball."

"Most presidents in recent years have a political adviser in the White House. The question is, should they be, you know, making policy decisions. That's the question you've got to evaluate," the former Senate Republican leader added.

Lott went further than he did on Sunday, when he urged Bush to be on the lookout for "new blood, new energy, qualified staff."

Niskanen, who served as a top economic adviser to former President
Ronald Reagan, said, "Bush is going to have to sacrifice people who have worked with him to regain some initiative."

Niskanen said any White House shake-up should "start" with Rove because of his association with the leak case.

"He's provided good political judgment on campaigns, but not good political judgment on getting legislation through," Niskanen told Reuters.

So far, the White House has rebuffed calls for an overhaul in response to Libby's indictment. "Karl Rove continues to do his duties," White House spokesman Scott McClellan said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051102/pl_nm/bush_leak_dc

It at least sounds like a couple Republicans are suggesting Rove step down.

hipsterdufus · Nov 1, 2005

Stinger said:
when Chris Matthews and a host of other leftest commentators

Chris Mathews a leftist? You have to be kidding me.
I'm a leftist. I know leftists. Leftists are friends of mine...
Chris Mathews, he's no leftist.

By the way it's left - i - st

The guy drives me crazy with his uniformed, constant interrupting dribble.
I don't care if he worked for Carter or not. He's a no talent HACK.

FinnMacCool · Nov 2, 2005

Who is chris matthews? Every time I get into a debate with a conservative they bring him up but I dunno who he is

Stinger · Nov 2, 2005

hipsterdufus said:
Chris Mathews a leftist? You have to be kidding me.
I'm a leftist. I know leftists. Leftists are friends of mine...
Chris Mathews, he's no leftist.

The guy drives me crazy with his uniformed, constant interrupting dribble.
I don't care if he worked for Carter or not. He's a no talent HACK.

You don't know that he is a leftist.........sheeezzz

From MSNBC bio

"In addition, Matthews worked for 15 years as a print journalist, 13 of them as Washington Bureau Chief for The San Francisco Examiner (1987 – 2000), and two years as a national columnist for The San Francisco Chronicle, which was syndicated to 200 newspapers by United Media.

Matthews spent 15 years in politics and government, working in the White House for four years under President Jimmy Carter as a Presidential speechwriter and on the Government Reorganization Project, in the U.S. Senate for five years on the staffs of Senator Frank Moss (Utah) and Senator Edmund Muskie (Maine), and as the top aide for Speaker of the House Thomas P. “Tip” O’Neill, Jr. for six years."

scottyz · Nov 2, 2005

Chris Matthews also voted for Bush in 2000. Some leftist. :lol:

jamesrage · Nov 2, 2005

What on earth should they appologize for especially at the behest of other Republicans. As I said before the people who should be applogizing are those who accused Rove of breaking the law and those who lied to the American people about the Niger trip, the Wilson's.

All I am saying is that when Republicans start demanding those thing the democrats want then it will be a concern.Right now it is just Right Vs Left nonsense.I just find it odd that right after Carl Rove made his remarks about republicans being ready for war and liberals wanting to "prepare indictments and offer therapy and understanding for our attackers," that suddenly after refusing to appologize for those remarks he is being investigated for his reveal a CIA agents name.If any one can not see this as partison bickering they are blind.

debate_junkie · Nov 2, 2005

I don't get the brew haha... Rove hasn't been formally charged. Though I despise some of his actions, and that of this Administration, I can't see how some have Rove in an orange jump suit, sharing a cell with a guy named Bubba, before the Grand Jury has officially indicted him. I would be willing to bet, as would be the case with any other person of interest, Mr Fitzgerald has instructed Mr Rove to limit his whereabouts of travel, and to stay near (within hours) the DC area. What does Mr Bush need to apologize for, and why should Rove resign? Mr Libby did not resign, until formal charges were handed down by who... the Grand Jury. Mr Rove has the same right, and though I may despise some of his underhanded actions and tactics, that were within the law, unfortunately, I cannot say apologies need to be made until the orange jumpsuit is fit, and Bubba has been assigned a new cellmate. Any questions?

