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Democrats must move to the center

Do you agree?

  • yes, the center is where all the voters are

    Votes: 22 36.7%
  • No, we must move even more to the left

    Votes: 19 31.7%
  • Joe had it just right

    Votes: 19 31.7%

  • Total voters
    60
right now the middle class pay less of the tax burden than at any time in modern history. Sounds pretty progressive from me

I am not sure that is true at all. The top tax rate used to be quite a bit higher. When it was the national debt as a percentage of gross domestic product (GDP) steadily declined. It declined during the wars in Korea and Vietnam.

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-soi/02inpetr.pdf

 
I am not sure that is true at all. The top tax rate used to be quite a bit higher. When it was the national debt as a percentage of gross domestic product (GDP) steadily declined. It declined during the wars in Korea and Vietnam.

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-soi/02inpetr.pdf

you confuse tax rate with percentages of the FIT burden.
 
How about the conservatives. Will they be able to move to the center.

The US is a Center-Right country.
You are demanding that the entire nation move to what you incorrectly believe is center, but which is actually more left than the rest of the nation?
Just so you can 'have your way'?
 
Oh and FYI, RE: the asinine notion that Blue Dog/centrist/conserva Dems are the way forward:


The democrats should absolutely run total Antifa types for all of those seats next year and just rack up the easy wins
 
you confuse tax rate with percentages of the FIT burden.

What matters is that when the top tax rate was much higher the national debt as a percentage of gross domestic product (GDP) steadily declined.
 
The democrats should absolutely run total Antifa types for all of those seats next year and just rack up the easy wins

Ah yes, that is clearly the logical takeaway.

I'm sure you imagine AOC and progressives more broadly are fundamentally indistinguishable from Antifa as well.
 
Ah yes, that is clearly the logical takeaway.

I'm sure you imagine AOC and progressives more broadly are fundamentally indistinguishable from Antifa as well.

AOC specifically is, shes a loser just like them who happened to luck into a house seat in a district that votes on racial greivence.
 
The US is a Center-Right country.
You are demanding that the entire nation move to what you incorrectly believe is center, but which is actually more left than the rest of the nation?
Just so you can 'have your way'?
Huh?
 
AOC specifically is, shes a loser just like them who happened to luck into a house seat in a district that votes on racial greivence.

Yeah, given her multiple overwhelming wins against well-bankrolled opponents and establishment darlings and in general star power that Pelosi could only begin to dream of, I wouldn't quite call that luck.

Also last I checked I didn't see AOC rioting or approving of riots.
 
His social policies, particularly with regards to things like public educational curriculum, were at least partially responsible for making Millennials into the absolute, dysfunctional trainwrecks they are today.

He basically let all the old 1960s radicals have their way with the place.
How so specifically? I don't remember as much of the 90s as I used to.
 
Oh and FYI, RE: the asinine notion that Blue Dog/centrist/conserva Dems are the way forward:


Wouldn't that just reflect that Dems in moderate districts are going to get a smaller share of the vote than Dems in safe Dem districts (where the candidates have to move farther left to win)?
 
Wouldn't that just reflect that Dems in moderate districts are going to get a smaller share of the vote than Dems in safe Dem districts (where the candidates have to move farther left to win)?

Note that he was talking about vulnerable ridings specifically.
 
Yes, the US remains a Center-Right country:
1604809146337.webp

So why are you expecting that Republicans to make up the ground between them and the left, when it's the left that has veered way off into extreme positions?
The left needs to come back more to the center from their extremist left positions, clearly.
 
Yes, the US remains a Center-Right country:


So why are you expecting that Republicans to make up the ground between them and the left, when it's the left that has veered way off into extreme positions?
The left needs to come back more to the center from their extremist left positions, clearly.
The right is pretty extreme as well. The right has plenty of work to do to get back to the center right. And as far as the left is concerned. Over 1/2 of the Americans voted for a center left democrat. We know where the left stands. The right stands with the far right and trump
 
The US is a Center-Right country.
You are demanding that the entire nation move to what you incorrectly believe is center, but which is actually more left than the rest of the nation?
Just so you can 'have your way'?
Guess what? Progress happens. You're seeing it. Cops aren't getting away with killing people quite as easily after George Floyd was murdered on video, being one example.

Social changes have progressed. You've already lost the 'culture war.' You're free to believe what you want, but your type is losing the heavy-handed control. We aren't playing those games anymore.

Human rights are key, not profits and whatever your idea of center-right is.

The environment doesn't care that you think the 'country' is center-right. The days of blindly extracting resources, exploiting people, and destroying life on Earth are coming to an end, one way or another. There is no choice. There is no, "But the ~free market" rambling at the table. Times have changed, and bad things are happening. The honest and smart people are doing what they can to try to save us from the worst of it, but the chances are unknown because we've never been in this situation before. We're not going to risk everything so you can feel comfortable with your outdated worldview and principles. It's time for everyone to start adapting to whatever changes are coming.
 
The right is pretty extreme as well. The right has plenty of work to do to get back to the center right. And as far as the left is concerned. Over 1/2 of the Americans voted for a center left democrat. We know where the left stands. The right stands with the far right and trump
"Over 1/2 of the Americans voted for a center left democrat"
True. Based on the largely leftist media political propaganda they've been fed since mid-2016.
 
"Over 1/2 of the Americans voted for a center left democrat"
True. Based on the largely leftist media political propaganda they've been fed since mid-2016.
So you don’t believe Biden is center left?
 
Guess what? Progress happens. You're seeing it. Cops aren't getting away with killing people quite as easily after George Floyd was murdered on video, being one example.

Social changes have progressed. You've already lost the 'culture war.' You're free to believe what you want, but your type is losing the heavy-handed control. We aren't playing those games anymore.

You call local governments encouraging (through their lack of maintaining law and order) the destruction of largely minority neighborhood and businesses 'progress'? That's a rather odd definition of 'progress'.

Human rights are key, not profits and whatever your idea of center-right is.

The environment doesn't care that you think the 'country' is center-right. The days of blindly extracting resources, exploiting people, and destroying life on Earth are coming to an end, one way or another. There is no choice. There is no, "But the ~free market" rambling at the table. Times have changed, and bad things are happening. The honest and smart people are doing what they can to try to save us from the worst of it, but the chances are unknown because we've never been in this situation before. We're not going to risk everything so you can feel comfortable with your outdated worldview and principles. It's time for everyone to start adapting to whatever changes are coming.
Those 'bad things are happening' are at the instigation of the left.

Nov 6, 2019 — But one district attorney race on the banks of Lake Ontario has become an unlikely big-money referendum on traditional law-and-order ...​
May 23, 2018 — In most district attorney elections, the campaign playbook is clear: Win over the local cops and talk tough on crime. But in California this year, ...​
That campaign was one of more than a dozen District Attorney campaigns ... poured in huge sums of money at the last minute to elect candidates sharing his ... is in the crosshairs of Soros funded campaigns that target District Attorney races in ...​
Aug 20, 2020 — District Attorney Larry Krasner won the office in 2017 running on his ... In that campaign, Mr. Soros' Pennsylvania Justice and Public Safety PAC ... did not receive money directly from one of Mr. Soros' multiple state PACs, ...​
 

And what do these 'made to order' DAs do?

Multnomah County DA declines to prosecute 70% of Portland ...
www.oregonlive.com › news › 2020/10 › multnomah-c...

Oct 7, 2020 — Multnomah County DA declines to prosecute 70% of Portland protest cases · Prosecutors actually have dropped even more cases than the ...

Multnomah Co. DA's office won't prosecute many arrested in ...
www.oregonlive.com › portland › 2020/08 › multnom...

Aug 11, 2020 — Multnomah County District Attorney Mike Schmidt announced on Tuesday that his office will not prosecute many protesters who have been ...

Manhattan District Attorney Will Not Prosecute Protest Arrests
www.thedailybeast.com › manhattan-district-attorney-w...

BRYAN R. SMITH/AFP via Getty Images. Residents arrested in New York City for low level offenses while protesting the death of George Floyd will not be ...

What do Democrats do?
Kamala Harris tweeted support for a bail fund, but the money didn’t just assist protesters
Until the killing of George Floyd in police custody, the Minnesota Freedom Fund (MFF) was a relatively small vehicle for assisting people who needed cash for bail.

MFF’s 2018 tax filing shows it raised only about $100,000 that year. Just weeks after Floyd’s death, it raised an astonishing $35 million, in part because of tweets such as the one by Harris, who is now the Democratic vice-presidential nominee. That influx has put a strain on an organization that at the time had only one full-time staff member.

Enable yet more criminality inflicted on minority neighborhood.

They destroy civil society. Yeah, there's your so called 'progress', which is actually regressive, and a political poly for leftist to gain political power using 'useful idiots'. History repeats itself because the left has not learned it's lessons.
 
And what do these 'made to order' DAs do?

Multnomah County DA declines to prosecute 70% of Portland ...
www.oregonlive.com › news › 2020/10 › multnomah-c...

Oct 7, 2020 — Multnomah County DA declines to prosecute 70% of Portland protest cases · Prosecutors actually have dropped even more cases than the ...

Multnomah Co. DA's office won't prosecute many arrested in ...
www.oregonlive.com › portland › 2020/08 › multnom...

Aug 11, 2020 — Multnomah County District Attorney Mike Schmidt announced on Tuesday that his office will not prosecute many protesters who have been ...

Manhattan District Attorney Will Not Prosecute Protest Arrests
www.thedailybeast.com › manhattan-district-attorney-w...

BRYAN R. SMITH/AFP via Getty Images. Residents arrested in New York City for low level offenses while protesting the death of George Floyd will not be ...

What do Democrats do?


Enable yet more criminality inflicted on minority neighborhood.

They destroy civil society. Yeah, there's your so called 'progress', which is actually regressive, and a political poly for leftist to gain political power using 'useful idiots'. History repeats itself because the left has not learned it's lessons.
I'm not talking about the protests and the riots. I've seen other right-wing ~law and order~ people point to Portland and say, "Gosh, they're so uncivilized." It'd take many centuries, power, and immorality to come anywhere close to the brutality the West has done and continues to do to the otherized peoples of the world.
 