Hoot · Nov 2, 2005

None of this really matters, anyway...except for the fact that someone possibly committed treasonous activities, all for political revenge.

I'm sure if anything bad happens to Bush's 'good 'ol boys,' he will use the power of the Presidential pardon.

Stinger · Nov 3, 2005

scottyz said:
Chris Matthews also voted for Bush in 2000. Some leftist. :lol:

And old internet rumour from someone who "thinks" they heard him say it at the end of his show. I don't believe it for a second. He remains a hard core liberal and does not hide the fact.

Hoot · Nov 4, 2005

Stinger said:
And old internet rumour from someone who "thinks" they heard him say it at the end of his show. I don't believe it for a second. He remains a hard core liberal and does not hide the fact.

I wouldn't be too sure about that...during the Fl 2000 fiasco, Chris made statements that the decisions by the dem controlled FSC were politically motivated...(meaning not based on law).

That doesn't sound like a liberal to me?

Perhaps Mr Matthews just appears more liberal because, like most of the rest of America now, we realize Bush has gotten us into one hell of a mess?

hipsterdufus · Nov 4, 2005

Stinger said:
You don't know that he is a leftist.........sheeezzz

From MSNBC bio

"In addition, Matthews worked for 15 years as a print journalist, 13 of them as Washington Bureau Chief for The San Francisco Examiner (1987 – 2000), and two years as a national columnist for The San Francisco Chronicle, which was syndicated to 200 newspapers by United Media.

Matthews spent 15 years in politics and government, working in the White House for four years under President Jimmy Carter as a Presidential speechwriter and on the Government Reorganization Project, in the U.S. Senate for five years on the staffs of Senator Frank Moss (Utah) and Senator Edmund Muskie (Maine), and as the top aide for Speaker of the House Thomas P. “Tip” O’Neill, Jr. for six years."

Look - I know all that. I just listen to the man talk. He's about as left as cnredd.

cnredd · Nov 4, 2005

hipsterdufus said:
Look - I know all that. I just listen to the man talk. He's about as left as cnredd.

I can imagine it now..."Whiffleball with cnredd"...

"My guests tonight are Carmen Electra, Eva Longoria, and Jennifer Love Hewitt...

Ladies?...descibe your political beliefs...in these thongs...on my lap"...

scottyz · Nov 4, 2005

cnredd said:
I can imagine it now..."Whiffleball with cnredd"...

"My guests tonight are Carmen Electra, Eva Longoria, and Jennifer Love Hewitt...

Ladies?...descibe your political beliefs...in these thongs...on my lap"...

I'd watch that.

cnredd · Nov 5, 2005

scottyz said:
I'd watch that.

See?...We're not even in production yet and my ratings are up!...:2wave:

Stinger · Nov 7, 2005

Hoot said:
I wouldn't be too sure about that...during the Fl 2000 fiasco, Chris made statements that the decisions by the dem controlled FSC were politically motivated...(meaning not based on law).

That doesn't sound like a liberal to me?

Perhaps Mr Matthews just appears more liberal because, like most of the rest of America now, we realize Bush has gotten us into one hell of a mess?

No he's a liberal and always has breen and does not hide the fact. Why is it you try to paint him differently, do you think there is something inheriently bad about being a liberal?

Stinger · Nov 7, 2005

hipsterdufus said:
Look - I know all that. I just listen to the man talk. He's about as left as cnredd.

Then you don't listen very well. But please give us some examples of his conservative positions.

From one of the more popular sources around here

Chris Matthews
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Chris Matthews (1945–), politically liberal host of Hardball with Chris Matthews, known for his trademark "hardball" interruptions of his guests

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