As far as the science being settled, once it was 'settled' science that the Sun circled the Earth. I suspect that there'll be more scientific data collection surrounding COVID, which may, or may not, invalidate previous assumptions.

My mentioning the adulting is that each adult needs to assess their risk exposure for themselves. There's little need for government to take those decisions away from those being responsible. So in Michigan, the EO came out, that all restaurants will have to collect contact information from all their dine-in patrons.

There have been a number of times where a government has demanded of its citizens to report on other citizens, and it has never turned out well for those citizens.

Many here in Michigan are of the same mind, either refusing to dine-in or providing false information. The result is just yet more pressure on restaurants already under pressure, leading to more failing and going bankrupt. Each of those restaurants needs to be considered as a small business, so the impact on small businesses is pretty clear.

There's a balance that needs to be struck, btu doesn't appear to be being stuck very well very often. Pretty sure that a close examination of the COVID data collected would lead to making some balanced decisions as to which public policies are effective and which are not, and do so keeping the economic impact in mind as well.

Not an easy proposition, to be sure, but needs to be done none the less. How many Governors are actually going through such a decision making process? No one seems to really know, as all we really have to go on are the EOs which are issued.
Well first ..it wasn't settled science that the sun circled the earth. That notion was based on religious faith and was counter to scientific knowledge.
However its an interesting notion. So would you today say that the earth revolving around the sun was settled science...or would you contend that its not ?
As far as contact information?
Dude ..what do you think you are giving them when you hand them a credit card? You give them access to your credit..
But..you don't want the restaurant to have your contact information..so if someone in the restaurant staff gets covid and you could have been exposed.. you can be notified so you can protect your family?
You don't realize that such tactics are meant to keep restaurants open.
 
You call local governments encouraging (through their lack of maintaining law and order) the destruction of largely minority neighborhood and businesses 'progress'? That's a rather odd definition of 'progress'.


Those 'bad things are happening' are at the instigation of the left.
Soros! Soros! Soros! I'm not going to bother. You don't control the narrative nor the world.

The bad things that are happening I'm talking about are related to the collapse of the habitability of the planet. Covid-19 is said to be a preview. We can't destroy nature and expect there to be no consequences, just as you can't have your knee on people's neck and expect there to be no consequences.
 
Well first ..it wasn't settled science that the sun circled the earth. That notion was based on religious faith and was counter to scientific knowledge.

Well, no, it was the 'science' that was prevalent and accepted at the time, by the standards and measures that were used at the time. It was just as much 'settled science' in their minds as it is in our minds that the Earth is orbiting the Sun.

However its an interesting notion. So would you today say that the earth revolving around the sun was settled science...or would you contend that its not ?

I don't believe that science is ever 'settled'. What I will say is that all the data and observations that have been collected to this point strongly suggest that the Earth is orbiting the Sun. Who knows? When the James Webb space telescope is launched and in space, it may detect data which would contradict this theory.

As far as contact information?
Dude ..what do you think you are giving them when you hand them a credit card? You give them access to your credit..
But..you don't want the restaurant to have your contact information..so if someone in the restaurant staff gets covid and you could have been exposed.. you can be notified so you can protect your family?
You don't realize that such tactics are meant to keep restaurants open.
I am strongly opposed to citizens reporting on other citizens at the demand of the government. Surely you know enough from history what that leads to. Next thing you'll know the government will demand to know what food you ordered, so that if it isn't what they think you should eat they can hike your health insurance premiums or something. No, the government should know as little about people and their lives as possible, let people live their lives as they wish. And, yes, with a 30 year career in IT I know all about data mining.

I am risk mitigating. I don't go to indoor sit down restaurants. Didn't really before COVID either, I think I've gone to an outdoor one for breakfast once. I hate crowds, which is why you wouldn't catch me at a political rally either. But each adult should permitted to make their own decisions on this and their lives, just the same as they are the ones who are going to have to suffer the consequences from those decisions.

The government's purpose is most certainly not to run people's lives for them.
 
You call local governments encouraging (through their lack of maintaining law and order) the destruction of largely minority neighborhood and businesses 'progress'? That's a rather odd definition of 'progress'.


Those 'bad things are happening' are at the instigation of the left.

Nov 6, 2019 — But one district attorney race on the banks of Lake Ontario has become an unlikely big-money referendum on traditional law-and-order ...​
May 23, 2018 — In most district attorney elections, the campaign playbook is clear: Win over the local cops and talk tough on crime. But in California this year, ...​
That campaign was one of more than a dozen District Attorney campaigns ... poured in huge sums of money at the last minute to elect candidates sharing his ... is in the crosshairs of Soros funded campaigns that target District Attorney races in ...​
Aug 20, 2020 — District Attorney Larry Krasner won the office in 2017 running on his ... In that campaign, Mr. Soros' Pennsylvania Justice and Public Safety PAC ... did not receive money directly from one of Mr. Soros' multiple state PACs, ...​
Gee, if only the right had some billionaires to donate to them.
 
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